Bills going to LA to visit and workout Sam Darnold

[FeelingOnYouboty]

7 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

I don't take him seriously... I'm actually flabbergasted at some of the ridiculous things he says.

 

But not a lot of options at the time I drive to work with talk radio.

 

Just listen to the Dan LeBatard show. They don't take themselves serious and just have fun.

[Tyrod's friend]

18 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

7.00

PRO BOWL-CALIBER PLAYER

HOW WE GRADE

ihttps://www.nfl.com/prospects/sam-darnold?id=32462018-0002-5600-578a-86541c8f8891

Greg Robinson

Larry Tunsil

 

Both rated higher than Sam Darnold - and not by a little bit. They were ranked nearly a 7.5, and it's not a linear scale. It's damned hard to be a 7.5.

Neither one has been worth the ranking. 

[YoloinOhio]

6 minutes ago, Tyrod's friend said:

Greg Robinson

Larry Tunsil

 

Both rated higher than Sam Darnold - and not by a little bit. They were ranked nearly a 7.5, and it's not a linear scale. It's damned hard to be a 7.5.

Neither one has been worth the ranking. 

What does that have to do with Darnold’s draft profile 

[Mrbojanglezs]

Trade up to 1 with browns with a deal in place that browns will then use 1 of our picks to trade up from 4 to 2 to select Allen. Then Giants only move back 2 spots and likely still get their first nonqb player off board. Everyone wins 

[Tyrod's friend]

21 minutes ago, Tyrod's friend said:

Greg Robinson

Larry Tunsil

 

Both rated higher than Sam Darnold - and not by a little bit. They were ranked nearly a 7.5, and it's not a linear scale. It's damned hard to be a 7.5.

Neither one has been worth the ranking. 

Both of them were heavily overrated coming out of college, and I think Darnold is overrated as well - particularly as the #1, overall draft in the NFL.

There is no real history of any player having his background, with substantial success in the NFL. In fact, contrary to Pro Bowl abilities a 2 year starter that regressed in his second year historically has been someone you should shun.

I realize I'm alone on this, but there are combination of traits that make Darnold particularly dangerous that you can't say about players like Rosen and Mayfield. Can he be good? Maybe in 2021. Maybe.

Not #1 overall.

[gonzo1105]

I can't shake that I feel Darnold will be a huge bust in the NFL. I'm not just talking about the turnovers and things like that that media pundits constantly harp on. First he reminds me of Ryan Fitzpatrick. Part of it is probably the same number (14) but they also have the same movements in the pocket, the scrambling, the throwing motion etc. 

 

On top of that when I go back and watch his tape, his best throws are always and I mean always in the middle of the field or he boots to one side and throws to that side of the field. You very rarely see a Deep Out across the field or a deep comeback where he isn't booting. Just go back and watch all of his best throws against Penn State in the Rose Bowl. Did USC know something that people in the NFL don't know. Does he lack arm strength to make those throws? 

 

Just a talking point that I can't seem to shake. 

[BuffaloBillyG]

While they are out in LA they need to throw Bobby Woods in a burlap sack and drag him back here.

[26CornerBlitz]

 

[MrEpsYtown]

2 minutes ago, Tyrod's friend said:

Both of them were heavily overrated coming out of college, and I think Darnold is overrated as well - particularly as the #1, overall draft in the NFL.

There is no real history of any player having his background, with substantial success in the NFL. In fact, contrary to Pro Bowl abilities a 2 year starter that regressed in his second year historically has been someone you should shun.

I realize I'm alone on this, but there are combination of traits that make Darnold particularly dangerous that you can't say about players like Rosen and Mayfield. Can he be good? Maybe in 2021. Maybe.

Not #1 overall.

 

Nobody thought Greg Robinson and Tunsil were going to bust. Robert Gallery was the safest player in the draft a few years ago and he busted. Same with Aaron Curry. None of these things have anything to do with the other, and certainly have nothing to do with Darnold. 

 

That said, I don't love Darnold, but everything he does is very projectable to the NFL.  The plays he makes and teh throws he makes are some next level stuff. The turnovers are a problem, but that is one of those things that can actually be improved. The guy is only 20 years old, and I think one of the reasons we are seeing guys who we can say "there is no history of success for his type" is because dudes are starting as true freshmen, and college teams are changing OC's every year. Josh Rosen had three different offensive coordinators in three years. 

