ghostwriter Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 Just now, Kirby Jackson said: I agree that Darnold is a better thrower. I have him ranked higher. You are yelling at clouds right now. Doubling down on something that’s wrong?!? That's what I thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: What do I get if you're wrong? Me pretending to have never made the prediction and to not being held accountable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 1 minute ago, NewDayBills said: That's what I thought. Ha ha, that isn’t even a response. Again, if you didn’t say that “guys were risky” because of their completion percentage I wouldn’t have responded. When you heard the truth you tried to pretend that it was fake instead of accepting the new information. That’s a really stupid way to debate. If you don't think that drops are a factor in completion percentage I don’t know what to tell you. Again, the numbers were close if memory serves me well. I am not at all debating that Darnold is a better prospect. We agree 100%. I take issue with the premise that it is because of Jackson’s completion percentage. We have information that says they are very close when you factor in drops. Why would ANYONE choose to dismiss that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghostwriter Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 1 minute ago, Kirby Jackson said: Ha ha, that isn’t even a response. Again, if you didn’t say that “guys were risky” because of their completion percentage I wouldn’t have responded. When you heard the truth you tried to pretend that it was fake instead of accepting the new information. That’s a really stupid way to debate. If you don't think that drops are a factor in completion percentage I don’t know what to tell you. Again, the numbers were close if memory serves me well. I am not at all debating that Darnold is a better prospect. We agree 100%. I take issue with the premise that it is because of Jackson’s completion percentage. We have information that says they are very close when you factor in drops. Why would ANYONE choose to dismiss that? You are saying Jackson is more accurate than Darnold, I disagree and I'm not even going to debate it because how !@#$ing stupid that is, there is no debate. It's like arguing with Geno Smith and trying to convince him that the earth isn't flat. Not worth my time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 (edited) 22 minutes ago, NewDayBills said: You are saying Jackson is more accurate than Darnold, I disagree and I'm not even going to debate it because how !@#$ing stupid that is, there is no debate. It's like arguing with Geno Smith and trying to convince him that the earth isn't flat. Not worth my time. It’s nothing like that. Way to try to pull in the flat earthers to make you less wrong. I said that when adjusting for drops Jackson had a higher completion percentage (although they were close). Your issue with him was completion percentage. Those are your words not mine. If your issue was anything else we wouldn’t be doing this. You can’t not like one guy because of his completion percentage but like a guy with a lower (adjusted) completion percentage. That is what I am taking issue with. I’m not taking issue with flat earth or how you rank guys. I am taking issue with what you used to make that decision. Edited March 7, 2018 by Kirby Jackson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghostwriter Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 2 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: It’s nothing like that. Way to try to pull in the flat earthers to make you less wrong. I said that when adjusting for drops Jackson had a higher completion percentage (although they were close). Your issue with him was completion percentage. Those are your words not mine. If your issue was anything else we would be doing this. You can’t not like one guy because of his completion percentage but like a guy with a lower (adjusted) completion percentage. That is what I am taking issue with. I’m not taking issue with flat earth or how you rank guys. I am taking issue with what you used to make that decision. Keyword *adjusted* completion percentage. It's like the affirmative action of QB stats. You think Jackson is equal or more accurate than Darnold, I don't. I don't care if you got a problem with it, it's the truth. Darnold is more accurate than Jackson. 