Mikie2times Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 I think reasons exist why less NFL QB's are black. I know these reasons have nothing to do with the color of a persons skin, nor can they be explained with one theory. It's more likely a result of multiple factors.
Gugny Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 I'll speak frankly about the topic. The greatest QBs of all-time are all white. Most QBs in the league are white. So !@#$ing what? It happens to be a position in football in which white men succeed more frequently than black men. No one likes to talk about Cornerbacks like this. You know why? Because it doesn't !@#$ing matter. SI actually did a story on it: https://www.si.com/nfl/2017/04/26/white-cornerbacks-jason-sehorn-kevin-kaesviharn-donny-lisowski "All 64 starting cornerbacks in the NFL are black. So are their backups. One hundred-sixty black cornerbacks, give or take. Not a single white one. It’s been this way for more than 10 years." This is why it pissed me off so badly when Tyrod Taylor whipped out the race card (yes - he did - go look it up). It was unnecessary and it was nothing but deflection. Sometimes, white people do better at certain things; sometimes black people do better at certain things. Big !@#$ing deal. 2 3
BadLandsMeanie Posted April 1, 2018 Author Posted April 1, 2018 8 hours ago, smuvtalker said: i took from his "post", that he feels that the only real reason there is a lack of black quarterbacks in the NFL is because the black athlete who is better physically equipped to play QB would simply rather play basketball. Simple as that, am I correct OP? 2)the ability to QUICKLY go through your progressions once the ball is snapped, anticipating the pass rush, feeling it, knowing how to step up in the pocket, or slide AWAY from the direction of the oncoming rusher, ALL THE WHILE still keeping your eyes upfield, finding the open receiver(and that doesn't mean sitting all alone at a spot on the field, or streaking down the sideline with a two-step separation from the DB. open meaning seeing where the receiver IS, "anticipating' where he's going to be, and throwing the ball to a spot that allows him to continue running his route and gain separation from the DB, and making a catch that also enables him to continue running without having to break his stride, jump, change his body direction thus ending the catch there. Being able to throw a receiver open is an invaluable asset for a QB have to begin to be considered "great' or "elite". Those two traits alone are among the most difficult to possess, and while they can certainly be learned, feel like many of the great ones were blessed with these gifts early on, and were able to easily develop them to where they were just a part of their brain. I do feel like it's getting to a point where people are afraid to say anything negative about a black QB for fear of being called a racist. Somethin's gotta give soon people. . Hey Smuv thanks for your thoughtful reply. About your question. Yes that is what I was trying to say. Except that I wouldn't say it is the only reason. But I bet it is a big reason. About your 2 point. I like basketball. So I understand it fairly well and sometimes the pace is slow. But when things start moving fast a point guard has to know where every player on the court is, where he is supposed to go, what the defense is likely to do, by heart and with no huddle except after a time out. He has to distribute the ball or keep it and it all happens extremely quickly. It is a mental moving picture so he can know where everyone is without having to look. To me there is a great deal of overlap between doing that and being a QB. On your third point, to me the discussion on the mater is restricted entirely to if we have a race based difference in ability, or if we have racism. Both I think are agendas from people who are stuck on race or have a philosophy to advance. And neither side is using their full intelligence or even trying to. And everybody else gets stuck in the middle and can't say anything for fear of becoming swept up and accused in one way or another. When I thought about the circumstances in an open way just looking for information and ideas, and not having tunnel vision about football alone but the larger context, is when it occurred to me about where the overlap is between the NFL and other sports that could play a part in directing what talent is available to the NFL pool. 1
Foxx Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 2 minutes ago, Gugny said: I'll speak frankly about the topic. The greatest QBs of all-time are all white. Most QBs in the league are white. So !@#$ing what? It happens to be a position in football in which white men succeed more frequently than black men. No one likes to talk about Cornerbacks like this. You know why? Because it doesn't !@#$ing matter. SI actually did a story on it: https://www.si.com/nfl/2017/04/26/white-cornerbacks-jason-sehorn-kevin-kaesviharn-donny-lisowski "All 64 starting cornerbacks in the NFL are black. So are their backups. One hundred-sixty black cornerbacks, give or take. Not a single white one. It’s been this way for more than 10 years." This is why it pissed me off so badly when Tyrod Taylor whipped out the race card (yes - he did - go look it up). It was unnecessary and it was nothing but deflection. Sometimes, white people do better at certain things; sometimes black people do better at certain things. Big !@#$ing deal. this then begs the question... why? therein lies the potential, big !@#$ing deal.
