What a Tuel Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 3 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said: The overwhelming majority knows more than pro scouts and coaches. Always has. No it has not. They just have a 100 million shots to get it right. Law of averages.
Nihilarian Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 2 minutes ago, JM57 said: Oh wow 228.7 yards per game, in the illustrious Mountain West Conference! Well I guess that swings it then. The Bills took a project QB with major accuracy and processing problems. Those are two traits in QBs that very often improve marginally, if at all. Look through scouting report after scouting report and you see the same things. Accuracy issues. Sloppy footwork. Inconsistent mechanics. Lack of anticipatory throws. He has some traits that are reminiscent of Big Ben or Stafford, such as the ability to bounce off contact and not take a sack, but doesn't read a defense like they do. His most common comparisons are a ceiling of Jay Cutler and a floor of Kyle Boller. Knowing what you know about Cutler's career, would you spend the #7 pick and two #2s on him? I sure as hell wouldn't. 1 Read what Jordan Palmer has to say about this young man. https://clutchpoints.com/nfl-draft-news-josh-allen-thinks-inaccuracy-talk-blown-proportion/
Lurker Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Nihilarian said: Read what Jordan Palmer has to say about this young man. https://clutchpoints.com/nfl-draft-news-josh-allen-thinks-inaccuracy-talk-blown-proportion/ No offense, but Palmer is being paid by Allen as his 'consultant.'.. Read this article and tell me you're comfortable with the pick: https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2018/4/25/17277580/draft-qb-thoughts-baker-mayfield-lamar-jackson-josh-allen Edited April 27, 2018 by Lurker 1
billsfan1959 Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, T-Bomb said: And fans like you are simply useless tbh... No matter what dumbass FO this organization hires, you just sit there with your thumb up your ass, drinking the KoolAid, assuming the FO can do no wrong, because they are "your Bills". Whatever colossal draft mistake they make, you'll support it in lemming-like fashion, It's pathetic. Loser fans deserve a loser franchise I guess... 2 And fans like you believe every opinion you have is superior to any opinion anyone else may have, and throw childish tantrums whenever someone disagrees with you. You can continue to be as aggressive, condescending, and obnoxious as you want in asserting your opinions, they are still merely opinions - no more valid than any other opinion on this board. Edited April 27, 2018 by billsfan1959
Carmel Corn Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 18 minutes ago, Greywolf said: I wish people wouldn't respond to others' thoughts on these subjects with versions of "so, you think you know more than pro scouts and coaches?" C'mon, we all know that none of us are pros. This is just a fan forum and folks like to give their thoughts on Bills-related issues the same way we do over beers with friends. We don't have to be pro scouts to have some fun. Yeah right...FUN is not how it looks to me. Maybe somebody should check to see if there are any statistics on how many people in Buffalo last night: - Threw-up - Suffered a heart attack - Kicked their dog - Destroyed their televisions - Beat their wives - Hung themselves - Etc. It's amazing how many people say "this org. has set us back X years", when they actually had some success in just one, yet the fan base immediately wants to stone them to death. Unbelievable. People on this board would not have been happy if Jesus himself was our draft pick. There is no FUN left in Buffalo!
Nihilarian Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 15 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said: The issue is RISK. Is this an organization that can afford to take a big risk at the QB position? I say it isn’t. Safer options were available, like trading likely fewer assets for the guy who just won the Super Bowl, or drafting the guy whose stats actually project a safer path to success (Rosen). Or hedging that big risk by holding onto your current starter for one more year while your risky developmental pick learns. Beane took a big risk and I think it’s not the right strategy for a franchise that hasn’t had a pro passing game since the early 1990’s. Like I said in an earlier post in this thread. "Think of it as almost every Bills fan in this forum wanted the Bills to trade up to the #2 spot for (Mr. Glass), Josh Rosen by giving up two #1s, two #2s, two #3s and some even wanted the Bills to give up three first rounders for him. The Bills got two blue-chip players in the first round in 2018 and has someone else so aptly put it...they should be crapping glitter!"
greeneblitz Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 22 minutes ago, JM57 said: Oh wow 228.7 yards per game, in the illustrious Mountain West Conference! Well I guess that swings it then. The Bills took a project QB with major accuracy and processing problems. Those are two traits in QBs that very often improve marginally, if at all. Look through scouting report after scouting report and you see the same things. Accuracy issues. Sloppy footwork. Inconsistent mechanics. Lack of anticipatory throws. He has some traits that are reminiscent of Big Ben or Stafford, such as the ability to bounce off contact and not take a sack, but doesn't read a defense like they do. His most common comparisons are a ceiling of Jay Cutler and a floor of Kyle Boller. Knowing what you know about Cutler's career, would you spend the #7 pick and two #2s on him? I sure as hell wouldn't. Hate to break it to you but all your bleacher report "scouting reports" don't mean jack **** compared to actual NFL scouts, This front office had done everything imaginable to prove that they have excellent judgement in both the draft and free agency, messageboad GMs are just gonna have to watch and learn.
