Rotoworld- Giants leaning away from QB @ #2

[Luxy312]

Just now, JohnC said:

If Eli believes that he can play for another four years then he is deluding himself. He clearly is fading. At this point in his long and distinguished career how much is left in his near empty tank? 

 

The Giants are in a good position to get a replacement player for Eli, even if the veteran is the starter this year. The Giants who usually are a competitive team rarely are in a position that they are currently in to secure their next long term qb. Passing on a highly rated qb, whoever it is, is an opportunity that doesn't come along very often. 

 

Don't get me wrong. I would love for the Giants to deal with the Bills and trade out. That would not only be a terrific scenario for us but also an opportunity that doesn't come along too often for a historically middle of the pack team. 

 

He's 3 years younger than Brady, so I guess the Patriots should be drafting a QB as early as possible as well.  This is once again just your perspective.  The front office for the Giants have already stated that they believe that Eli is capable of continuing to be their starting quarterback.  I guess that's why they get paid the big bucks.  LOL.

[Reed83HOF]

30 minutes ago, SouthNYfan said:

 

 

Two sides to every coin lol

They have a 2-time SB winning franchise QB, albiet an aging one with no OL...

[section122]

10 minutes ago, JohnC said:

If Eli believes that he can play for another four years then he is deluding himself. He clearly is fading. At this point in his long and distinguished career how much is left in his near empty tank? 

 

The Giants are in a good position to get a replacement player for Eli, even if the veteran is the starter this year. The Giants who usually are a competitive team rarely are in a position that they are currently in to secure their next long term qb. Passing on a highly rated qb, whoever it is, is an opportunity that doesn't come along very often. 

 

Don't get me wrong. I would love for the Giants to deal with the Bills and trade out. That would not only be a terrific scenario for us but also an opportunity that doesn't come along too often for a historically middle of the pack team. 

 

I see your point but let me offer a counter. 

 

If Eli plays for even 2 more seasons doesn't it make sense to grab a developmental guy that can sit for a bit instead of a ready to go guy?  Wouldn't Allen or Jackson or Rudolph be a better choice at the bottom of round 1?  If (and it is a big if) the Giants really do plan on riding with Eli it makes sense to trade down and grab one of the guys I mentioned later while stockpiling talent and possibly still get a qb of the future.  I don't think they can draft a qb at 2 and then put him on the bench for a year or 2.  

[JohnC]

5 minutes ago, section122 said:

 

I see your point but let me offer a counter. 

 

If Eli plays for even 2 more seasons doesn't it make sense to grab a developmental guy that can sit for a bit instead of a ready to go guy?  Wouldn't Allen or Jackson or Rudolph be a better choice at the bottom of round 1?  If (and it is a big if) the Giants really do plan on riding with Eli it makes sense to trade down and grab one of the guys I mentioned later while stockpiling talent and possibly still get a qb of the future.  I don't think they can draft a qb at 2 and then put him on the bench for a year or 2.  

The issue isn't how long can Eli play. The real issue is at what level can he play at now and in the near future. I'm hoping that the Giants work out a deal with us and stockpile picks. My approach for the Biills and even the Giants is if you have an opportunity to select a high end qb with your pick then you should do so. When you are discussing the qb position and who to select the emphasis shouldn't be on the first year. For the Giants and even the Bills if you can get a qb who you believe is going to be better than the other options in the long run then I would prefer taking the higher end prospect. 

 

There is a case to be made for the Giants and even the Bills that it is a better strategy to use your multiple picks to in general bolster the roster. My preference is to take the higher end prospect and be set for next decade or so. Different approaches-different philosophies-different situations at where each respective franchise is at-different evaluations and calculations. 

[NickelCity]

Wonder what it'll take for the Colts to give up #3?

[Reed83HOF]

10 minutes ago, JohnC said:

The issue isn't how long can Eli play. The real issue is at what level can he play at now and in the near future. I'm hoping that the Giants work out a deal with us and stockpile picks. My approach for the Biills and even the Giants is if you have an opportunity to select a high end qb with your pick then you should do so. When you are discussing the qb position and who to select the emphasis shouldn't be on the first year. For the Giants and even the Bills if you can get a qb who you believe is going to be better than the other options in the long run then I would prefer taking the higher end prospect. 

 

There is a case to be made for the Giants and even the Bills that it is a better strategy to use your multiple picks to in general bolster the roster. My preference is to take the higher end prospect and be set for next decade or so. Different approaches-different philosophies-different situations at where each respective franchise is at-different evaluations and calculations. 

If the roles were reversed, I would be upset that we let a QB go by us. I'm still pissed at both Watson & Mahomes last year, for a CB (a great one so far, but still)..

[SouthNYfan]

38 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said:

They have a 2-time SB winning franchise QB, albiet an aging one with no OL...

 

I agree

I was saying somebody else took the opposite opinion, that we should keep both our first round picks since the later picks aren't great in a top heavy draft

Personally, I'm with you, and I would go with a big trade for a QB this year

[JohnC]

1 minute ago, Reed83HOF said:

If the roles were reversed, I would be upset that we let a QB go by us. I'm still pissed at both Watson & Mahomes last year, for a CB (a great one so far, but still)..

JeffisMagic was imprudently ignored. With a selection of either one of the qbs you referred to our approach to this draft would be dramatically different. 

