Is "faith" a requirement under McD?

[Tyrod's friend]

7 minutes ago, Dr. K said:

I cannot tolerate it in someone who is trying to abridge my freedom and force their religious views into civil society. McDermott seems to me to be pretty harmless, though he clearly is an evangelical who believes the hand of God is everywhere present in his life. 

I think this is 100% right. What's more, I enthusiastically support anyone's ability to bring God or lack of God into their working world. 

In my personal life, I've said that there is more faith to be found on one rug facing Mecca at noon anywhere in America than all the churches on Easter Sunday in Georgia. 

No one is forcing anything on anyone. Testifying to your faith can be as simple as stating it. You are free to ignore it. If it threatens you, if it makes you think, well, welcome to America.

1 minute ago, ddaryl said:

 

 

I'm lost here.

 

Its a personal journey.. One that should never intersect with employment simply based upon the fact that we all have this seperate personal relationship, and a person should never be denied an opportunity because they didn't chose a specific religion. Your personal journey is personal. I don't think anyone should judge anyone, or should deny anyone anything based upon a [[ersonal belief...

 

If a qualified person is being denied an opportunity simply based upon what religion they subscribe to then I have very large issues with this, and a line has been crossed.

 

So the originsal topic is McDermott only bringing in players who meet his religous criteria. This is how i interpreted the original post and If this is the case then I would not be ok with it, because its is simply uncalled for and it shows an intolerance to others

There is a vast ocean between making it a personal journey, and feeling so afraid of your personal journey that you fear sharing it. 

Sharing can be part of the clubhouse experience and especially the McDermott clubhouse. I think we're all aware of his team building experiences last year before the season began. Having faith, in any thing, by it's nature suggests that you are putting yourself second. 

It is the very essence of team. It has nothing, whatsoever, to do with religion. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

5 minutes ago, ddaryl said:

Its a personal journey.. One that should never intersect with employment simply based upon the fact that we all have this seperate personal relationship, and a person should never be denied an opportunity because they didn't chose a specific religion. Your personal journey is personal. I don't think anyone should judge anyone, or should deny anyone anything based upon a [[ersonal belief...

 

If a qualified person is being denied an opportunity simply based upon what religion they subscribe to then I have very large issues with this, and a line has been crossed.

 

So the originsal topic is McDermott only bringing in players who meet his religous criteria. This is how i interpreted the original post and If this is the case then I would not be ok with it, because its is simply uncalled for and it shows an intolerance to others

 

Agreed.  And I sincerely doubt this is happening.

 

On the other hand, if he's looking for certain criteria such as selflessness, willingness to put team first, work ethic, etc, and those happen to be found more in people of a certain faith, and to result in a team where that faith is heavily represented, that's different PROVIDED demonstrations of those traits, and not religion, were the screening criteria.

[Dr. K]

2 minutes ago, LABillzFan said:

 

Yes, of course. One of the things asked of Christians is to make disciples, and you do that by spreading the word of the gospel. 

 

I'll assume you're similarly concerned with girl scouts pushing cookies outside of Wegmans, Apple pushing a camera that makes phone calls, product placement in movies, and pretty much any other group which spreads its primary message in an effort to recruit for and advance their cause?

So you do agree that proselytization is fundamental to evangelical Christianity after all.

 

When the Girl Scouts or Apple run for Congress saying that only people who like Peanut Butter cookies should make EPA policy or that no Android phone users should be appointed judges, then I'll get worried.  

 

Go Bills!

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

13 hours ago, DC Tom said:

 

Remind me how many people died for this meme?

 

 

toll was 127. all atheists 

[Tyrod's friend]

1 minute ago, DaBillsFanSince1973 said:

 

 

toll was 127. all atheists 

Just before they died, I'm guessing a whole lot of them stopped being atheists. 
I kid, I kid.

[oldmanfan]

I don't want this to cause the thread to be moved, but regarding the concept of Evangelism, I am a member of the Evanglical Lutheran Church and actually am Deacon for Evangelism.  Evangelism means spreading the good news, simple.  The word evangelical is my opinion has been misappropriated by some in more fundamentalist churches to include the dismissal of those who do not see eye to eye with their beliefs on faith, political issues, and such.  They are far from evangelistic.

 

And again, I am happy McD is a man of faith, but I am also quite sure he does not exclude those who are not from his team.  On the contrary, you would welcome such persons to share the good news with him.

[Dr. K]

32 minutes ago, LABillzFan said:

 

That's actually not what evangelical means. I understand how you would think that way. I lived in NC for years, and to me evangelical meant Tammy Faye Baker.

 

I've come to learn that's like saying 'being a vegan means you follow people around pressuring them to give up flavor.'

 

 

Where do you see people forcing their religious views into civil society?

No prejudice against you, and not assuming you would align with it, but this website expresses the is the kind of views that I oppose strongly. They absolutely want to force the entire country to live by their distorted vision of American history and founding principles:

 

https://www.usa.church/usa-christian-republic/

[Richard Noggin]

I approve of this discussion.