Chris66 Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 15 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said: The overwhelming majority knows more than pro scouts and coaches. Always has. It wasn't smart. It was the dumbest move imaginable. You may be too young to remember Ben Roethlisberger in college. He also played in a non-power conference. He absolutely dominated. Annihilated his competition. Led Miami of Ohio to a Top 15 national ranking. That's who Allen should have been if he was worthy of a Top 10 pick. But Allen wasn't even close to that. Bingo thats it right there. He didnt dominate a mediocre conference. Yes all the qbs have flaws but Allens flaw is he has to learn to be a qb. Not very reassuring
Wayne Cubed Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 Bill, the problem is you are biased against the position that was picked. You don't like the drafting of secondary players high, that is why you didn't like the picks. And that has clouded your judgement of the talent of the individual. In each of the instances you've used as an example, those players succeeded or have succeeded in the NFL. They were correctly evaluated. No one is knocking the pick because the Bills selected a QB, like you do with the secondary picks. They are knocking the talent evaluation of Allen. Why is it expected that fans have to change their mind immediately because the Bills picked Allen? Because "this is their job" and they do it for a living? It was Buddy Nix/Doug Whaley's job to pick a QB. It was Tom Donahoe's job to pick a QB too. If you don't already know, GMs do get picks wrong and just because the Bills selected Allen doesn't mean I'll change my opinion of the player that I had previous to the draft. Do I hope he proves all of the people wrong who doubt him, including me? Of course. And for me, it's not just the accuracy, although that is a concern. He gets confused with coverages too. 2
Beast Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) 29 minutes ago, JM57 said: Oh wow 228.7 yards per game, in the illustrious Mountain West Conference! Well I guess that swings it then. The Bills took a project QB with major accuracy and processing problems. Those are two traits in QBs that very often improve marginally, if at all. Look through scouting report after scouting report and you see the same things. Accuracy issues. Sloppy footwork. Inconsistent mechanics. Lack of anticipatory throws. He has some traits that are reminiscent of Big Ben or Stafford, such as the ability to bounce off contact and not take a sack, but doesn't read a defense like they do. His most common comparisons are a ceiling of Jay Cutler and a floor of Kyle Boller. Knowing what you know about Cutler's career, would you spend the #7 pick and two #2s on him? I sure as hell wouldn't. Comparisons, comparisons. I just saw one that compared him to Brett Favre. Let’s relax and see what we have. Edited April 27, 2018 by Binghamton Beast
Nihilarian Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 2 minutes ago, Lurker said: No offense, but Palmer is being paid by Allen as his 'consultant.'.. Read this article and tell me you're comfortable with the pick: https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2018/4/25/17277580/draft-qb-thoughts-baker-mayfield-lamar-jackson-josh-allen 1 Yes, and Palmer also worked with Deshaun Watson the last offseason. How did that work out? The writer of that article Rodger Sherman also states I’m often wrong. (I was huge into Johnny Manziel and [speaks in a small voice so people can’t hear] Geno Smith.)
billsfan1959 Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 2 hours ago, Bill from NYC said: I have been on this wonderful board for many, many years. Now, I am reading these posts that are absolutely hating the Allen pick and it is hard to understand why. Almost every season, I was on this board blasting yet another idiotic first round pick by the Bills. For instance: A #8 (in a stacked draft) on an undersized Donte Whitner? How about a 1st on a half dead Willis McGahee? In 2008 we had a very poor OL. It was awful. We drafted Leotis McKelvin, passing up both Ryan Clady and Branden Albert. I could go on and on but my point is that fans were generally supportive of these clearly stupid picks. Now, we finally use resources on a big, strong quarterback and most people seem to hate the kid. Why? Because he said stupid things when he was a toddler? Because he went to a small school? After what seemed like forever, we took a chance on solidifying the most important position on the field. We moved up to make sure we landed a qb with a cannon arm. What is SO freaking bad? I for one am glad that we did something smart (for a change) in round 1, and welcome this young man to Buffalo. GO BILLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Well written post, my friend. The FO did what most fans wanted them to do in going after a franchise QB. We all have our opinions on which QB in this draft we wanted; however, not one of us has any idea which ones will be good and which ones will not. They took their shot on a QB who was one of the few legitimate 1st round talents in this draft. I second you in welcoming him to Buffalo and wish him all the best.