 

Back in the day, and even pretty recent history, almost everyone took a redshirt year, and there was not so much coaching turnover. Darnold took a redshirt year, but really only played for two seasons. Additionally, he only started one season in High school. We are talking about a guy with a true lack of experience, but a lot of talent. Conversely, people like Mason Rudolph because he seems more mature and ready...he's 22 going on 23 years old and started for basically 3.5 years. Ofcourse he is more mature. But at the end of the day, he doesn't have the athletic ability or arm talent as what he does well is not really projectable. Baker Mayfield turns 23 next week and is a redshirt senior who has basically 4 years of starting experience at two different schools. The difference between a 23 year old and a 20 year old is pretty significant. It could be argued that Mayfield and Rudolph don't stand to get much better than what they are right now, whereas Darnold and Rosen are very young and have the size, athletic ability, and arm talent that scouts love. 

 

With quarterbacks it has become much more about projection of skills and talent and that is why it has become riskier than ever. 

[DefenseWins]

14 hours ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

....still don't see McBeane going "all in" draft capital wise on ONE player.......hunch that he holds at 12, and sees which one of the four purported top dawgs fall to him.......if all are gone, he has time until the 22 spot to figure out Plan B......if the dawgs are all gone, he may go OL/DL/LB at 12........perhaps Rudolph is his target at 22......does he take him or gamble he falls into the 2nd, going OL/DL/LB again at 22?......if he gambles on Rudolph falling to 2nd and he's gone, is Falk his next candidate?.......clear as mud IMO.....no matter what, McBeane ends up "damned if he does...damned if he doesn't".........stay tuned........

 

Make sure you tune in EARLY on draft nite and you'll learn how wrong your theory was about McBean not going "ALL IN"...

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

3 minutes ago, DefenseWins said:

 

Make sure you tune in EARLY on draft nite and you'll learn how wrong your theory was about McBean not going "ALL IN"...

 

.....usually am.....need to keep my string going......

[DefenseWins]

32 minutes ago, Mrbojanglezs said:

Trade up to 1 with browns with a deal in place that browns will then use 1 of our picks to trade up from 4 to 2 to select Allen. Then Giants only move back 2 spots and likely still get their first nonqb player off board. Everyone wins 

 

I know at first it sounds radical but stranger things have and will continue to happen... Have your popcorn ready early cause it may be a wild 1st hour... This sounds like it could be the highest viewed NFL draft nite (at least locally) in memory...

 

[YoloinOhio]

35 minutes ago, Tyrod's friend said:

Both of them were heavily overrated coming out of college, and I think Darnold is overrated as well - particularly as the #1, overall draft in the NFL.

There is no real history of any player having his background, with substantial success in the NFL. In fact, contrary to Pro Bowl abilities a 2 year starter that regressed in his second year historically has been someone you should shun.

I realize I'm alone on this, but there are combination of traits that make Darnold particularly dangerous that you can't say about players like Rosen and Mayfield. Can he be good? Maybe in 2021. Maybe.

Not #1 overall.

Some players live up to their draft profile, some outplay it, some don’t live up to it. I was just posting his draft profile. 

 

Darnold isn’t my first choice, because I think he’s too raw for what the Bills need.

[Tyrod's friend]

9 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

 

... Darnold took a redshirt year, but really only played for two seasons. Additionally, he only started one season in High school. We are talking about a guy with a true lack of experience ...

I understand the idea of the play being projectable - but really, isn't that the entire NFL draft process? Nobody wants a 5'7" player out of NCAA. it just doesn't matter.

But the idea of a player with basically three years of experience in total in his background getting his experience against LeBeau and Belichek? And it's more than that. It's literally his decision making process, what is going through his head. Now we are going to send that decision making process through the stratosphere in terms of speed and you are asking him to learn on the job. I realize the flaws in the comparison but Josh Rosen probably threw more passes in high school than Darnold has in his entire career. 

Can it be done? It gets back to the initial point of projectability. I make the point frequently about muscle memory and that last 1/8 second between your eye/mind/motion. Sam Darnold is going to literally build those synapses in the NFL and perhaps even more risk than Josh Allen. Hey I'm guessing, I get it.

There would have been two components that would have tempered my thought - that Darnold improved dramatically in his second season, and that he already was advanced in his decision making. Instead he regressed somewhat and when his decision making has been there, it's been because of ability and not the decision itself. 

 

Armchair gm here, admittedly. 

Cheers,
Alex

[Fan in Chicago]

9 hours ago, FeelingOnYouboty said:

 

He’s not someone you should be taking serious. Any chance to bring up the Patriots and he’ll do it. It’s absurd to believe the Patriots have enough to get to #10 let alone the first overall pick lol

What if crazy Belichick dangles Brady as trade bait?

