Russ Brandon - Leaving Role as President of Bills & Sabres due to workplace behavior and allegations of personal misconduct

[teef]

40 minutes ago, colin said:

 

sure, but that's totally hypocritical on behalf of the pegula's, and the badge polishing going on here is laughable.

i obviously don't know the specifics of what russ was accused of, but i have a feeling it's far worse that just consensual dating in the work place.  it's an assumption on my part, but there was something that a blind eye couldn't be turned to.  

[Rob's House]

2 minutes ago, TakeYouToTasker said:

 

Yeah, I can see how you might feel that way when someone tries to inject the sanity of the middle ground, which is the presumption of innocence (and yes, I understand this isn't a legal proceeding, and that the Pegula's have every right to force Brandon out of his role),  into a loud and robust chorus of "BURN THE WITCH!  BURN THE WITCH!"

 

This chorus, indulging when not fully embracing the beliefs of third wave feminists, is celebrating the firing of a man for what appears to be consensual sex with a co-worker.  If this is what is now being defined as sexual misconduct, then it should be argued against on moral grounds.  The Pegula's, nor any other employer, should feel empowered to dismiss anyone because of what consenting adults they choose to sleep with.  It's none of their damn business.

If he got fired because they learned he slept with men I'm guessing some here would have to reevaluate their free market view of at will employment. 

[TakeYouToTasker]

5 minutes ago, dneveu said:

 

What if he did it on company time, or worse - company dime?  

 

As I've said here many times, I am open to the possibility that Russ Brandon is a serial abuser and is guilty of grossly inappropriate conduct at work, which would justify him being forced out.  I truly am.

 

If that's what happened, it would be justified.

 

My point here, is that we don't know, and yet there is a rush to vilify. 

[colin]

The inside scoop:

 

Russ is just an olde tyme romantic, just like Terry P, and his passion and huge heart was taken advantage of.  Kim and terry are jealous of him for having a newer fresher version of their story, so they removed him!

 

also, all of Russ's horrible horrible decisions and hires were someone else's fault.  Prolly.

[Rockpile233]

9 minutes ago, TakeYouToTasker said:

 

Yeah, I can see how you might feel that way when someone tries to inject the sanity of the middle ground, which is the presumption of innocence (and yes, I understand this isn't a legal proceeding, and that the Pegula's have every right to force Brandon out of his role),  into a loud and robust chorus of "BURN THE WITCH!  BURN THE WITCH!"

 

This chorus, indulging when not fully embracing the beliefs of third wave feminists, is celebrating the firing of a man for what appears to be consensual sex with a co-worker.  If this is what is now being defined as sexual misconduct, then it should be argued against on moral grounds.  The Pegula's, nor any other employer, should feel empowered to dismiss anyone because of what consenting adults they choose to sleep with.  It's none of their damn business.

 

Interoffice relationships are against my companies code of conduct. Now I know of no situation where this has ever been enforced, but I am conscious of the potential consequences.

 

I don’t know PSE’s code of conduct, but my point is that it’s very much the coroporations business if they want it to be. If you want to fool around at work or with people you work with, know the potential consequences and live with them if they bite you.

 

 

 

[GA BILLS FAN]

2 minutes ago, TakeYouToTasker said:

 

As I've said here many times, I am open to the possibility that Russ Brandon is a serial abuser and is guilty of grossly inappropriate conduct at work, which would justify him being forced out.  I truly am.

 

If that's what happened, it would be justified.

 

My point here, is that we don't know, and yet there is a rush to vilify. 

 

We don't know definitively, but ardent RB supporters have essentially confirmed he's a bad guy and there is no way he is forced to resign for one consensual relationship.  Extrapolation seems fair in this case.  He is a predator and deserves no admiration

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

8 minutes ago, Rob's House said:

If he got fired because they learned he slept with men I'm guessing some here would have to reevaluate their free market view of at will employment. 

 

If he got fired because he slept with men generically, or because he slept with a man or men employed as his subordinates?

The relevant comparator is the latter, and I doubt it (though of course, I wouldn't rule it out with "some")

 

The "at will employment" has been corrected.  Russ Brandon almost certainly had a contract, and it almost certainly contained clauses for behavior.