ko12010 Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 1 hour ago, oldmanfan said: Couldn't agree more. I'll be honest, I would have taken Rosen. But as Beane said each of the QBs in this class had positives and negatives. They liked Allen's positives. Some compare this pick to EJ. To me it's JP. Same big arm and stuff but JP never could handle the mental aspects of the position. Will Allen be able to? We'll see. But I'd say the same for all the QBs drafted this year. JP was starting to get it and was looking pretty darn good until Fat Vince dove into his knees.
DaBillsFanSince1973 Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 1 hour ago, T-Bomb said: Loser fans deserve a loser franchise I guess... yet here you are, loser. 1
fergie's ire Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 I, too, preferred Rosen. But two things make me feel good about the Allen pick. 1) When they showed Rosen in the draft room and I saw his small frame, I couldn't help thinking: "Wow, he looks like Sam Bradford," which does worry me. The second is, if you are going to buy a lottery ticket (and all the evidence is that even quarterbacks at the top of the draft are a lottery ticket), why not buy a Powerball instead of a church festival raffle ticket? Yes, the Bills might have to do this again in three or four years.....but instead of just treading water and getting a quarterback who will get by....if you want a game changer, you probably have to take some chances.
Cash Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 1 hour ago, Bill from NYC said: I have been on this wonderful board for many, many years. Now, I am reading these posts that are absolutely hating the Allen pick and it is hard to understand why. Almost every season, I was on this board blasting yet another idiotic first round pick by the Bills. For instance: A #8 (in a stacked draft) on an undersized Donte Whitner? How about a 1st on a half dead Willis McGahee? In 2008 we had a very poor OL. It was awful. We drafted Leotis McKelvin, passing up both Ryan Clady and Branden Albert. I could go on and on but my point is that fans were generally supportive of these clearly stupid picks. Now, we finally use resources on a big, strong quarterback and most people seem to hate the kid. Why? Because he said stupid things when he was a toddler? Because he went to a small school? After what seemed like forever, we took a chance on solidifying the most important position on the field. We moved up to make sure we landed a qb with a cannon arm. What is SO freaking bad? I for one am glad that we did something smart (for a change) in round 1, and welcome this young man to Buffalo. GO BILLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I have the utmost respect for you as a poster here, but I don't think your confusion is warranted. It's pretty simple: most of us took it as a given that the Bills would be drafting a QB, likely via trading up. Before the draft, Allen seemed by far the most likely of the top QBs to be a bust. Rosen, by all accounts, is the best pure passer. So when the Bills opted for the most likely to bust over the best passer, that was a concern. And I don't think it helps how the Bills' FO is selling the pick: First they talk about Allen's size, arm, and athleticism, but nothing about his ability to actually complete passes. Then two guys who've spent a fraction of their lives in WNY talk about how "Buffalo" he is. They may not have intended it this way, but that read to me as basically, "Look, he's a dumb hick just like all of you - you'll love him!" I'm sick of both of those sales pitches. If Aaron Rodgers can be happy in Green Bay, there's no reason to think the Bills have to draft a farm boy. To your other point, I would be even more upset if the Bills hadn't drafted a QB at all, but that was borderline unfathomable to me heading into the draft. They're better off swinging and missing on a QB than not trying at all. 1
Lurker Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Nihilarian said: The writer of that article Rodger Sherman also states I’m often wrong. The relevance of that article is the links it aggregates. Not the writer's opinion. The data / stats collectively are horrondous... Here's some more "fun' video: https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2018/1/26/16932920/josh-allen-wyoming-quarterback-hype-nfl-draft (Love the Senior Bowl drill video vs. Mayfield ) Edited April 27, 2018 by Lurker
Another Fan Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) I guess this is a trust the process kind of move. They must have saw traits in him Beane and McDermott liked. To me I have to see how he plays out before I have any strong opinion one way or another Edited April 27, 2018 by Another Fan
Coach Tuesday Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 31 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: If they had come out of this draft without drafting a QB you would have been first in line blasting them for that. Absolutely right. So?
oldmanfan Posted April 27, 2018 Posted April 27, 2018 Just now, Coach Tuesday said: Absolutely right. So? So you criticize them no matter what they do. Makes no sense.
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