Frankly Speaking ~ A Non-Political Thought About Ethnicity & the QB Spot.

[Teddy KGB]

I would choose NBA or MLB > NFL all day if I had the skills to excel in each. 

 

Some guy named Greg Holland just signed a one year 14 million dollar deal in baseball.  

 

Thats a sweet deal for a middle reliever. 

[Domdab99]

1 hour ago, dulles said:

How does that work?  You concede the very concepts to which I point your attention, yet declare that I need a reading comprehension class?  
The point of my "Hardwood Classics" jab illustrates the point.  The OP didn't need to declare the predominant racial makeup of the NBA nor does he need to explicitly remind us of the QB situation in the NFL.  Those things are obvious to even the casual reader.  

 

But again...so what? Pointing out the obvious isn't interesting, nor an argument or point of view of anything. He's simply stating a fact. It's like saying, 

 

"Um, gee guys, I don't want to be controversial, but I just thought I should point out that black people make up a greater percentage of incarcerated citizens than any other race."

 

Well, no ****. But so what? What's your point?

 

And that's my question to OP...what's your point? 

 

He says he's going to be discussing ethnicity, but he instead gives us a personal opinion on why he'd rather be an NBA player than an NFL player. 

 

 

Edited April 1, 2018 by Domdab99

[Tyrod's friend]

1 hour ago, BadLandsMeanie said:

Hello everyone and welcome to Frankly Speaking.

 

 

Frankly Speaking is straight talk about The Buffalo Bills, the team that put the “We” in weenie.

 

This topic is a perilous one but I will go ahead and say what I think. I hope everyone will please allow me the kindness to believe me when I say I am on the level and I have no agenda here aside from suggesting an idea.

 

That is the truth. Please read what I say before forming an opinion about the post, the idea, or me.

 

This post is about an idea I have that I think is worth considering when we look at the ethnicity of NFL quarterbacks.

 

I will begin by mentioning that almost nobody can do it. Almost nobody can be a top NFL QB. At most there are 16 above average quarterbacks out of every male in the US who would like to do that job.

 

So what does that amount to? One in a million eligible males? One in two million? I don't know but it is a very, very small percentage.

 

 

A short incomplete list of what a man needs to be a prototypical NFL Quarterback is to:

 

Be 6'2” to 6'6”.

Be solidly built enough to take hits.

Be able to understand the defense a team is likely to throw at you.

Be able to track a lot of moving players (receivers and d-backs etc).

Have a mental picture of where your teammates are supposed to be at a given time.

Know what they are going to do.

Be able to do all that very quickly.

Be able to repeatedly throw the ball on target very reliably.

 

So picture the group of men who can do all that at a very high level.

 

Now take away everyone from that small group, who also has the skills to play professional basketball.

 

Who do we have left?

 

 

Expanding the viewpoint beyond the football world to include American sports in general, it seems to me the overlap between body type and skills and drive and dedication needed, is between quarterback and basketball player.

 

The rest of the NFL players are too big and heavy, or too short, or can't throw.

People start to track into the sports they dedicate to when they are 11 or 12 years old or even younger. It is way easier to find out you are good at basketball. All you need is a ball and a couple of friends. And you can play all the time. Football is more like joining the Marines and you need all kind of people and playbooks and equipment and a whole giant field. And you get to play half of a what, 8 games a year? So you work all year to play 4 hours of football at the high school level.

 

 

I like basketball it is fun to play. So maybe that effects my idea here but if I had been good enough at it there is no question I would have gone that way.

 

I don't know how much it matters at that point but playing for the NBA is way better in terms of money and practice and not getting injured and pay and longevity.

 

NBA players make something like 3 times the money and they don't have to end up with their head held on by bolts like Manning and limping around or having their legs broken off and stuff. And they get to play much , much more instead of training nearly all the time to play what amounts to 8 hours a year.

 

 

It would be a dream come true if I could QB the Bills to a championship. There is nothing I would like more in the sports world. But the NBA? I would be an NBA player if I could choose. And I kind of hate to say it, but for me it wouldn't even be close. I like to watch football way better but playing basketball is very fun and I would do it in a heartbeat.

 

And I think that is what they do, like I would do.

 

I am not saying there are a ton of people who could be good QBs in the NBA. Remember almost nobody, out of everybody, can do it.

 

But I bet ya there are 5.

 

This is not meant to be anything but to convey an idea about mental picture. LeBron here doesn't even look but he knows where to pass the ball. Plus it is just a fun clip all on it's own.

 

Thanks for reading I hope it was ok to say.

 

 

 

 

 

You can say he was rambling; that he maltreated the word "ethnicity". 