[eball]

15 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Brandon didn't make the Rex hire---the owner did. The same owner who made the McDermott hire. Did Brandon go along with it and make some fawning comments associated with the hire? Yes he did. So what? He was the subordinate who had no authority in the selection. There is a demonization of Brandon that is way out of proportion to his influence in the football operation. Russ Brandon is very influential in the business side of the operation. And he is good at what he does. He has not been involved in the football operation for years. And when he was involved it was because the owner with failing health thrust those responsibilities on him. 

 

The Bills have been bad for a long time because of a lot of bad decisions by their owners. Russ Brandon is not the bogeyman that many are making him out to be. 

 

The Pegulas -- newbies in the franchise-owning business -- have leaned heavily on Russ since the whole process of buying the Bills began.  No, Russ didn't personally "hire" Rex, but he uttered the infamous words "don't let him leave the building" and was obviously pushing Pegs to make the hire.

 

I don't absolve the Pegulas from blame for some of the questionable decisions they have made with both the Bills and Sabres, but it is a breath of fresh air knowing Russ is out of the picture.

Edited May 2, 2018 by eball

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

6 minutes ago, TakeYouToTasker said:

 

As I've said here many times, I am open to the possibility that Russ Brandon is a serial abuser and is guilty of grossly inappropriate conduct at work, which would justify him being forced out.  I truly am.

 

If that's what happened, it would be justified.

 

My point here, is that we don't know, and yet there is a rush to vilify. 

 

I'm personally glad he's gone because of BOTH team's general lack of success during his tenure.  People get fired all the time for less, and they may have been looking for a reason to get out of his contract - hence the investigation (purely speculation)

[Hapless Bills Fan]

4 minutes ago, TXBILLSFAN said:

We don't know definitively, but ardent RB supporters have essentially confirmed he's a bad guy and there is no way he is forced to resign for one consensual relationship.  Extrapolation seems fair in this case.  He is a predator and deserves no admiration

 

Just a note that in the corporations I'm aware of, for an executive to have one consensual relationship with one subordinate would indeed be grounds for termination under their terms of employment.  The reason, as previously noted, would be that an assymmetrical power relationship is held to cloud consent (from a legal POV).  That's why companies explicitly prohibit this and provide their "people managers" training saying "don't do this, here's why"

 

I have no information as to the quantity or quality of RB's misbehavior or whether he is a predator.

[stevewin]

13 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 If you're a female that has gone out downtown, you have a 87% chance of being molested by Russ Brandon.

Analytics?

[May Day 10]

Im sure if it was two people courting one another and he bought someone flowers, it would have probably been permissible.  Being married with kids, and also a repeat-offender shows that this likely wasnt the case.  He also lied to the owners of the team.  

[TakeYouToTasker]

5 minutes ago, Rockpile233 said:

 

Interoffice relationships are against my companies code of conduct. Now I know of no situation where this has ever been enforced, but I am conscious of the potential consequences.

 

I don’t know PSE’s code of conduct, but my point is that it’s very much the coroporations business if they want it to be. If you want to fool around at work or with people you work with, know the potential consequences and live with them if they bite you.

 

I understand the standard, I'm saying that the standard is wrong.

 

As I said upthread:  I reject a guiding philosophy under which businesses get to dictate how people should behave in their personal lives based on how willing others are to sue them, and the hands-in-pockets, strangely humanist-yet-Puritanical, untrusting outcomes all of this dictates.

[SectionC3]

1 hour ago, dneveu said:

 

That's all well and good... but you don't really know the nature of KP & TPs relationship (IE they could have been dating before she started), or the nature of Brandon's indiscretions (he may have just had a consensual relationship with one person, or he could have done something completely different and inappropriate).  So it's a tad of a stretch and generalization.

 

Seriously - leave the Pegulas' marriage out of this.  It has no place in this discussion. 

 

And, frankly, even if there was a workplace indiscretion in that relationship, it doesn't matter here.  Two wrongs don't make a right.  The Pegulas make the rules in their (private sector) businesses, and one of the rules apparently is that the company president shouldn't engage in a sexual relationship with a subordinate or subordinates.  Another rule is don't lie to the boss.  Various reports suggest that both of those rules were broken, and for those reasons (and perhaps more) Russ is out.  As he should be.  