64% vs 57%, stop white knighting and 'adjusting' stats. I could be a millionaire right now if I 'adjusted' certain circumstances in my life too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthNYfan Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 43 minutes ago, CuddyDark said: No it's just Bills fans have overrated the top 6 QB in this draft. None are that #1 franchise QB. None are Luck or Wentz. Rosen at best is Matt Ryan and at worst Rob Johnson. The Best in the Group is Mayfield but he's short and cocky so to some it's a turnoff. Well matt Ryan is a pretty damn good ceiling, no? Rosen will be gone top10. Browns, Jets, broncos all need a QB, and cousins will probably go to Jets or broncos, so that's still 2 QBs drafted right there. Unless somebody goes all in on Allen, and the small chance nobody trades up, I see a very small chance Rosen won't go top10. The only way there isn't another Qb isn't taken is if nobody trades into the top10. The top10 is: Browns (QB or another position) Giants (might trade, most likely not going QB) Colts (might trade, most likely not going QB) Browns (QB or trade if they didn't go qb#1) Broncos (QB or cousins) Jets (QB or cousins) Bucs (might trade, not going QB) Bears (might trade, not going QB) 49ers (might trade, not going QB) Raiders (might trade, not going QB) There are plenty of trade partners in top 10 for 2 more QBs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 (edited) 8 minutes ago, NewDayBills said: Keyword *adjusted* completion percentage. It's like the affirmative action of QB stats. You think Jackson is equal or more accurate than Darnold, I don't. I don't care if you got a problem with it, it's the truth. Darnold is more accurate than Jackson. 64% vs 57%, stop white knighting and 'adjusting' stats. I could be a millionaire right now if I 'adjusted' certain circumstances in my life too. Find where I said that he is more accurate. I don’t think that I said that and if I did I It was in error. I said Jackson had a higher completion percentage when adjusted for drops (which every single NFL team will do). So you want to pretend that drops ARE NOT a factor in completion percentage? I’m not sure why you want to keep digging a bigger hole? You are on an island in believing that drops don’t factor into completion percentage. I’m not sure I would be giving “flat earth Geno” such a hard time if I were you. Edited March 7, 2018 by Kirby Jackson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 1 minute ago, Kirby Jackson said: Find where I said that he is more accurate. I don’t think that I said that and if I did I It was in error. So you want to pretend that drops ARE NOT a factor in completion percentage? I’m not sure why you want to keep digging a bigger hole? You are on an island in believing that drops don’t factor into completion percentage. I’m not sure I would be giving “flat earth Geno” such a hard time if I were you. Man that hole just keeps getting deeper and deeper. Heaven forbid there be context in statistics, we can’t possibly have that!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 3 minutes ago, Wayne Cubed said: Man that hole just keeps getting deeper and deeper. Heaven forbid there be context in statistics, we can’t possibly have that!! I’m not crazy here am I? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2003Contenders Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 2 hours ago, ChevyVanMiller said: McShay also says that's the big question is whether the Bills will package picks 21 and 22 and move up for a QB. He then says that he cannot predict trades so that is why he has them staying at those two spots and making picks. If Rosen is still available at 15, where he has them going to Arizona there is no way that the Bills don't move up and snag him. If the QBs fall as he has them, it won't even take both first round picks to move up for Rosen. A 1st and a 2nd should get it done. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghostwriter Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 Just now, Kirby Jackson said: Find where I said that he is more accurate. I don’t think that I said that and if I did I It was in error. So you want to pretend that drops ARE NOT a factor in completion percentage? I’m not sure why you want to keep digging a bigger hole? You are on an island in believing that drops don’t factor into completion percentage. I’m not sure I would be giving “flat earth Geno” such a hard time if I were you. You're right, Lamar Jackson is a super accurate QB! His 57% career completion percentage is not a reflection of him as a passer or his accuracy at all! Of course it was drops. Better? You're essentially a pathological liar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuddyDark Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 6 minutes ago, SouthNYfan said: Well matt Ryan is a pretty damn good ceiling, no? Rosen will be gone top10. Browns, Jets, broncos all need a QB, and cousins will probably go to Jets or broncos, so that's still 2 QBs drafted right there. Unless somebody goes all in on Allen, and the small chance nobody trades up, I see a very small chance Rosen won't go top10. The only way there isn't another Qb isn't taken is if nobody trades into the top10. The top10 is: Browns (QB or another position) Giants (might trade, most likely not going QB) Colts (might trade, most likely not going QB) Browns (QB or trade if they didn't go qb#1) Broncos (QB or cousins) Jets (QB or cousins) Bucs (might trade, not going QB) Bears (might trade, not going QB) 49ers (might trade, not going QB) Raiders (might trade, not going QB) There are plenty of trade partners in top 10 for 2 more QBs. Bronco I think are blowing smoke. I just can't see them taking QB at 5 for this roster. I see them going for Keenum