JoPar_v2 Posted May 10, 2018 Posted May 10, 2018 So trade a proven top flight corner for an unproven rookie yet to play a pro game and get the exact same other 2 first round picks...sure why not. 1
ghostwriter Posted May 10, 2018 Posted May 10, 2018 Assuming we didn't go QB and in a parallel universe we still got Allen at 7. I would still not trade Tre for 4, even for Nelson or Chubb.
mead107 Posted May 10, 2018 Posted May 10, 2018 6 hours ago, IgotBILLStopay said: Clearly the biggest surprise of Round #1 was the Browns pick #4 going for Denzel Ward instead of Bradley Chubb. Chances are the Browns were still hoping for Barkley but basically knew they were getting Ward the moment the GIants made the Barkley pick. If we had known the Browns were looking at CB at #4 (it has been widely reported they wanted a CB to allow Garrett to get to the QB), would you be willing to trade Tredavious White for the #4 pick? Not that I am not high on White (I think he will make the Pro Bowl this year if he stays injury free). Why for the Browns: White is closer to a sure thing than Ward and still has three years on the rookie scale (at a lower salary than #4). Why for the Bills: 1. Guaranteed to get Josh Allen 2. Would have gotten Ward at #4 and likely still gotten Edmunds for #22 and #65 at 16. So Bills end up with Allen, Ward and Edmunds instead of Allen, White and Edmunds. All things equal, I prefer the latter - but remember in this trade Bills get to keep their 2 #2s and get an extra year on the rooki scale for their CB. So would you rate Ward, #53 and #56 as higher than Tre' White? Clearly Bills had interest in Ward - they even hosted him at OBD. Seriously. Another crazy thread from a newbie. Just my opinion. 1
Magox Posted May 10, 2018 Posted May 10, 2018 Hell to the no. White is potentially a multi year All pro player that fits the mold both from a performance and mental aspect, not to mention that we had the draft capital to get the QB we wanted and Beane skillfully executed the plan.
billsbackto81 Posted May 10, 2018 Posted May 10, 2018 If it ain't White, it ain't right. Too soon? 1 3
BurpleBull Posted May 10, 2018 Posted May 10, 2018 6 hours ago, IgotBILLStopay said: Clearly the biggest surprise of Round #1 was the Browns pick #4 going for Denzel Ward instead of Bradley Chubb. Chances are the Browns were still hoping for Barkley but basically knew they were getting Ward the moment the GIants made the Barkley pick. If we had known the Browns were looking at CB at #4 (it has been widely reported they wanted a CB to allow Garrett to get to the QB), would you be willing to trade Tredavious White for the #4 pick? Not that I am not high on White (I think he will make the Pro Bowl this year if he stays injury free). Why for the Browns: White is closer to a sure thing than Ward and still has three years on the rookie scale (at a lower salary than #4). Why for the Bills: 1. Guaranteed to get Josh Allen 2. Would have gotten Ward at #4 and likely still gotten Edmunds for #22 and #65 at 16. So Bills end up with Allen, Ward and Edmunds instead of Allen, White and Edmunds. All things equal, I prefer the latter - but remember in this trade Bills get to keep their 2 #2s and get an extra year on the rooki scale for their CB. So would you rate Ward, #53 and #56 as higher than Tre' White? Clearly Bills had interest in Ward - they even hosted him at OBD. How do you say the Bills would be 'guaranteed' to still get Allen, but 'likely' to still get Edmunds? I think if you had to do the draft over again there's a better chance that Allen is off the board before Buffalo gets a shot at him than Edmunds not being available by the time the Bills picked again, most certainly if the Bills don't include either 2nd rd picks in a move to climb the draft board to get Allen. You don't trade an established young player away like that for an unproven player at the same position. For all anybody knows Denzel Ward is Justin Gilbert all over again. A db selected within the top 10, with 4.3 speed who doesn't pan out for one reason or another.