[John from Riverside]

1 minute ago, Reed83HOF said:

If the roles were reversed, I would be upset that we let a QB go by us. I'm still pissed at both Watson & Mahomes last year, for a CB (a great one so far, but still)..

What is one of the highests salary positions on a team next to quarterback?

 

You do realize that all we had at corner at a certain point of last year was Darby (who was traded)

 

Thanks GOD Tre ended up being a stud.....and that trade down is the only reason why we are even entertaining ideas of moving up for qbs this year.

 

 

[Reed83HOF]

1 minute ago, JohnC said:

JeffisMagic was imprudently ignored. With a selection of either one of the qbs you referred to our approach to this draft would be dramatically different. 

I agreed with Jeff and wasn't sold on Watson (still not, only a handful of games). This draft would be entirely different and we would be in a much better position because of it. You can only kick the QB can down the road so many times...

[BuffaloBill]

The suggestion that the Giants might take a RB or OG at #2 seems insane.  They would be wise to trade down even a few places and grab another pick if they are looking to do this.  

[Reed83HOF]

2 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

What is one of the highests salary positions on a team next to quarterback?

 

You do realize that all we had at corner at a certain point of last year was Darby (who was traded)

 

Thanks GOD Tre ended up being a stud.....and that trade down is the only reason why we are even entertaining ideas of moving up for qbs this year.

 

 

And in the end it doesn't make a god damn difference, QBs win you games...I can't believe I sound like BillfromNYC right now, but oh well...

[John from Riverside]

1 minute ago, Reed83HOF said:

And in the end it doesn't make a god damn difference, QBs win you games...I can't believe I sound like BillfromNYC right now, but oh well...

Obviously not JUST QBs.....our team went 9 and 7....make the playoffs....and our offense was abysmal

[Reed83HOF]

2 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

Obviously not JUST QBs.....our team went 9 and 7....make the playoffs....and our offense was abysmal

Don't get me wrong I love White, but I'd rather have the QB...Just like in the suprbowl, the Eagles D was awful and Foles was able to keep scoring...that is how you beat Brady and win...score more points

[John from Riverside]

1 minute ago, Reed83HOF said:

Don't get me wrong I love White, but I'd rather have the QB...Just like in the suprbowl, the Eagles D was awful and Foles was able to keep scoring...that is how you beat Brady and win...score more points

A QB is needed....and I totally think that the original plan of this team was that they were gonna suck and not be so far away from the top 3 qbs.

 

 

The thing is....there is serious depth at QB in this draft....and we did in fact ended up being at 21 and 22 with those picks.

 

Think of way a player like Vita at DT could do for this team on D.....while still upgrading the QB position with Lamar Jackson.  That is not even counting all the other picks it is probably going to take to get up to that top 3 now.

[njbuff]

If McDermott thinks that Glenn can't play RT, then for sure the Bills and Giants can make this deal.

 

Glenn, 21, 22, 2019 1st and 2nd round pick to the Giants.............. the Bills get 2 and something else, no idea what.

[Rico]

2 hours ago, BuffaloBaumer said:

We won't need to trade into #2 spot if they skip QB, we can move into 3 or 4 spot which would be costly still...but not as bad.

If you don’t trade higher, somebody else will.

[Reed83HOF]

8 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

A QB is needed....and I totally think that the original plan of this team was that they were gonna suck and not be so far away from the top 3 qbs.

 

 

The thing is....there is serious depth at QB in this draft....and we did in fact ended up being at 21 and 22 with those picks.

 

Think of way a player like Vita at DT could do for this team on D.....while still upgrading the QB position with Lamar Jackson.  That is not even counting all the other picks it is probably going to take to get up to that top 3 now.

I would love Vita as well and if we took a QB last year, we could have gone after him this year. At some point, you have to get this done and you will lose out on other good players - C'est la vie...

 

I do not see us taking Jackson, as I am not sure he fits what Beane looks for in a QB (copied from another thread)

 

Here are the top things Beane looks for from 3-4 different interviews:

 

1.) If you're a GM, you have to have a franchise QB

2.) Leadership abilities

3.) Throw from the pocket

4.) Accuracy from the pocket very important - tighter windows

5.) Arm Strength - love it, can improve it a bit

6.) Stand in there - trust his reads, make the throws

7.) NFL too fast & different for sandlot football

8.) Good size - not worried about lineman in their face

 

We'll talk to some of their teammates who were with them for several years in college, we'll talk to people back at their high school. We'll do anything and everything to really know who this person is, what makes them tick as a person, and obviously we'll get into the X's and O's. Does he work hard in the film room? Does he understand what he's seeing? What has he been though? What's the system he's been in? Has he audibled plays? Does he call the plays out in the huddle? Does this guy take snaps from center? All of those things you have to go through, and we're basically just building a library on each player."

3 minutes ago, Rico said:

If you don’t trade higher, somebody else will.

As they should...you make your own destiny

[BuffaloBillyG]

I have personally never believed they would go QB at 2 anyways. Barkley or Chubb for them. They will get a QB at some point I think, but I'm thinking more round 3 or 4. They have Webb, but he was selected by last regime and who really knows what Gettleman thinks of him. 

[BrotherChazz]

Smokescreen to get the Browns to take Squan so they get their chose of QB.