But you must admit it is at least an original take.
 

[nedboy7]

Uh oh. Someone made the heina pack mad. Better pray for your soul bro. 

[BringBackOrton]

7 minutes ago, nedboy7 said:

Uh oh. Someone made the heina pack mad. Better pray for your soul bro. 

Let me guess, you're upset about the Wonderlic thread?

[SinceThe70s]

17 minutes ago, Teddy KGB said:

I would choose NBA or MLB > NFL all day if I had the skills to excel in each. 

 

Some guy named Greg Holland just signed a one year 14 million dollar deal in baseball.  

 

Thats a sweet deal for a middle reliever. 

 

Thanks for the opportunity to derail this thread. Are you referring to the Greg Holland who was tied for the NL lead in saves in 2017? That's gotta be a record for a middle reliever.

[MJS]

I don't quite understand what your point was. There are some basketball players that could play QB? So you think if it wasn't for basketball that there would be more African American QB's?

[Meh.]

25 minutes ago, Teddy KGB said:

I would choose NBA or MLB > NFL all day if I had the skills to excel in each. 

 

Some guy named Greg Holland just signed a one year 14 million dollar deal in baseball.  

 

Thats a sweet deal for a middle reliever. 

Imagine if all the NFL QBs who got drafted by Major League Baseball had opted to go that route... Tom Brady as a Montreal Expo, anyone?

[Teddy KGB]

10 minutes ago, SinceThe70s said:

 

Thanks for the opportunity to derail this thread. Are you referring to the Greg Holland who was tied for the NL lead in saves in 2017? That's gotta be a record for a middle reliever.

 

3.61 ERA.    Must be awesome. 

 

Apologies to the Holland fans out there.    Don’t follow baseball as much as I used to.  

[Boatdrinks]

tune in next time to the second episode of frankly speaking... " A non political thought about ethnicity and the CB position in the NFL" 

[JoPar_v2]

Man people are trying to brand their message board posts now? God what’s next? Is OP going to incorporate a theme song in all his future posts? The cringe is off the charts with this one.

 

when did stuff like this creep in here? Was it a thing at BBMB? 

[SinceThe70s]

5 minutes ago, Teddy KGB said:

 

3.61 ERA.    Must be awesome. 

 

Apologies to the Holland fans out there.    Don’t follow baseball as much as I used to.  

 

I had no idea who Mr. 3.61 ERA was either before I saw the headline about the signing recently. 

 

Just seemed like a good opportunity to derail what I thought was a silly thread. Carry on.

[BadLandsMeanie]

12 minutes ago, MJS said:

I don't quite understand what your point was. There are some basketball players that could play QB? So you think if it wasn't for basketball that there would be more African American QB's?

Yes.

 

It is hard, or impossible to word things nowadays without inflaming someone. But yes that is what I was trying to say.

 

Maybe there is no conspiracy where teams and coaches would much rather lose than have  a black QB.

 

And there is no magical quality black athletes don't have that makes them so they can't often be elite quarterbacks.

 

IT might be as simple as they are playing basketball. The elite athletes in the black community who have the size and other attributes needed to play QB, are instead playing basketball.  They don't play football because they don't want to. Not because they can't. Not because nobody will let them. But because they would rather play b-ball.

 

That is a legitimate possibility. It isn't stupid. It isn't racist. And it isn't political.  But I am pretty sure it will be called all 3 things.

 

 

5 minutes ago, JoPar_v2 said:

Man people are trying to brand their message board posts now? God what’s next? Is OP going to incorporate a theme song in all his future posts? The cringe is off the charts with this one.

 

when did stuff like this creep in here? Was it a thing at BBMB? 

It was for me

 

I had't thought of a theme song. I don't suppose you can produce it for me?

[Formerly Allan in MD]

I need an Advil.

[brianthomas]

when's the Draft again? Cant get here soon enough haha

[Mickey]

Lurking in the dense fog of verbiage that is this post are some worthwhile issues that could have been discussed that were not. There are factors that can have an effect on what sports a High School offers and which sports attract the best athletes that seem to me to be of far more importance than the factors this poster appears to raise though honestly, I am not sure what he was trying to say. Issues like resegregation, shrinking budgets, school secession and unequal school resources play a part.  Its infinitely cheaper to field a basketball team than a football team. Poorer schools in rural areas and in cities are often going to struggle to keep decent football programs afloat. Not so with basketball. The result is going to be fewer good football players from that school but plenty of good basketball players. 