CommonCents Posted May 10, 2018 Posted May 10, 2018 The Ward pick pushed Nelson and Chubb down and saved the Bills a bunch of draft capital. Your scenario would screw that all up. If Ward didn’t go 4 we most likely severely overpay for 5. 4. Chubb 7. Allen 16. Edmunds Is that what you’re thinking? It wasn’t possible even if they traded Tre for 4. 1
BurpleBull Posted May 10, 2018 Posted May 10, 2018 2 minutes ago, Commonsense said: The Ward pick pushed Nelson and Chubb down and saved the Bills a bunch of draft capital. Your scenario would screw that all up. If Ward didn’t go 4 we most likely severely overpay for 5. 4. Chubb 7. Allen 16. Edmunds Is that what you’re thinking? It wasn’t possible even if they traded Tre for 4. How are the Bills even picking at 7 if they aren't using the two 2nd rd picks to move up as suggested in this trade scenario? 1
CommonCents Posted May 10, 2018 Posted May 10, 2018 Just now, BurpleBull said: How are the Bills even picking at 7 if they aren't using the two 2nd rd picks to move up as suggested in this trade scenario? OP suggested White for the 4th pick then I assume he wanted to rest of the board to fall as it did. As I said above that wouldn’t have played out like that. Chubb/Nelson kept the Bills and other teams from trading up because Denver/Indy would have wanted a haul. 1
Gugny Posted May 10, 2018 Posted May 10, 2018 Can there be a draft subforum? When is this **** gonna stop? 2
IgotBILLStopay Posted May 10, 2018 Author Posted May 10, 2018 (edited) Sorry for the confusion - my post was about getting Allen at 4, Ward / Edmunds at 12/16 and still having #53 and #56. ALlen is guaranteed at 4 - with Ward and Edmunds most likely at 12/16. I am not disputing White > Ward. That is why Cleveland is willing to do the trade- if not, they are happy picking Ward, no? Just for example my question is - is Tre worth Ward +WR Chark / Washington + OT O'Neill / Parker. Despite the nebulous wording - grateful a couple of posters still figured it out. Thanks. Edited May 10, 2018 by IgotBILLStopay
ProcessTheTrust Posted May 10, 2018 Posted May 10, 2018 Checking the calendar. May 10th. Okay. A little over 2 months till training camp. Threads like this are almost going to be non-existent by then. Hanging in there.
H2o Posted May 10, 2018 Posted May 10, 2018 Absolutely not. You are going to trade a guy who was in the running for DROY last year, create a hole, and draft another guy you hope can perform at the same level? Yeah, that's what you call "hustlin' backwards" in this day and time. 1
SouthNYfan Posted May 10, 2018 Posted May 10, 2018 Tre'white is literally a top 10 CB in the league. Why would you even think to trade him for a chance that Ward becomes even 80% as good as we KNOW White is, for a higher salary?
Charlottebillsfan2 Posted May 10, 2018 Posted May 10, 2018 (edited) I wouldn't even make this trade in Madden! Edited May 10, 2018 by Charlottebillsfan2
BarleyNY Posted May 10, 2018 Posted May 10, 2018 Count me as I one who really didn’t think it a stretch that Ward went 4th overall. Chubb was the best of a bad class of Edge players and I think he’ll be a good player. I just don’t think he’s as good as his hype. I don’t see him as an elite NFL player. Ward was the best CB prospect in the draft - and he excels at man and press, which is increasingly rare. If the Patriots had made that pick everyone would be praising it. Would I have traded White for that 4th overall pick straight up? Yeah, I would have. That’s a lot of draft capital and the Bills have a lot of holes. It could’ve been parlayed into multiple picks (or prevented trading up with multiple picks). I really like White (and I realize his absence would create another hole), but Cover 3 Bail CBs are much easier to find than most at the position.
2003Contenders Posted May 10, 2018 Posted May 10, 2018 When I first read your post I thought the "guaranteed to get Allen" reference was another passive-aggressive suggestion that Allen would have definitely been available at #12, which we now know is not true. Instead, you are suggesting that they would have taken Allen at 4 (which is fine, given that we know that Beane and the Browns were in talks, but the Browns wouldn't back off wanting 12, 22 and next year's #1). First, I would be totally opposed to trading a proven (at least after one season) player like White for a roll-of-the-dice like Ward. Second, it is highly unlikely that Ward would have made it to 12. The Broncos would have undoubtedly still taken Chubb, and based on recent reports the Colts were all in on Nelson. However, with no draft partner in Buffalo, I could see Tampa taking Ward at 7. Or the 49ers at 9. Or the Dolphins at 11.Or possibly some other team trading up...
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