if they don't get Cousins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 3 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: Find where I said that he is more accurate. I don’t think that I said that and if I did I It was in error. I said Jackson had a higher completion percentage when adjusted for drops (which every single NFL team will do). So you want to pretend that drops ARE NOT a factor in completion percentage? I’m not sure why you want to keep digging a bigger hole? You are on an island in believing that drops don’t factor into completion percentage. I’m not sure I would be giving “flat earth Geno” such a hard time if I were you. This is a good point as it relates to the granularity with which these teams dig into certain QB issues. If the knock on a QB is completion percentage (which shouldn’t be confused with accuracy, btw) then scouts will look at EVERYTHING related to that issue. From route types (3, 5, 7 step drops) to game situation to protection breakdowns to the receivers to drops, etc., etc., etc., every possible contributor to completion percentage will be scrutinized. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthNYfan Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 3 minutes ago, CuddyDark said: Bronco I think are blowing smoke. I just can't see them taking QB at 5 for this roster. I see them going for Keenum if they don't get Cousins. Maybe I'm not sure though. We will see. Either way, I want a qb this year, let's hope it's the right one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay_Fixit Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 14 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: Find where I said that he is more accurate. I don’t think that I said that and if I did I It was in error. I said Jackson had a higher completion percentage when adjusted for drops (which every single NFL team will do). So you want to pretend that drops ARE NOT a factor in completion percentage? I’m not sure why you want to keep digging a bigger hole? You are on an island in believing that drops don’t factor into completion percentage. I’m not sure I would be giving “flat earth Geno” such a hard time if I were you. Not necessarily. “Drops” unless egregious, are partially subjective. Who measured the data? A “drop” can be a ball going through a WR hands on a bubble screen. Well, was the pass too high? Was it too low? Was it rifled when it should have been feathered? Just because it was a “drop” doesn’t mean the QB threw a good pass. It all depends on if there’s a strict criteria. I get the point you’re presenting and on the surface it makes sense, I just think “adjusting for drops” is lazy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 12 minutes ago, NewDayBills said: You're right, Lamar Jackson is a super accurate QB! His 57% career completion percentage is not a reflection of him as a passer or his accuracy at all! Of course it was drops. Better? You're essentially a pathological liar. Where did I say “he is more accurate?” I asked you to post that. I said (repeatedly) that he had a higher adjusted completion percentage. I’m not the one that looks like an idiot here (at least I don’t think). I have been called a lot of things on here but think this is the first for pathological liar. Congrats on that!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D. L. Hot-Flamethrower Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 https://www.wkbw.com/sports/bills/joe-b-2018-nfl-mock-draft-no-1-3_7_18?page=2 I think this Mock from Joe B. is a much better representation of what could occur. Not exactly as I see it but he has 4 QBs in top 8. I would also say that it is entirely possible 4 go in the top 6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 11 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: I’m not crazy here am I? Not at all. Apparently this poster seems to think completion percentage is the same as accuracy. Qb 1 throws 5 passes, all 5 the WR has to extend himself to catch and isn’t able to run after the catch. He completes 4. Qb 2 throws 5 passes, all 5 are right on the numbers and hit the WR in stride. The WR drops 3. He completes 2 passes. Its really not hard to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 Just now, Jay_Fixit said: Not necessarily. “Drops” unless egregious, are partially subjective. Who measured the data? A “drop” can be a ball going through a WR hands on a bubble screen. Well, was the pass too high? Was it too low? Was it rifled when it should have been feathered? Just because it was a “drop” doesn’t mean the QB threw a good pass. It all depends on if there’s a strict criteria. I get the point you’re presenting and on the surface it makes sense, I just think “adjusting for drops” is lazy. All of the info is on the board somewhere. I think that it was someone like PFF but don’t remember. Obviously it is a little subjective but when the number of drops are as high they were in Jackson’s case it moved the needle. It wasn’t a matter of 2 or 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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