Chuck Wagon Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said: Think again. Why would the Colts not take picks from the Jets that they demanded, with little to no cost to the Colts draft board? They'll likely get the same player if they stay at 6, and they are in great position to get more picks from another team if there is a QB on the board. It's a win win for the Colts and virtually risk free. I'm not sure why this is lost on many Bills fans. The Jets got played , not the Bills. The Jets didn't offer anything we couldn't beat. We simply didn't beat their offer and the Colts took it knowing what you said, they can get an elite player at 6 or trade down again. If Beane walks in there with 3 1sts and 2 2nds, the Colts don't say "no, we are just going to move to 6 instead". We didn't beat the Jets offer, the Colts claimed it was because they wanted to move to 6 so they didn't poison the PR well with us in case we are willing to meet the price for 6. 17 minutes ago, Cruiserplayer said: Or he didn’t know if the QB he covets would be there at 3. That's a fair and likely true point. But this narrative the Jets did something we couldn't beat is just BS. Edited March 21, 2018 by Chuck Wagon
Boatdrinks Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 2 minutes ago, Chuck Wagon said: The Jets didn't offer anything we couldn't beat. We simply didn't beat their offer and the Colts took it knowing what you said, they can get an elite player at 6 or trade down again. If Beane walks in there with 3 1sts and 2 2nds, the Colts don't say "no, we are just going to move to 6 instead". We didn't beat the Jets offer, the Colts claimed it was because they wanted to move to 6 so they didn't poison the PR well with us in case we are willing to meet the price for 6. That's a fair and likely true point. But this narrative the Jets did something we couldn't beat is just BS. The Jets didn't do anything the Bills couldn't beat as far as other picks goes. They had the 6th pick and the Bills had 12. End of story. The Colts patiently played their hand and are still playing. They weren't taking the Bills offer unless the Jets dropped out or wouldn't pay what their ransom note demanded . It's not really that hard to figure out. Why would they lock themselves into 12 now? They either stay at 6 and get their target player plus picks for free from the Jets. OR they move back with a QB desperate team during the draft and get picks from two teams. They had nothing to lose by waiting. 15 minutes ago, Cruiserplayer said: Or he didn’t know if the QB he covets would be there at 3. Of course he doesn't know that. He's not clairvoyant. He may have a good idea, but things can change. The draft is a month away. He was willing to make a deal for 3, and the Jets were stuck if they didn't pay up.
Chuck Wagon Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 13 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said: The Jets didn't do anything the Bills couldn't beat as far as other picks goes. They had the 6th pick and the Bills had 12. End of story. The Colts patiently played their hand and are still playing. They weren't taking the Bills offer unless the Jets dropped out or wouldn't pay what their ransom note demanded . It's not really that hard to figure out. Why would they lock themselves into 12 now? They either stay at 6 and get their target player plus picks for free from the Jets. OR they move back with a QB desperate team during the draft and get picks from two teams. They had nothing to lose by waiting. Of course he doesn't know that. He's not clairvoyant. He may have a good idea, but things can change. The draft is a month away. He was willing to make a deal for 3, and the Jets were stuck if they didn't pay up. They wouldn't lock themselves into anything, they could still easily move up or down, but it's naive at best to say the Jets put down an offer we couldn't beat. They gave up 1 first round pick in the transaction. We easily could have mitigated the difference between 6 and 12, or even worked out a deal with another team in the 7-9 range on the side, but we didn't, because we chose not to. Tell yourself what ever you want, we chose not to beat the Jets offer, likely because Beane wasn't comfortable with 3 guys at that point.
