TakeYouToTasker Posted April 10, 2018 Posted April 10, 2018 (edited) 8 minutes ago, HappyDays said: Are you aware of the concept of admissible evidence? Are you aware that attorney-client communications can be made admissible evidence if they are discussing crimes the attorney is committing? Surprisingly the justice system doesn't leave an easy loophole wherein every attorney can make themselves immune from any and all criminal investigation. Again, this raid wasn't part of the Trump/Russia investigation. It wasn't even related to Trump himself, as Mueller found it to be outside the scope of his investigation. Also, admissible evidence applies to situations in which a lawyer conspires with his client to commit a crime. (using the term "conspire" colloquially, not legally speaking) What was achieved was to provide the FBI with decades worth of legal documents surrounding conversations between Cohen and the President, otherwise protected by attorney-client privilege. These documents are now in the hands of those being investigated for widespread criminal malfeasance rising to the level of actual treason. This is incredibly problematic. 11 minutes ago, garybusey said: This did not happen so I will not play your stupid games in this thread. Enjoy talking about this with DR or Buffalo Gal (assuming they're not the same person). It absolutely did happen. You can deny it if you'd like, but that just makes you wrong. Edited April 10, 2018 by TakeYouToTasker 1
Buffalo_Gal Posted April 10, 2018 Posted April 10, 2018 19 minutes ago, HappyDays said: I see that you're very eager to jump to conclusions on this. Sorry but we don't know everything yet. We don't know the exact charges being brought against Cohen, we don't know the reasoning for executing a search warrant over a subpoena, we don't know which - if any - communications between Trump and Cohen will be privileged, etc. You seem to have missed the second half of my post that you quoted.
Cugalabanza Posted April 10, 2018 Posted April 10, 2018 It remains to be seen whether the warrants were obtained fairly. We simply don't know what evidence was presented. I understand the skepticism, but it's premature to state that the intelligence apparatus/legal system is collapsing our system of justice. 3
Warren Zevon Posted April 10, 2018 Author Posted April 10, 2018 (edited) Fact: The search warrant came from a US attorney appointment by President Trump Fact: The search warrant was approved by a judge To opine that the warrants were obtained unfairly is blatant propaganda as you do not know what evidence led to the warrant. 1 minute ago, Cugalabanza said: It remains to be seen whether the warrants were obtained fairly. We simply don't know what evidence was presented. I understand the skepticism, but it's premature to state that the intelligence apparatus/legal system is collapsing our system of justice. This dude gets it Edited April 10, 2018 by garybusey
Buffalo_Gal Posted April 10, 2018 Posted April 10, 2018 (edited) 19 minutes ago, garybusey said: This did not happen so I will not play your stupid games in this thread. Enjoy talking about this with DR or Buffalo Gal (assuming they're not the same person). Ooooooh I get to have two identities here!? Awesome! Note: I barely have time to be one profile here. I have quasi-enjoyed this thread though - some of it is out and out stupid, some of it is intelligent discussion, and some is clear frustration on how little we know about the situation, and how it eventually impacts the state of our country, and our civil rights. I did watch Alan Dershowitz say yesterday that they (Cohen and Trump) should be in front of a judge this morning asking the judge to take possession of all materials and have the judge decide what is attorney-client privileged information. IOW have a judge be the layer, and not a (tainted) FBI. Edited April 10, 2018 by Buffalo_Gal
TakeYouToTasker Posted April 10, 2018 Posted April 10, 2018 1 minute ago, Cugalabanza said: It remains to be seen whether the warrants were obtained fairly. We simply don't know what evidence was presented. I understand the skepticism, but it's premature to state that the intelligence apparatus/legal system is collapsing our system of justice. In light of the incredible amount of criminality and malfeasance undertaken to weaponize the US intelligence apparatus against the President in the run up to the election, something which has already been demonstrated, this development is an absolutely horrifying continuation of that trend. This is not politics as usual. This is the weaponization of the government against individuals who have set themselves, through legal processes, to rein that government in. This is the throwing away of all pretexts of a free society and the rule of law. 2
HappyDays Posted April 10, 2018 Posted April 10, 2018 15 minutes ago, row_33 said: has to be a very strong reason to break that confidentiality partisan suckybaby whiny politics isn't a reason Yes I'm sure the Republican DA who was personally interviewed and appointed by Trump authorized this search because he's a partisan hack. The Republican Director of the FBI is also in cahoots with the Democrats. Every person is secretly out to get your side, and everyone on your side is innocent of all crimes, is that how it works? 2
TakeYouToTasker Posted April 10, 2018 Posted April 10, 2018 3 minutes ago, Buffalo_Gal said: Ooooooh I get to have two identities here!? Awesome! Note: I barely have time to be one profile here. I have quasi-enjoyed this thread though - some of it is out and out stupid, some of it is intelligent discussion, and some is clear frustration on how little we know about the situation, and how it eventually impacts the state of our country, and our civil rights. I did watch Alan Dershowitz say yesterday that they (Cohen and Trump) should be in front of a judge this morning asking the judge to take possession of all materials and have the judge decide what is attorney-client privileged information. IOW have a judge be the layer, and not a (tainted) FBI. Those materials have already been in the hands of bad actors for hours, and the FBI has already demonstrated that it does not feel it needs to comply with the law. Even if ordered to turn over all materials, they would not do so, or at least would not do so in a timely manner. All material will be copied for the purpose of being disseminated via leaks. 1
Buffalo_Gal Posted April 10, 2018 Posted April 10, 2018 Just now, HappyDays said: Yes I'm sure the Republican DA who was personally interviewed and appointed by Trump authorized this search because he's a partisan hack. The Republican Director of the FBI is also in cahoots with the Democrats. Every person is secretly out to get your side, and everyone on your side is innocent of all crimes, is that how it works? Oh come on... you have heard of Never Trumpers, right? There are several factions of the RNC and the "elites" that were "horrified" to have Trump elected have actively worked against his agenda since day 1. 2
Warren Zevon Posted April 10, 2018 Author Posted April 10, 2018 1 minute ago, HappyDays said: Yes I'm sure the Republican DA who was personally interviewed and appointed by Trump authorized this search because he's a partisan hack. The Republican Director of the FBI is also in cahoots with the Democrats. Every person is secretly out to get your side, and everyone on your side is innocent of all crimes, is that how it works? row is another one who was put on ignore long ago. Much better forum without his/her/it's schtick.