 

Terry and Kim -- or Bob and Mindy Rich or any other couple that owns a business together -- have nothing to do with this.  I get that they're public figures, and commentary on the aptitude (or lack thereof) as professional sports owners is fair game.  But their personal lives are not relevant to this discussion.  

[GA BILLS FAN]

7 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Just a note that in the corporations I'm aware of, for an executive to have one consensual relationship with one subordinate would indeed be grounds for termination under their terms of employment.  The reason, as previously noted, would be that an assymmetrical power relationship is held to cloud consent (from a legal POV).  That's why companies explicitly prohibit this and provide their "people managers" training saying "don't do this, here's why"

 

I have no information as to the quantity or quality of RB's misbehavior or whether he is a predator.

 

No doubt, there is and should be zero tolerance regardless of company.

 

But, let's not put our heads in the sand here because there isn't several videos or a parade of women coming forward, where there is smoke there is fire and many on this board, including Russ apologist Kirby Jackson have all but admitted as much.  And let's not forget the reporting has said more than just inappropriate relationships, this could get into embezzlement or some other business crime.  Again, no proof, but a lot of smoke

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

...sadly at the end of the day, his wife and children are victims as well those in the work place..........

[Lurker]

31 minutes ago, JohnC said:

There is a demonization of Brandon that is way out of proportion to his influence in the football operation. Russ Brandon is very influential in the business side of the operation. And he is good at what he does. He has not been involved in the football operation for years. And when he was involved it was because the owner with failing health thrust those responsibilities on him. 

 

The Bills have been bad for a long time because of a lot of bad decisions by their owners. Russ Brandon is not the bogeyman that many are making him out to be. 

 

Agree 100%.  

 

Which makes it doubly amazing that so many posters continue to fart out "it's Brandon's fault that the Bills have stunk" and expect anyone to take them seriously about anything else...

 

Edited May 2, 2018 by Lurker

[JohnC]

8 minutes ago, eball said:

 

The Pegulas -- newbies in the franchise-owning business -- have leaned heavily on Russ since the whole process of buying the Bills began.  No, Russ didn't personally "hire" Rex, but he uttered the infamous words "don't let him leave the building" and was obviously pushing Pegs to make the hire.

 

I don't absolve the Pegulas for some of the questionable decisions they have made with both the Bills and Sabres, but it is a breath of fresh air knowing Russ is out of the picture.

The uttering of those words associated with Brandon in the hiring of Rex are given more weight than they deserve. The owner was foolishly captivated by Rex. The owner wanted to give a boring and colorless franchise some identity. It was a dumb decision by a new owner who was out of his depth. If you recall you were also enthused with the hire. (I'm not criticizing you because many people were excited with the hire.) 

 

As you noted Pegula was new to the business. And it was demonstrated by his hiring decisions. On the positive side it appears that he has learned from his mistakes. But as the McDermott hire also illustrates is that it is the owner who makes the big hires based on what he wants to do  and not because of the people who are at his side. 

[TakeYouToTasker]

18 minutes ago, dneveu said:

 

I'm personally glad he's gone because of BOTH team's general lack of success during his tenure.  People get fired all the time for less, and they may have been looking for a reason to get out of his contract - hence the investigation (purely speculation)

 

Again, I don't mind that Brandon is gone.  While I think he did an absolutely outstanding job keeping the team profitable towards the end of the Ralph years, and is a major reason the team is still in Buffalo; I think his value has declined, and that it may have been time to move on from him.  And that's fine.  And it entirely the Pegula's right as employers.

 

However, if what you speculate is accurate, that would be an objectively awful thing for an employer to do:  to seek to scandal out an employee who became inconvenient to the ambitions of the wife of the owner.

 

Important to note:  I'm not saying that's what happened.  I recognize you aren't saying that's what happened.  What I'm saying is that sort of thing should be viewed as absolutely unacceptable behavior by an employer.

Edited May 2, 2018 by TakeYouToTasker

[stevewin]

13 hours ago, Nitro said:

Russ was hated and now the whipping boy is gone.  Who is next for the fans to pillory?