Boatdrinks Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Chuck Wagon said: They wouldn't lock themselves into anything, they could still easily move up or down, but it's naive at best to say the Jets put down an offer we couldn't beat. They gave up 1 first round pick in the transaction. We easily could have mitigated the difference between 6 and 12, or even worked out a deal with another team in the 7-9 range on the side, but we didn't, because we chose not to. Tell yourself what ever you want, we chose not to beat the Jets offer, likely because Beane wasn't comfortable with 3 guys at that point. Again I don't think it was an offer the Bills couldn't beat in a literal sense. They couldn't beat it because the Colts didn't want what they were selling. The 6th pick was what they wanted, not 12. Its not as simple as saying the Bills could have just threw another pick on the pile. They didn't possess a high pick, so a deal wasn't being accepted unless the Jets refused to play along. If the Colts move to 12, they're done moving back and getting a ransom of picks in the process. To think they could beat the 6th pick is ignoring the obvious. The difference between 6-12 is not getting possibly the top two players on a teams board. Not happening. If they make that big a move down, they're going to get picks out of two teams not just one. If you think Beane wasn't comfortable at pick 3, why were they talking to the Colts? To force the Jets to move up? Of course not. They need a QB, have a ranking on the QBs, and almost certainly like some QBs that many fans don't . They're going to take a QB in round one, but prepare to be disappointed with their choice. They don't own a top two pick, and the Giants may not be willing to move. Edited March 21, 2018 by Boatdrinks 1
Chuck Wagon Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said: Again I don't think it was an offer the Bills couldn't beat in a literal sense. They couldn't beat it because the Colts didn't want what they were selling. The 6th pick was what they wanted, not 12. Its not as simple as saying the Bills could have just threw another pick on the pile. They didn't possess a high pick, so a deal wasn't being accepted unless the Jets refused to play along. If the Colts move to 12, they're done moving back and getting a ransom of picks in the process. To think they could beat the 6th pick is ignoring the obvious. The difference between 6-12 is not getting possibly the top two players on a teams board. Not happening. If they make that big a move down, they're going to get picks out of two teams not just one. If you think Beane wasn't comfortable at pick 3, why were they talking to the Colts? To force the Jets to move up? Of course not. They need a QB, have a ranking in QBs, and almost certainly like some QBs that many fans don't . They're going to take a QB in round one, but prepare to be disappointed with their choice. They don't own a top two pick, and the Giants may not be willing to move. Again. If Beane walks in and says "I know the Jets are offering #6 and 3 2nds, but we'll give you 3 1sts and 2 nds", the Colts don't turn that down over the difference between 6 and 12. You are contradicting yourself, you say they werent willing to go 12 over 6 in one line then turn around and say they want picks from two different teams. They are clearly willing to move out of 6, they've said as much, we just would have had to pay the price of two moves. We could have. We chose not to. Edited March 21, 2018 by Chuck Wagon
Boatdrinks Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 5 minutes ago, Chuck Wagon said: Again. If Beane walks in and says "I know the Jets are offering #6 and 3 2nds, but we'll give you 3 1sts and 2 nds", the Colts don't turn that down over the difference between 6 and 12. You are contradicting yourself, you say they werent willing to go 12 over 6 in one line then turn around and say they want picks from two different teams. They are clearly willing to move out of 6, they've said as much, we just would have had to pay the price of two moves. We could have. We chose not to. I disagree and I'm not contradicting myself. They weren't willing to lock themselves into 12 , when QB desperate teams will be even more desperate. The Colts chose a no risk move with the Jets at 6, a pick the Bills couldn't possibly offer no matter how hard you try to convince yourself that they could. They are willing to move again if the price is greater, which they forced up by taking the Jets offer. If not they have a no risk move they could live with. Ballard said he's willing to move again if the price is right. That's code for " my price went up". You may say they don't turn the offer down, but they wanted the 6th pick. The Bills couldn't beat that.
smuvtalker Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 3 hours ago, kdiggz said: If Giants go QB then we will be hoping a QB drops (I doubt it) or we will need to be ok with Lamar Jackson (I'm not). After 20 yrs I need a QB. It's so painful watching your favorite team when they don't have a QB. Even if we get a guy and we still stink as a team like Stafford in Detroit, it will still be so much more enjoyable and exciting to see a team that can actually throw the ball down the field. If we got to 2 and took Rosen I think I would just collapse and cry tears of joy. It's been so long, it's going to be an emotional moment either way This. This x 1,000 %. I admit it, wholeheartedly, that I too, sit on Sundays, and am filled with jealousy, frustration and anger. Watching quarterbacks sling it down the field with ease, seeing offenses run like powerful yet smooth engines, almost making throwing for 300 yards look effortless, happenstance even.(jealousy) Then I watch our Bills struggle so mightily at times just to get a first down. I watch our QB miss badly on a deep crossing pattern, overthrowing the receiver by 40 yards, then miss on a 7 yard out pattern, chucking the ball at the receivers feet. Then on 3rd down I watch him grossly lead his receiver 3 yards too far on a crossing pattern, getting that receiver instantly decapitated in the process. (frustration) And all I do is think, when will it be our turn? I really do believe this is our year...