[RochesterRob]

  This thread is like a tempest in a teapot.  Can we wait for a few players to complain about religious discrimination before we tar and feather the FO?  At least with a few players versus one we would at least have a pattern to look at even if there were inaccuracies in the allegations.  With out public comments from the FO people here are projecting their own fears, prejudices, and paranoia onto people that they have no personal knowledge of.  Not unlike the Dark Ages and the Inquisition that people here are worried about OBD descending into.  Again, how about we wait until solid unbiased information comes to be before we condemn.  I can see it now somebody's pet UDFA gets cut during camp and within hours a thread will appear here questioning whether that UDFA was the victim of religious intolerance.  McBeane will get reduced to a caricature of Archie Bunker.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

9 minutes ago, Dr. K said:

No prejudice against you, and not assuming you would align with it, but this website expresses the is the kind of views that I oppose strongly. They absolutely want to force the entire country to live by their distorted vision of American history and founding principles:

 

https://www.usa.church/usa-christian-republic/

 

And yet I'm sure you have no problem with allowing Muslims into the country...who according to Pew polls overwhelmingly approve of the enforcement of Sharia law.

 

Because, brown.

 

Right?

 

If you're going to be anti-religion...make sure you're ACTUALLY anti-religion. Or else someone might get the idea you're a hypocrite.

 

Just now, RochesterRob said:

  This thread is like a tempest in a teapot.  Can we wait for a few players to complain about religious discrimination before we tar and feather the FO?  At least with a few players versus one we would at least have a pattern to look at even if there were inaccuracies in the allegations.  With out public comments from the FO people here are projecting their own fears, prejudices, and paranoia onto people that they have no personal knowledge of.  Not unlike the Dark Ages and the Inquisition that people here are worried about OBD descending into.  Again, how about we wait until solid unbiased information comes to be before we condemn.  I can see it now somebody's pet UDFA gets cut during camp and within hours a thread will appear here questioning whether that UDFA was the victim of religious intolerance.  McBeane will get reduced to a caricature of Archie Bunker.

 

!@#$ing THIS.

bravo, man. BRAVO.

 

[blacklabel]

18 hours ago, eball said:

If there is one non-football thing I've noticed about McD it is the emphasis he places on faith when discussing the makeup of the team.  I believe he uses the phrase "family, faith, football" frequently which begs the question -- is there a place for a player on this roster who isn't a devout Christian or (perish the thought) is agnostic or an atheist?  An aspect unique to sports is the open practice of religion before, during, and after games.

 

Obviously McD can't come out and openly discriminate on the basis of religion but that's not what I'm asking.  I don't think this is a silly question and I'm not making fun of anyone -- I'm curious to hear others' thoughts and I wonder if a media member would ever ask him that question (i.e., can a player who doesn't claim religious faith as a cornerstone of his life fit into "the process" with the Buffalo Bills)?

 

I've wondered this myself but whenever I see those post-game prayer circles players like to do, it's never the entire team out there. I'm sure they realize that not every player, coach, assistant, etc. is religious. I think they welcome that aspect about a player (if they have strong faith) but I don't think they dock a player any points if they aren't. Character is obviously a high priority to them but I also think they have a threshold as to how many red flags they'll allow. I don't think it's like, "Uh oh, this dude has a red flag." "What's it for?" "Um, he once borrowed a pencil from a teacher in 4th grade and did not return it." "Take him off the board! He's a lunatic, a menace! Can't win with him!"

[Dr. Who]

If we are going to engage in hermeneutics of suspicion, I wonder if some folks who are "wondering" about the relation of McDermott's faith to football judgements are just disgruntled Rosen supporters looking for yet another reason to justify continued resentment of OBD's preference for Allen.  To reiterate what I said earlier in this thread, other than an innocuous phrase and some Christians on the roster, what could possibly invite ten pages of handwringing over McDermott's personal religious faith?  Seems to me one is working hard to discover something proto-fascist in utterly ordinary circumstances that generally promote good behavior, not evil.

 

And some have just taken the occasion to indulge in their own bigotry, painting religious folk with a broad brush as inherently oppressive, anti-intellectual dopes that one can hold up to contempt with impunity.  Such rants are themselves ignorant, uncivil, and obviously not contributing to insight into the Buffalo Bills.

[Tyrod's friend]

3 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

...Evangelism means spreading the good news ...

Which doesn't mean telling someone else they have to do something. 

Evangelism by it's nature requires sharing and nothing beyond that; it is up to others to make the conscious decision to accept and join. Sharing is something we know as a fact is what McDermott preaches. He specifically went to great lengths to push this during last training camp; sharing is part of process of turning 53 individuals into a team. 

There is a definitive - to me - intersection here between faith and football. We are by nature a pack animal, inclined towards joining into a single effort. Faith subjugates, by it's nature. Individualism elevates the self - and if you choose to see how that could devolve into a conversation between Josh Allen and Josh Rosen, so be it.

It's not about the faith of Josh Rosen. Go to New Square, NY to find an entire town so cloistered it voted 1159 of 1168 for Hilary Clinton. That sort of unanimity would be welcomed with open arms by our head coach, provided he could harness it toward's his own goals.

(how's THAT for walking a fine line between politics, football and religion? LMAO!)

 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, Tyrod's friend said:

It's not about the faith of Josh Rosen.
 

 

I honestly think this is at the root of this thread. There's a subset of this community who's line of thinking goes like this:

 

"i thought Rosen was the better option" ---> The Bills selected Allen ---> Rosen is Jewish ---> Allen is not --->Ergo, McD chose Allen over Rosen due to religious bigotry.

 

I can almost guarantee that's the line of thinking of some.

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

This thread has diverged from the discussion of football and therefore the discussion has been closed.  Please continue political and religious discussions in the PPP forum.  Thank you.