DC Tom Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 19 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said: Can we agree on this: either the DOJ has nothing on Trump and this is one desperate last-ditch Hail Mary attempt to dig up something (in which case it likely will backfire in spectacular fashion), or Mueller already thinks he has “the nuts” on Trump, and yesterday’s raid was a sharp tightening of the noose... Third: Mueller still doesn't have anything substantial on Trump, but found plenty of **** on Cohen that he couldn't pursue under the mandate of his own investigation, so gave it to SDNY. I mean...have we forgotten the story broke a week ago that Mueller reportedly told Trump that he wasn't a "target" of his investigation? The timing of that leak a week before Cohen's office and home are raided is certainly suggestive. 3
Coach Tuesday Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 4 minutes ago, DC Tom said: Third: Mueller still doesn't have anything substantial on Trump, but found plenty of **** on Cohen that he couldn't pursue under the mandate of his own investigation, so gave it to SDNY. I mean...have we forgotten the story broke a week ago that Mueller reportedly told Trump that he wasn't a "target" of his investigation? The timing of that leak a week before Cohen's office and home are raided is certainly suggestive. For why? That would be insane of Mueller. If all that comes out of many months of investigation are minor charges against Manafort, Cohen and a Skadden associate, the blowback will be substantial and devastating.
Deranged Rhino Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 Just now, Coach Tuesday said: For why? That would be insane of Mueller. If all that comes out of many months of investigation are minor charges against Manafort, Cohen and a Skadden associate, the blowback will be substantial and devastating. ... Unless there's nothing else there, of course. Mueller is not compelled to find something that may not exist just because it's expected he will find something after all. 10 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said: I will finish reading it, probably tomorrow.
Coach Tuesday Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 (edited) And I’ll add - if Mueller’s got nothing, Trump is even more of a moron than I thought. He’s reportedly debating firing Rosenstein over this, which probably would be suicidal... all he’d have to do is just let this play out. Edited April 11, 2018 by Coach Tuesday
Cugalabanza Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 38 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said: And I’ll add - if Mueller’s got nothing, Trump is even more of a moron than I thought. He’s reportedly debating firing Rosenstein over this, which probably would be suicidal... all he’d have to do is just let this play out. Agreed. Although, I can understand the position of maybe Trump is not guilty of the primary suspected charge of collusion, but he’s wary of all the scrutiny because he has some weird unrelated dirty laundry that he’d prefer not to have aired.
DC Tom Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 1 hour ago, Coach Tuesday said: For why? That would be insane of Mueller. If all that comes out of many months of investigation are minor charges against Manafort, Cohen and a Skadden associate, the blowback will be substantial and devastating. If Mueller's got nothing, the blowback should be substantial and devastating, as it means this pretty much was nothing but a witch hunt. But I'm not one to presume the mere existence of an investigation indicates finding charges commensurate with the level of investigation is a foregone conclusion. We did spend a ridiculous amount of time and money investigating the Clintons for Whitewater to find nothing more than "he lied about being blown by a chubby intern," after all. 1 hour ago, Coach Tuesday said: And I’ll add - if Mueller’s got nothing, Trump is even more of a moron than I thought. He’s reportedly debating firing Rosenstein over this, which probably would be suicidal... all he’d have to do is just let this play out. For all the times Trump is "reported" to consider firing someone, but doesn't, I've ceased taking those "reports" at face value. I wish I had a dollar for every time I heard Trump was going to fire Mueller. Which is not to defend Trump - he is as big a moron as I thought, which was always substantial. But the reporting over the past year-plus has been grotesquely irresponsible to the point where it's impossible to reliably distinguish fact from fiction from editorial from wishful thinking. 1
outsidethebox Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 (edited) 7 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said: For why? That would be insane of Mueller. If all that comes out of many months of investigation are minor charges against Manafort, Cohen and a Skadden associate, the blowback will be substantial and devastating. Kind of like the blowback when the fbi exonerated Hillary BEFORE the investigation? You're living in a dream world if you think this raid isn't politically motivated to get dirt on Trump. Edited April 11, 2018 by westside 1
Teddy KGB Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 Thank you for all the laughs (la grant, busey, and Tiberius)
Coach Tuesday Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 2 hours ago, westside said: Kind of like the blowback when the fbi exonerated Hillary BEFORE the investigation? You're living in a dream world if you think this raid isn't politically motivated to get dirt on Trump. Again - you are saying that Trump-appointed justice department officials and U.S. attorneys' office lawyers, along with a Federal judge in the Southern District, are part of this political conspiracy... 8 hours ago, DC Tom said: For all the times Trump is "reported" to consider firing someone, but doesn't, I've ceased taking those "reports" at face value. I wish I had a dollar for every time I heard Trump was going to fire Mueller. Which is not to defend Trump - he is as big a moron as I thought, which was always substantial. But the reporting over the past year-plus has been grotesquely irresponsible to the point where it's impossible to reliably distinguish fact from fiction from editorial from wishful thinking. You now have Republicans in Congress helping push a bill to protect Mueller's job. Could it be based on false rumors? Sure, I suppose it *could be*... but I wouldn't bet on that.
Tiberius Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 10 hours ago, DC Tom said: Third: Mueller still doesn't have anything substantial on Trump, but found plenty of **** on Cohen that he couldn't pursue under the mandate of his own investigation, so gave it to SDNY. I mean...have we forgotten the story broke a week ago that Mueller reportedly told Trump that he wasn't a "target" of his investigation? The timing of that leak a week before Cohen's office and home are raided is certainly suggestive. You don't know that. Mueller could have a ton of stuff. Mueller might simply have found a way to spread out the investigation to other jurisdictions as a way to protect the investigation if Trump finds a way to fire Mueller.