BringBackOrton Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Foxx said: this then begs the question... why? therein lies the potential, big !@#$ing deal. It's a big deal there are more black CB's than white CB's? It's a big deal there are more black NBAers than white NBAers? Edited April 1, 2018 by jmc12290
Foxx Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 (edited) 4 minutes ago, jmc12290 said: It's a big deal there are more black CB's than white CB's? It's a big deal there are more black NBAers than white NBAers? reading comprehension helps. why, was the 'potential' qualifier here. Edited April 1, 2018 by Foxx
BringBackOrton Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 3 minutes ago, Foxx said: reading comprehension helps. why, was the 'potential' qualifier here. Why does the potential only play one way? Do you think it's a potential big deal there are more black CB's than white CB's? Do you think it's a potential big deal there are more black NBAers than white NBAers?
Foxx Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 4 minutes ago, jmc12290 said: Why does the potential only play one way? Do you think it's a potential big deal there are more black CB's than white CB's? Do you think it's a potential big deal there are more black NBAers than white NBAers? :sigh: i guess it depends upon the answer to the, 'why' question. however to answer your questions directly... no and no.
BringBackOrton Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 1 minute ago, Foxx said: :sigh: i guess it depends upon the answer to the, 'why' question. however to answer your questions directly... no and no. Why?
smuvtalker Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 3 hours ago, Gugny said: I'll speak frankly about the topic. The greatest QBs of all-time are all white. Most QBs in the league are white. So !@#$ing what? It happens to be a position in football in which white men succeed more frequently than black men. No one likes to talk about Cornerbacks like this. You know why? Because it doesn't !@#$ing matter. SI actually did a story on it: https://www.si.com/nfl/2017/04/26/white-cornerbacks-jason-sehorn-kevin-kaesviharn-donny-lisowski "All 64 starting cornerbacks in the NFL are black. So are their backups. One hundred-sixty black cornerbacks, give or take. Not a single white one. It’s been this way for more than 10 years." This is why it pissed me off so badly when Tyrod Taylor whipped out the race card (yes - he did - go look it up). It was unnecessary and it was nothing but deflection. Sometimes, white people do better at certain things; sometimes black people do better at certain things. Big !@#$ing deal. Holy crap thank you for saying what I was attempting to say last night in WAY less words lol. it completely pissed me off when Tyrod pulled out the race card. i tihnk the biggest reason it pissed me off is because it was, like you said, 100% unnecessary, and in my opinion none of the criticisms levied against him were far-fetched, overexaggerated or grossly inaccurate. And it surprised the heck out of me because football talent aside, Tyrod to me is genuinely a good guy. Humble, hard worker, good attitude, the type of personality you want on your team. So when he said that, I was just like WOW. 1
stinky finger Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 18 hours ago, Domdab99 said: what did any of that have to do with ethnicity?? What, are you Polish? 1
smuvtalker Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 3 hours ago, BadLandsMeanie said: Hey Smuv thanks for your thoughtful reply. About your question. Yes that is what I was trying to say. Except that I wouldn't say it is the only reason. But I bet it is a big reason. About your 2 point. I like basketball. So I understand it fairly well and sometimes the pace is slow. But when things start moving fast a point guard has to know where every player on the court is, where he is supposed to go, what the defense is likely to do, by heart and with no huddle except after a time out. He has to distribute the ball or keep it and it all happens extremely quickly. It is a mental moving picture so he can know where everyone is without having to look. To me there is a great deal of overlap between doing that and being a QB. On your third point, to me the discussion on the mater is restricted entirely to if we have a race based difference in ability, or if we have racism. Both I think are agendas from people who are stuck on race or have a philosophy to advance. And neither side is using their full intelligence or even trying to. And