Sky Diver Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 Not a fan. Slight build and injury prone with a history of concussions. Doesn't seem like a good locker room guy either.
BuffAlone Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 2 hours ago, Sky Diver said: Not a fan. Slight build and injury prone with a history of concussions. Doesn't seem like a good locker room guy either. Rosen has the Best mechanics entering the league in a while. That should count for something. No need to sit him, he's ready now. The rest? Idk
Sky Diver Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 (edited) 50 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: I hope so since he is dropping out of college. Started classes in January 2015 and hasn't graduated? Hmm. I thought he was a genius? Edited March 21, 2018 by Sky Diver
DFT Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 3 minutes ago, BuffAlone said: Rosen has the Best mechanics entering the league in a while. That should count for something. No need to sit him, he's ready now. The rest? Idk Best mechanics, passing motion, arguably the nicest and fastest release, outstanding vision, understands progressions and stays incredibly cool under duress. Great combo of arm strength and accuracy as well. He just needs to prove the “iron-will” piece to teams and he’ll have a tremendous career ahead of him, in my opinion.
Sky Diver Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 (edited) Had surgery to his throwing shoulder. Recently had two concussions in 4 weeks. Missed the Cactus Bowl. Durability is a big question mark. Edited March 21, 2018 by Sky Diver
D. L. Hot-Flamethrower Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 3 hours ago, Sky Diver said: Not a fan. Slight build and injury prone with a history of concussions. Doesn't seem like a good locker room guy either. Really? How so? Or is it he doesn't like Trump and you're just using this excuse?
Sky Diver Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 4 minutes ago, horned dogs said: Really? How so? Or is it he doesn't like Trump and you're just using this excuse? His personality and ability to get along with his teammates has been a commonly expressed concern. Weaknesses: Durability Has had at least one concussion Has had shoulder, hand injuries Poor intangibles Questionable leadership traits Quality of teammate Different personality; could clash with teammates and coaches Could have problems with the media Read more: http://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2018jrosen.php#ixzz5APpvvyhLRead more at http://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2018jrosen.php#kUTsgaPKJlpCZwKd.99 Let's don't imagine that Rosen is a slam dunk.
D. L. Hot-Flamethrower Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 16 minutes ago, Sky Diver said: His personality and ability to get along with his teammates has been a commonly expressed concern. Weaknesses: Durability Has had at least one concussion Has had shoulder, hand injuries Poor intangibles Questionable leadership traits Quality of teammate Different personality; could clash with teammates and coaches Could have problems with the media Read more: http://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2018jrosen.php#ixzz5APpvvyhLRead more at http://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2018jrosen.php#kUTsgaPKJlpCZwKd.99 Let's don't imagine that Rosen is a slam dunk. Nobody is a slam dunk. But, don't forget how many of his teammates have come forward in support of him.
NewEraBills Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 Let's put some of this to rest though: Do you think a guy that has had shoulder surgery and concussions would still be around if he didn't in some way love football? Would former teammates and current ones speak highly of him at this juncture when they don't have to? It's the same thing with Mayfield. There are a lot of narratives to dig through to find out what is really the case. And even then you are not going to be 100 percent sure you''ll just have to trust your gut. 1
NickelCity Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 Concussions are a legit concern, but i don't put too much stock into his family's affluence.
Sky Diver Posted March 21, 2018 Posted March 21, 2018 25 minutes ago, NewEraBills said: Let's put some of this to rest though: Do you think a guy that has had shoulder surgery and concussions would still be around if he didn't in some way love football? Would former teammates and current ones speak highly of him at this juncture when they don't have to? It's the same thing with Mayfield. There are a lot of narratives to dig through to find out what is really the case. And even then you are not going to be 100 percent sure you''ll just have to trust your gut. Take the money and run. It's been known to happen. 3 minutes ago, NickelCity said: Concussions are a legit concern, but i don't put too much stock into his family's affluence. He's not as hungry as a guy who is trying to put food on his family's table. 19 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said: Anyone consider this?? Yes, I brought it up a few posts ago,
Recommended Posts