Buffalo_Gal Posted April 10, 2018 Posted April 10, 2018 Just now, TakeYouToTasker said: Those materials have already been in the hands of bad actors for hours, and the FBI has already demonstrated that it does not feel it needs to comply with the law. Even if ordered to turn over all materials, they would not do so, or at least would not do so in a timely manner. All material will be copied for the purpose of being disseminated via leaks. I agree with this.
TakeYouToTasker Posted April 10, 2018 Posted April 10, 2018 4 minutes ago, HappyDays said: Yes I'm sure the Republican DA who was personally interviewed and appointed by Trump authorized this search because he's a partisan hack. The Republican Director of the FBI is also in cahoots with the Democrats. Every person is secretly out to get your side, and everyone on your side is innocent of all crimes, is that how it works? This is not about Republicans and Democrats. This is about a system rigged to the benefit of global elites across both parties and internationally who are all part of the same club, and use political division as a tool to enrich themselves. 1 1
Cugalabanza Posted April 10, 2018 Posted April 10, 2018 3 minutes ago, garybusey said: row is another one who was put on ignore long ago. Much better forum without his/her/it's schtick. He does tend to advocate for the Coco Puffs with excessive zeal. 1
Warren Zevon Posted April 10, 2018 Author Posted April 10, 2018 Just now, TakeYouToTasker said: This is about a system rigged to the benefit of global elites across both parties and internationally who are all part of the same club, and use political division as a tool to enrich themselves. This did not happen. You're either living in La La land or Trump is your Mom. 1
Tiberius Posted April 10, 2018 Posted April 10, 2018 36 minutes ago, TakeYouToTasker said: Again, I ask you, is it problematic that the FBI has performed an end run around attorney-client privilege, a necessary hallmark of our entire system of jurisprudence, in order to gain access to information about a person investigating/prosecuting wide spread malfeasance and corruption in that agency? Is this something the intelligence apparatus of a free country should be doing? This answer is why there will be an actual shooting war in this country. You are, quite literally, dismissing people posing legitimate concerns about the intelligence apparatus/legal system of our nation launching end runs around the basic legal protections that the entire notion of a free country rests upon as cry babies. This cannot stand, Gary. This is not clever. This is the collapse of our system. This is where desperation sets in. Between who and who? 1
TakeYouToTasker Posted April 10, 2018 Posted April 10, 2018 1 minute ago, garybusey said: This did not happen. You're either living in La La land or Trump is your Mom. You don't believe we have a system of neo-mercantilist cronyism designed to extract the wealth of the 99% to the benefit of the global elite through their ownership of the global financing mechanism and the military industrial complex?
Deranged Rhino Posted April 10, 2018 Posted April 10, 2018 28 minutes ago, Cugalabanza said: I understand the skepticism, but it's premature to state that the intelligence apparatus/legal system is collapsing our system of justice. Premature is probably the wrong word. We have 70 years of evidence of the IC doing exactly that... Thinking they're above it now, or have somehow evolved beyond it, is ... dangerously naive. 25 minutes ago, HappyDays said: Yes I'm sure the Republican DA who was personally interviewed and appointed by Trump authorized this search because he's a partisan hack. The Republican Director of the FBI is also in cahoots with the Democrats. Every person is secretly out to get your side, and everyone on your side is innocent of all crimes, is that how it works? You're behind in this conversation because you're hung up thinking this is about left versus right, dem versus republican. It's not and never has been. 18 minutes ago, garybusey said: This did not happen. You're either living in La La land or Trump is your Mom. Ignorance on full display. Living up to his avatar.
Tiberius Posted April 10, 2018 Posted April 10, 2018 5 minutes ago, Deranged Rhino said: So what is your take on this raid?
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