everybody else gets stuck in the middle and can't say anything for fear of becoming swept up and accused in one way or another. When I thought about the circumstances in an open way just looking for information and ideas, and not having tunnel vision about football alone but the larger context, is when it occurred to me about where the overlap is between the NFL and other sports that could play a part in directing what talent is available to the NFL pool. Great point about the comparison to the QB and the point guard. Many similarities and I am completely in awe of some of the plays point guards make. i could sit and watch Magic Johnson's highlight reels for hours and not see the same play twice. iMO he is the greatest PG of all time, hands down. And he was 6'9! To me he is one of the players that I don't think there will ever be another comparable. if i had to give my list of 'the ones', by position, meaning they have no equal, i would say PG-Magic, SG-Jordan, SF-Dr J PF-Barkley, C-Chamberlain. i would love for race to not be such a hot button issue when discussing players, and i think that the reason it is is because we have just become so sensitive of a society now, people can't speak their minds anymore without offending someone. Like Gugny said, hell if a black QB sucked, he sucked, and if a white sucks, he sucks.
SoCal Deek Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 What in the world is this thread about? In my experience it’s sheer mental laziness to boil things down to race. Done!
xxxxxxxx Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 (edited) 7 hours ago, SoTier said: Actually, ethnicity isn't that at all. It's the fact of belonging to/ identifying with a social group that shares a common national or cultural tradition. In the US it's primarily used to describe European Americans who have strong cultural ties to their European roots (ie, Italians, Greeks, Polish, etc) but is also frequently used to describe Latinos (Mexicans, Puerto Ricans, Brazilians, etc). Asians, too, have distinct ethnic groups like Chinese, Japanese, Koreans, etc. It's not usually associated with blacks in the US but there are a few distinct cultural groups among American blacks, most notably Haitians and Jamaicans. Ethnicity is not the same thing or even close to the same thing as "race" or "color" at all unless you go back to the archaic usage of "race" used in the late 19th century when some racist writers popularized the idea of ethnic groups as "races" as in "the German race" or "the Anglo Saxon race". Ethnicity is primarily based on culture. Race is primarily based on physical characteristics, most notably skin color. This is the correct definition. Race is the genetic sceintific term, think caucasion, and ethnicity is the social, cultural term, think Italian. The thing that confuses some people is that racism is not sceintific, its cultural. Observing physical differences between people has nothing to do with racism, but naively perscribing arbitrary values to those differences, even if differences are viewed as being positive, is what racism is all about. Edited April 1, 2018 by MURPHD6
stony Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 3 hours ago, Gugny said: I'll speak frankly about the topic. The greatest QBs of all-time are all white. Most QBs in the league are white. So !@#$ing what? It happens to be a position in football in which white men succeed more frequently than black men. No one likes to talk about Cornerbacks like this. You know why? Because it doesn't !@#$ing matter. SI actually did a story on it: https://www.si.com/nfl/2017/04/26/white-cornerbacks-jason-sehorn-kevin-kaesviharn-donny-lisowski "All 64 starting cornerbacks in the NFL are black. So are their backups. One hundred-sixty black cornerbacks, give or take. Not a single white one. It’s been this way for more than 10 years." This is why it pissed me off so badly when Tyrod Taylor whipped out the race card (yes - he did - go look it up). It was unnecessary and it was nothing but deflection. Sometimes, white people do better at certain things; sometimes black people do better at certain things. Big !@#$ing deal. White people do not dunk the basketball nearly as well as black people.
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 19 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said: What the hell? Do you even know what the word "ethnicity" means? ...EXACTLY....are we talking about ethnicity of color?.......ethnicity of origin?....do EITHER may a damn bit of difference?....a thread borne out of pure ignorance IMO..........
