John from Riverside Posted April 30, 2018 Posted April 30, 2018 1 hour ago, jrober38 said: If you have one guy to "point to" over the past 25 years your argument doesn't make any sense. Josh Allen was a mediocre college player. The odds of him becoming an elite NFL QB are not good. As are the odds for all the drafted qbs in every draft..... You are buying a lottery ticket with any of these guys
Mikey152 Posted April 30, 2018 Posted April 30, 2018 (edited) I have the same problem with fans and media guys that say they know more than the pros as I do with the "Advanced analytics" guys... The problem is, both sets of people use the pros research to form the basis of their opinion, then go from there and act like they know more. In other words, if all you, Joe Fan/Joe media, had access to was game footage, measurements and live football (no websites, rankings lists, visit information, etc.) I don't think you would be anywhere close when it came to mock drafts. Just like how stats guys only apply their metrics once their data set has been selected for them via more conventional means... It's easy to say you'd take Rosen over Allen when that's been pounded in to your head all year. But without all the draft hype, my guess is nobody even knows who Josh Allen is. They certainly wouldn't know about random third rounders. Edited April 30, 2018 by Mikey152
Coach Tuesday Posted April 30, 2018 Posted April 30, 2018 27 minutes ago, keepthefaith said: 71 pages and counting analyzing and opining about a player who hasn't been to a single NFL practice yet? Wait and see folks and hope that Nate, AJ and Josh all do very well. The Bills may be in the best QB situation since the 90's. Let us know when it's ok to express our opinions.
keepthefaith Posted April 30, 2018 Posted April 30, 2018 9 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said: Let us know when it's ok to express our opinions. You have to admit, much of fan reaction/opinion before and after the draft is pretty ridiculous. Add the media to that too.
Boatdrinks Posted April 30, 2018 Posted April 30, 2018 49 minutes ago, MJS said: Ok, but that also means you shouldn't listen to the fans and draft experts who think the Bills hit it out of the park. Which means the only thing to do is wait and see ... The only thing you can grade a draft on this early is did the team address their needs and where did they get the players relative to their rank. That's about it. Absolutely no one alive knows how these players are going to turn out. Some will be good , others great, others busts. Some good players will come from surprisingly low picks, and some high ones will do nothing. Wait and see is 100% right and this draft is no different. 1
Adam Posted April 30, 2018 Posted April 30, 2018 On 4/26/2018 at 6:55 PM, The_Dude said: Goddamn idiots. Now Darnolds going to Miami. Once a year!
BillsFan4 Posted April 30, 2018 Posted April 30, 2018 Just now, Sky Diver said: I’m surprised they all haven’t fled after all the ridiculous negativity here. Hopefully most will start getting over it soon and get on board with Allen. I have seen a lot of people doing just that already. I expect/hope more will too. It seems like most are IMO. I wont lie, I was disappointed by the Josh we picked at first. But I got over it pretty quickly (maybe an hour or so... lol). That's just me though. I am the type that pretty quickly finds reasons to get on board and get excited. I don't see the point in looking for reasons to hate something the Bills/Sabres did. We have zero control over any of this stuff... I like having hope and being excited about the Bills future, and I like to be an optimistic person. I always try to look at the positives, not the negatives. So i'd MUCH rather look for reasons to get excited instead of looking for reason to be negative. It drives me nuts when I see people doing nothing but finding any/every reason they can to be negative... But anyway... lol. I love the kids attitude and personality so far. He makes it very easy to root for him. Cant wait to see what he can do after getting proper NFL level coaching, and getting to play with NFL level talent. I expect it'll take some time but I'm excited for the future! One things for sure, if Allen fails it won't be for lack of effort. He seems very coachable and very driven to be the best. I don't think many guys will be outworking him. 1 2
Sky Diver Posted April 30, 2018 Posted April 30, 2018 8 minutes ago, BillsFan4 said: Hopefully most will start getting over it soon and get on board with Allen. I have seen a lot of people doing just that already. I expect/hope more will too. It seems like most are IMO. I wont lie, I was disappointed by the Josh we picked at first. But I got over it pretty quickly (maybe an hour or so... lol). That's just me though. I am the type that pretty quickly finds reasons to get on board and get excited. I don't see the point in looking for reasons to hate something the Bills/Sabres did. We have zero control over any of this stuff... I like having hope and being excited about the Bills future, and I like to be an optimistic person. I always try to look at the positives, not the negatives. So i'd MUCH rather look for reasons to get excited instead of looking for reason to be negative. It drives me nuts when I see people doing nothing but finding any/every reason they can to be negative... But anyway... lol. I love the kids attitude and personality so far. He makes it very easy to root for him. Cant wait to see what he can do after getting proper NFL level coaching, and getting to play with NFL level talent. I expect it'll take some time but I'm excited for the future! One things for sure, if Allen fails it won't be for lack of effort. He seems very coachable and very driven to be the best. I don't think many guys will be outworking him. I think there will be a vocal minority that won’t let go.