[Chuck Wagon]

15 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

The perspective on this from Browns media is that this is smart of the Bills to try to flush out the Browns pick before trading to 2. The reasoning is that it’s very late in the #process for a full blown workout. They want to make sure the Browns take him at 1 so the Giants guy is gone and their trade goes through.  The Browns can try to stop the workout by giving Darnold a confidential promise that he’s going 1 and not to risk injury by working out for the Bills. Then the Bills know he’s the first pick and can know 2 is viable.

 

thoughts?

 

 

Beane could also play the Browns if he knows they value both 12 and 22.  If they want him to trade to 4, he can hold out 22 and still beat any offer.  For the last week or so I've felt the "needing to trade up to trade up again" was vastly overrated, the Giants could really use a massive influx of cheap young talent across the roster and the Browns need a couple key positions that lack value at 4 and fall outside of their picks in the 2nd round.  If the Browns really do have Darnold and Allen equal, I could certainly see them put #1 on the table to get the massive haul.

[MrEpsYtown]

1 minute ago, Tyrod's friend said:

I understand the idea of the play being projectable - but really, isn't that the entire NFL draft process? Nobody wants a 5'7" player out of NCAA. it just doesn't matter.

But the idea of a player with basically three years of experience in total in his background getting his experience against LeBeau and Belichek? And it's more than that. It's literally his decision making process, what is going through his head. Now we are going to send that decision making process through the stratosphere in terms of speed and you are asking him to learn on the job. I realize the flaws in the comparison but Josh Rosen probably threw more passes in high school than Darnold has in his entire career. 

Can it be done? It gets back to the initial point of projectability. I make the point frequently about muscle memory and that last 1/8 second between your eye/mind/motion. Sam Darnold is going to literally build those synapses in the NFL and perhaps even more risk than Josh Allen. Hey I'm guessing, I get it.

There would have been two components that would have tempered my thought - that Darnold improved dramatically in his second season, and that he already was advanced in his decision making. Instead he regressed somewhat and when his decision making has been there, it's been because of ability and not the decision itself. 

 

Armchair gm here, admittedly. 

Cheers,
Alex

 

Absolutely. Sam needs probably two years on the bench, but that probably won't happen. If he goes to the Browns and starts right away, I think he will bust. I think they will be smart about it, the way Hue Jackson and company kept Carson Palmer off the field a few years back. Pretty much no matter what, they did not let him start for that entire year. With Tyrod Taylor and Drew Stanton, they can keep Darnold on the bench. Will they have the patience and focus to do that? Who knows, but scouts see an underdeveloped Andrew Luck .

 

I do think it makes sense for him to be in the NFL developing under Hue and Todd Haley rather than back at USC developing with Tee Martin and Clay Helton's son. 

 

To me, there are two quarterbacks who can start right away in the NFL and those are Baker Mayfield and Josh Rosen. That doesn't mean that they can start and be good, but they are the most NFL ready. I don't love Mayfield, but I could see a team altering their offense for him like Bill O'Brien did for Watson and him having success early. But this is what happened with RG3 and Kaepernick. They lit the world on fire running college plays, and then when they were asked to do NFL quarterback things, they were terrible. That's what I foresee for Watson, and probably Mayfield as well. Early success and then flame out. Teams are going to blitz his balls off. To me , Rosen is the one with the best combination of physical traits, arm talent, football IQ, and projectability. But I would not be upset with any of Darnold, Rosen, Allen, or Mayfield. 

[Chris66]

Cant see the Bills getting to 2 from 12. Also cant see them moving from 12 to 5,6, or 7 and have any draft capitol left to trade. Darnold, Rosen is a pipe dream.

Broncos are in better position to move up since they are already top 5.

[YoloinOhio]

On 4/9/2018 at 7:21 PM, billspro said:

 

How awesome would it be for the Bills to have the Browns and the Giants bidding to trade down. There is no doubt an elite player will fall to 12 with all the QBs being drafted.

Now they are also saying that they don’t think Darnold’s agent would let him work out for a team picking out of the top 10....they think it’s because the Bills have a plan to get in the top 5, and informed Darnold’s camp.

[Roundybout]

2 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

Now they are also saying that they don’t think Darnold’s agent would let him work out for a team picking out of the top 10....they think it’s because the Bills have a plan to get in the top 5, and informed Darnold’s camp.