Meh. Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 4 hours ago, Gugny said: I'll speak frankly about the topic. The greatest QBs of all-time are all white. Most QBs in the league are white. So !@#$ing what? It happens to be a position in football in which white men succeed more frequently than black men. No one likes to talk about Cornerbacks like this. You know why? Because it doesn't !@#$ing matter. SI actually did a story on it: https://www.si.com/nfl/2017/04/26/white-cornerbacks-jason-sehorn-kevin-kaesviharn-donny-lisowski "All 64 starting cornerbacks in the NFL are black. So are their backups. One hundred-sixty black cornerbacks, give or take. Not a single white one. It’s been this way for more than 10 years." This is why it pissed me off so badly when Tyrod Taylor whipped out the race card (yes - he did - go look it up). It was unnecessary and it was nothing but deflection. Sometimes, white people do better at certain things; sometimes black people do better at certain things. Big !@#$ing deal. Good article/graphic about the cornerback position, quarterback, and center which, at least toward the end of the timeline they illustrate, is more skewed than QB. https://theundefeated.com/features/the-nfls-racial-divide/ 1
ChasBB Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 It's posts like this that keep me away from this board for days or weeks at a time. What an idiotic and senseless post by the OP. 2
xxxxxxxx Posted April 1, 2018 Posted April 1, 2018 (edited) 4 hours ago, BadLandsMeanie said: Thanks for the reply. My problem with the racial questioning is that it is not a neutral question. And people act like it is. I think you did also. So when someone says like, Oh just asking, but I wonder if you fans are behaving in a racist way? Let's discuss it. That isn't a civil, neutral, reasonable decent thing to say to someone. Especially when you don't know them. That is what I was trying to illustrate to you when I responded with the the thoughts about you being an older male expat in Cambodia. Paraphrasing: "Oh, I wonder if you moved there to exploit human beings? I am not saying for sure that is what you have done. Just that people fitting your profile do that. Can you explain why you are not there for that reason, because otherwise I don't understand why anyone would move to that nation to retire" I don't think that was inoffensive to you, in the same way your posts were not inoffensive to me. It is actually not much different at all than when the NFL asks a potential draftee if his mother is a prostitute. It is just a question right? No need to take it personally. They take it God bless them but in their place I would break the man's nose who had those words come out if his mouth asking about my mom in an interview.. People would see all the coaches with big bandages on their noses around the combine and they would know which teams had been interviewing BadLandsMeanie. About Fitz vs Tyrod I don't recall exactly but you should I think go back to board pages of that time and see what was said. I don't recall much difference at all in that people wanted him gone, thought he sucked, don't want him back, but left him alone as far as his personal qualities. The big difference is we fans were not divided over that decision and we have been divided over if Tyrod is good enough much more so. So I think fans have been fighting with each other much more over Tyrod, but I haven't seen much of anything directed at him as a person. And for sure I haven't seen the stuff that was around over "Captain Checkdown" Trent Edwards. Comical YouTube videos and even a song mocking him that was played on the radio. So again I think you and posters in the same line should do more open minded careful research before inquiring and use specific objective examples. Here's my problem with your thinking, which is well intentioned, but also reads like it is coming from an older, white gentleman (which may or may not be the case).Wanting people to do more open minded, careful research is a great thing to aspire to, so I would ask you to do the same. The definitions of race, racism, and ethnicity have expanded greatly in the last 20 years thanks to alot of impolite conversations - and it should be noted that people who are not white don't always consider racism to be an impolite topic to discuss as they deal with racism regularly. And if you insist that a conversation about race needs to be courteous, your not going to learn much, at all, about the variety of things that you might do or say that makes people who aren't like you feel like crap. You got to be willing to admit mistakes, or at least apologise, and you got to be willing to be made just as uncomfortable as your behaviors can make others feel, whether you are aware of it or not. If your not willing to do that, your not going to learn anything, and you should probably stop telling people that they need to learn more. Edited April 1, 2018 by MURPHD6
BadLandsMeanie Posted April 1, 2018 Author Posted April 1, 2018 6 minutes ago, ChasBB said: It's posts like this that keep me away from this board for days or weeks at a time. Then my work is done. See you on draft day? 1
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