Coach Tuesday Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 3 minutes ago, Tiberius said: You don't know that. Mueller could have a ton of stuff. Mueller might simply have found a way to spread out the investigation to other jurisdictions as a way to protect the investigation if Trump finds a way to fire Mueller. I think he was just putting it out there as a third possibility. We really don't know yet. I tend to think the simplest explanations usually end up being the accurate ones. If you're piecing together a complex, multi-layered, multi-year conspiracy, you ought to ask yourself, "Why do I want to believe/not believe this so much?" Conspiracy theorists always end up where they had hoped they would when they started. No one falls into a conspiracy theory by being objective and scientifically rigorous. It's confirmation bias to the nth degree. 1
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 Wow, my lucky day, now we get coach tuesday here TOO? oh goody! 1
snafu Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 10 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said: And I’ll add - if Mueller’s got nothing, Trump is even more of a moron than I thought. He’s reportedly debating firing Rosenstein over this, which probably would be suicidal... all he’d have to do is just let this play out. 9 hours ago, Cugalabanza said: Agreed. Although, I can understand the position of maybe Trump is not guilty of the primary suspected charge of collusion, but he’s wary of all the scrutiny because he has some weird unrelated dirty laundry that he’d prefer not to have aired. I think Trump's bluster this time has to do with his "red line" regarding Mueller's mandate. Trump has been pretty clear about the fact that he's going to start shutting things down once the investigation touches his personal dealings. Going after his personal attorney, I'm sure, cuts pretty close to that. As Tom said in an earlier post, last time things got close to Trump's "line", Mueller came out and said that the President wasn't part of that line of action. I've speculated before that whatever personal indiscretions get swept up in the Mueller (and now other) probes will somehow be used as political leverage against Trump in the future. Just scuzzy politics 101. I think this is why many would suffer through the blowback of finding nothing in the Russia portion of the investigation.
Coach Tuesday Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 18 minutes ago, joesixpack said: Wow, my lucky day, now we get coach tuesday here TOO? oh goody! I know, you'd like your pigsty all to yourself.
Tiberius Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 If Trump booted Mueller out the door, the public would be very displeased. “President Donald Trump should not fire Special Counsel Robert Mueller, American voters say 69 – 13 percent in a Quinnipiac University National Poll released today. Even Republicans say 55 – 22 percent that President Trump should not fire Mueller. “
Koko78 Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 1 hour ago, Coach Tuesday said: Again - you are saying that Trump-appointed justice department officials and U.S. attorneys' office lawyers, along with a Federal judge in the Southern District, are part of this political conspiracy... The bolded is untrue. The only Trump-appointed person in the food chain recused himself. https://www.marketwatch.com/story/manhattan-us-attorney-recused-himself-from-investigation-into-trumps-lawyer-2018-04-10 3
boyst Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 1 hour ago, Coach Tuesday said: I think he was just putting it out there as a third possibility. We really don't know yet. I tend to think the simplest explanations usually end up being the accurate ones. If you're piecing together a complex, multi-layered, multi-year conspiracy, you ought to ask yourself, "Why do I want to believe/not believe this so much?" Conspiracy theorists always end up where they had hoped they would when they started. No one falls into a conspiracy theory by being objective and scientifically rigorous. It's confirmation bias to the nth degree. Mueller can't simply use Trump's former attorney to go on a witch Hunt. No matter how butthurt democrats are and how much they hate the Constitution, that is not how the law is permitted to work. Fruit of a poisonous tree is a mother!@#$ing big deal 1 hour ago, Coach Tuesday said: Again - you are saying that Trump-appointed justice department officials and U.S. attorneys' office lawyers, along with a Federal judge in the Southern District, are part of this political conspiracy... You now have Republicans in Congress helping push a bill to protect Mueller's job. Could it be based on false rumors? Sure, I suppose it *could be*... but I wouldn't bet on that. John McCain isn't a republican. He is a piece of ****.
DC Tom Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 2 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said: You now have Republicans in Congress helping push a bill to protect Mueller's job. Could it be based on false rumors? Sure, I suppose it *could be*... but I wouldn't bet on that. Is there any reason other than "because they're in Congress" to think they're any better informed than we are? Most of them would be getting their info on this subject the same way we do: from their favored media sources.
Tiberius Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 1 hour ago, Koko78 said: The bolded is untrue. The only Trump-appointed person in the food chain recused himself. https://www.marketwatch.com/story/manhattan-us-attorney-recused-himself-from-investigation-into-trumps-lawyer-2018-04-10 Oh, so it's not the guy Trump appointed, but the guy who was appointed by the guy Trump appointed. Hardly shows this is a partisan witch hunt
Coach Tuesday Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 5 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Oh, so it's not the guy Trump appointed, but the guy who was appointed by the guy Trump appointed. Hardly shows this is a partisan witch hunt And it still doesn't explain the SDNY magistrate's signoff... 37 minutes ago, DC Tom said: Is there any reason other than "because they're in Congress" to think they're any better informed than we are? Most of them would be getting their info on this subject the same way we do: from their favored media sources. I tend to think they are better informed, in this case, especially given how chatty this White House staff is. That place is leakier than a [insert dirty joke].
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