 

Here in Syracuse, the best HS football team is almost invariably CBA, a private school whose tuition rivals that of most colleges. As a catholic school, they can recruit kids from any school district and offer them scholarships to attend CBA for free. Their facilities, coaches and equipment are all top notch. Liverpool is also a powerhouse as they have the largest population and tax base. They have excellent coaches, training facilities and other equipment. At one time they had two freshman and two JV teams feeding the varsity roster. Many of the city schools which used to dominate in years past are struggling just to keep a team on the field. And its not just a HS problem, the peewee and pop warner teams in the city have all but evaporated for want of funding. I was an assistant coach for one of them and it was a major challenge just figuring out how to get the kids to practice as so many of their parents were working 2 and 3 jobs. 

 

The problem isn't limited to just football. City schools in Syracuse used to field excellent girls soccer teams. Not anymore. They have had to resort to fielding a combined team that draws players from the entire district. Even so, they play on a field with no bleachers, no restrooms, no loudspeaker and more rocks and broken glass than grass. Part of their problem is the fallout from the football teams. These schools increasingly have to reduce the budgets for anything that isn't football to keep their football programs lurching along. Thus they siphon funds from the soccer teams, the swim teams, the lacrosse teams, etc in a losing effort to remain competitive in football.

 

We will never know how many great athletes are lost along the way to poverty. There are loads of small rural schools in CNY who don't have the numbers or the money to filed a football program. I don't really care how any of this effects the NFL, I do care about the effect it has on middle school and HS athletes of all sports.

[cba fan]

5 hours ago, aceman_16 said:

I just lost 2 IQ points reading the OP and I have very little leeway to lose any.

lol...

 

If you had LeBron sending passes your way you would get those 2 pts back in a hurry.

[transplantbillsfan]

6 hours ago, jmc12290 said:

What was the thought about ethnicity?

 

My thought, too

[slaphappy]

5 hours ago, Teddy KGB said:

I would choose NBA or MLB > NFL all day if I had the skills to excel in each. 

 

Some guy named Greg Holland just signed a one year 14 million dollar deal in baseball.  

 

Thats a sweet deal for a middle reliever. 

I'd love to play baseball because I love doing it.. and yeah that money is pretty sweet. But if I was going to choose a skill it would be golf. I hate watching it because it bores me into a coma..and I'm pretty bad at it so playing isn't much fun either. But it would be if I was good at it and getting paid.

 

Almost always playing in warm, sunny weather.. can play for years and years because there isn't much wear and tear on the body. And hot chicks.. I don't know what hot chicks has to do with anything but I always have to throw in hot chicks.

Edited April 1, 2018 by slaphappy

[smuvtalker]

28 minutes ago, Mickey said:

Lurking in the dense fog of verbiage that is this post are some worthwhile issues that could have been discussed that were not. There are factors that can have an effect on what sports a High School offers and which sports attract the best athletes that seem to me to be of far more importance than the factors this poster appears to raise though honestly, I am not sure what he was trying to say. Issues like resegregation, shrinking budgets, school secession and unequal school resources play a part.  Its infinitely cheaper to field a basketball team than a football team. Poorer schools in rural areas and in cities are often going to struggle to keep decent football programs afloat. Not so with basketball. The result is going to be fewer good football players from that school but plenty of good basketball players. 

 

Here in Syracuse, the best HS football team is almost invariably CBA, a private school whose tuition rivals that of most colleges. As a catholic school, they can recruit kids from any school district and offer them scholarships to attend CBA for free. Their facilities, coaches and equipment are all top notch. Liverpool is also a powerhouse as they have the largest population and tax base. They have excellent coaches, training facilities and other equipment. At one time they had two freshman and two JV teams feeding the varsity roster. Many of the city schools which used to dominate in years past are struggling just to keep a team on the field. And its not just a HS problem, the peewee and pop warner teams in the city have all but evaporated for want of funding. I was an assistant coach for one of them and it was a major challenge just figuring out how to get the kids to practice as so many of their parents were working 2 and 3 jobs. 

 

The problem isn't limited to just football. City schools in Syracuse used to field excellent girls soccer teams. Not anymore. They have had to resort to fielding a combined team that draws players from the entire district. Even so, they play on a field with no bleachers, no restrooms, no loudspeaker and more rocks and broken glass than grass. Part of their problem is the fallout from the football teams. These schools increasingly have to reduce the budgets for anything that isn't football to keep their football programs lurching along. Thus they siphon funds from the soccer teams, the swim teams, the lacrosse teams, etc in a losing effort to remain competitive in football.

 

We will never know how many great athletes are lost along the way to poverty. There are loads of small rural schools in CNY who don't have the numbers or the money to filed a football program. I don't really care how any of this effects the NFL, I do care about the effect it has on middle school and HS athletes of all sports.