BuffaloHokie13 Posted April 30, 2018 Posted April 30, 2018 9 minutes ago, BillsFan4 said: Hopefully most will start getting over it soon and get on board with Allen. I have seen a lot of people doing just that already. I expect/hope more will too. It seems like most are IMO. I wont lie, I was disappointed by the Josh we picked at first. But I got over it pretty quickly (maybe an hour or so... lol). That's just me though. I am the type that pretty quickly finds reasons to get on board and get excited. I don't see the point in looking for reasons to hate something the Bills/Sabres did. We have zero control over any of this stuff... I like having hope and being excited about the Bills future, and I like to be an optimistic person. I always try to look at the positives, not the negatives. So i'd MUCH rather look for reasons to get excited instead of looking for reason to be negative. It drives me nuts when I see people doing nothing but finding any/every reason they can to be negative... But anyway... lol. I love the kids attitude and personality so far. He makes it very easy to root for him. Cant wait to see what he can do after getting proper NFL level coaching, and getting to play with NFL level talent. I expect it'll take some time but I'm excited for the future! One things for sure, if Allen fails it won't be for lack of effort. He seems very coachable and very driven to be the best. I don't think many guys will be outworking him. Personally, I realized that my disappointment was because we didn't pick Rosen. I think Rosen is going to be very good. That, and my disappointment, have nothing to do with Allen (who may also be very good). Once I was able to separate that I started coming around. 4
Big C Posted April 30, 2018 Posted April 30, 2018 51 minutes ago, Sky Diver said: I think there will be a vocal minority that won’t let go. There always is.
akm0404 Posted April 30, 2018 Posted April 30, 2018 My biggest takeaways from watching full game film from Allen (including the Boise State film) are that he is way more elusive and a better runner than I thought, and boy does he push the ball down the field. Didn't see a ton of his touchdowns being screens that running backs take the distance. Watching 30 yard completions over the middle of the field looking commonplace. We haven't had that in...a long time. 4
John from Riverside Posted April 30, 2018 Posted April 30, 2018 4 minutes ago, akm0404 said: My biggest takeaways from watching full game film from Allen (including the Boise State film) are that he is way more elusive and a better runner than I thought, and boy does he push the ball down the field. Didn't see a ton of his touchdowns being screens that running backs take the distance. Watching 30 yard completions over the middle of the field looking commonplace. We haven't had that in...a long time. You bring up a pretty good point in scheme. Go back and take a look at the screen passes Rosen, Darnold, and Mayfield throw (high percentage passes) and take a look at the throws by Allen......NFL THROWS...he pushes the ball down the field. This was talked about by the guy that worked with him before the draft.......the completion percentage is skewed by the style of offense. 2
Fixxxer Posted April 30, 2018 Posted April 30, 2018 58 minutes ago, akm0404 said: My biggest takeaways from watching full game film from Allen (including the Boise State film) are that he is way more elusive and a better runner than I thought, and boy does he push the ball down the field. Didn't see a ton of his touchdowns being screens that running backs take the distance. Watching 30 yard completions over the middle of the field looking commonplace. We haven't had that in...a long time. Watching his games on youtube, it's amazing how very few passes going to the RBs. Either his college playbook had none those or he refused to look the RBs way. There are examples where he lacks touch on quick and screen passes, but I would have to guess those are quite coachable with repetition, by system alone his completion percentage could go up a couple of points.
akm0404 Posted May 1, 2018 Posted May 1, 2018 31 minutes ago, Fixxxer said: Watching his games on youtube, it's amazing how very few passes going to the RBs. Either his college playbook had none those or he refused to look the RBs way. There are examples where he lacks touch on quick and screen passes, but I would have to guess those are quite coachable with repetition, by system alone his completion percentage could go up a couple of points. Yeah I'm not going to say that OMG that's the magic bullet that explains the scary 56% number - I'm sure the other guys push it down field as well and my study is certainly not scientific. Just my reaction to the recently posted stuff combined with a deep rooted desire to have an offense that throws 15 yard square ins.
GG Posted May 1, 2018 Posted May 1, 2018 1 hour ago, akm0404 said: My biggest takeaways from watching full game film from Allen (including the Boise State film) are that he is way more elusive and a better runner than I thought, and boy does he push the ball down the field. Didn't see a ton of his touchdowns being screens that running backs take the distance. Watching 30 yard completions over the middle of the field looking commonplace. We haven't had that in...a long time. I definitely recommend that everyone take a look at the game film highlights. Afte watching a few games, the whole accuracy and low completion talking points are way overblown. But critics do have a point about him locking in on a target and bailing on a pocket too soon. Still there’s a hell of a lot more potential there than what we’ve seen in ages.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 1, 2018 Posted May 1, 2018 14 hours ago, njbuff said: It is almost like the doubters want to see Allen fail just to justify they are right about him. Pretty disturbing. I'm sure there's a few - there always are. The majority I think are just honestly scared that a guy who needs a good bit of NFL development, will be like the last 2 1st rounders the Bills drafted and won't take that step. 16 hours ago, Wyobills89 said: Well to start out from wyoming, born and raised, wyo cowboy since 1989, bills mafia has gained another member...well im sure about 500k members. Cant wait tell training camp, allen is going to blow everyone away, i remember his first spring game, he is just such a competitor. Yes he has tons to learn, work on, but his athletic ability is scary good. Cant wait. Ive converted over 100%. Not to mention bills uni is like damn near idintical to the wyo state flag! That makes cheering for this team super easy! I hope/pray allen makes his potential, bring buffalo back to the early 90's number 17! Go wyo go Bills! Welcome! I hope you're right. If you find yourself getting a bit frustrated by some of the negativity, I suggest you stroll over to pro-football-reference and check out the Bills QB draft history. The 1040EZ on it is that the last 2 QB the Bills drafted, had trouble learning to read and react to an NFL defense and the 2 most recent 1st rounders had "zip code" accuracy issues which weren't able to progress. If your guy can go out there and ball, then show improved decisions and placement from year to year, we'll love him, every one of us, no worries. For players who give it their all, there is no better fan base. 1
Recommended Posts