I think you bring up some excellent points in this post, to which I can say, i agree with pretty much all of them.  The issue i see made most clearly, and most often from you is that there might be more great black football players if there was better funding in the inner city, rural, and less-privileged areas to create more legitimate, nicer, better-coached, and more attractive football programs. 

 

However, don't think that is the point that the OP was trying to make in his post.  i took from his "post", that he feels that the only real reason there is a lack of black quarterbacks in the NFL is because the black athlete who is better physically equipped to play QB would simply rather play basketball.  Simple as that, am I correct OP?  If so, I don't necessarily disagree with that sentiment, because I'm quite certain there ARE plenty of black kids who are physically built with a prototypical NFL size, (6'5, 240) who would much rather play basketball than football.  It could be for a number of reasons...perhaps like you mentioned, they grew up loving basketball more than other sports they learned, including football.  Maybe they never even tried playing football at all, or just didn't like it.  You also mentioned that there is no magical quality that black men don't have that enables them to excel at the QB position.  You are right.  if you take a handful of the greatest QBs of all-time, Manning, Brady, Favre, Brees, Montana, and dissect them from top to bottom, you'll find nothing in them that they have that no black quarterback has.  We're all created exactly the same. 

 

in my opinion, what separates these quarterbacks from the rest, is their intellect.  Please don't mistake this as me saying that black quarterbacks are not smart enough to play the position, as that is not my viewpoint at all.  But the QB position is by far the most cerebral position in football, and to be successful, the most vital mental attributes you must have are: 1)the ability to read defenses, pre and post snap. you MUST be able to process what you are seeing from the defense, know what they plan on bringing at you in the next 15 seconds, make necessary audibles, and have all 10 other guys where they're supposed to be.  There's a reason the delay of game penalty is always called on the quarterback, no matter who wasn't ready.  2)the ability to QUICKLY go through your progressions once the ball is snapped, anticipating the pass rush, feeling it, knowing how to step up in the pocket, or slide AWAY from the direction of the oncoming rusher, ALL THE WHILE still keeping your eyes upfield, finding the open receiver(and that doesn't mean sitting all alone at a spot on the field, or streaking down the sideline with a two-step separation from the DB.  open meaning seeing where the receiver IS, "anticipating' where he's going to be, and throwing the ball to a spot that allows him to continue running his route and gain separation from the DB, and making a catch that also enables him to continue running without having to break his stride, jump, change his body direction thus ending the catch there.  Being able to throw a receiver open is an invaluable asset for a QB have to begin to be considered "great' or "elite". 

 

Those two traits alone are among the most difficult to possess, and while they can certainly be learned, feel like many of the great ones were blessed with these gifts early on, and were able to easily develop them to where they were just a part of their brain.  It is a combination of mental-makeup, quick problem solving skills, plus quick-twitch muscle firing ability that allows them to do this, and make the kind of throws that drop jaws with relative ease.  It is not something exclusive to white quarterbacks by any means.  Warren Moon was an absolute surgeon with the football, and I remember watching him slice, dice, filet, torch, and destroy a Buffalo Bills secondary to the tune of 35 points in just over 2 quarters.  To this day I don't know if I've seen a more accurate display of passing in such a short amount of time from anyone else. (Thank God almighty that it was in His plan for us to win that day, because WM was hotter than the sun) With that said, I think that with the QB position requiring a much greater cerebal capacity, the mental demands that come with playing the position could make it a much less attractive option than maybe in years past, that perhaps that in itself could be a reason that a black athlete otherwise physically equipped to play might just say, no thanks.  I'd rather play basketball.  A sport that requires less thought can easily be more attractive to every race of athlete.  And hell, it's not just black QBs that come out of college that aren't successful.  Most QBs that come out of college aren't successful.  But with regard to race, what I really am getting sick of is as soon as someone makes a comment that they don't like Lamar Jackson, or they didn't like Tyrod, they are considered racist.  Why can't they just not like them because they think they suck?  Or not like the fact that Tyrod held the ball too long?  Or that he refused to throw to receivers that weren't open enough to smoke a cigarette?  Or that in his final game, his audition tape for the rest of the NFL, a playoff game nonetheless, he did all of the things that made people go bonkers?  Refusing to throw the ball, never taking chances, even with the game almost over, down by one score.   Why can't they not like Lamar because his main knocks are accuracy issues, inability to read defenses, and happy feet?  While I don't doubt for a second that there are probably more people on this site that don't like Taylor or Jackson because of the color of their skin than i'd care to ever know, I do feel like it's getting to a point where people are afraid to say anything negative about a black QB for fear of being called a racist.  Somethin's gotta give soon people. 

.