Geno = Flat Earth Truther?

[DC Tom]

Just now, Reed83HOF said:

 

F&*K I'll do it for you...I'm a F&%$cking idiot!

 

I mean, if we're going to dig up every halfwitted crackpot bull **** theological hypothesis from history...

 

And the World Turtle myth was shared by the Chinese, Hindu (though they had the Earth balanced on World Elephants riding a World Turtle), and many indigenous North American tribes...so there's consensus, man!  

 

[Reed83HOF]

16 minutes ago, SoTier said:

Furthermore, the Bible is not a scientific document, and that position is supported by Christian denominations representing more than half of all Christians.

Actually as an elective in graduate studies I enrolled and loved my Ancient Religions class. You should check out the Epic of Gilgamesh, it is an ancient Sumerian story that was written down around 2100BC when people actually had first learned to write...

 

A quick summary will basically break it down to the story of a singular God who talked to someone and told him to build a boat, put his animals on it and that it rained for 6 days and seven nights....Heard that old story before?

[RememberTheRockpile]

 

Flat earth history lesson.

 

Quote

It must first be reiterated that with extraordinary few exceptions no educated person in the history of Western Civilization from the third century B.C. onward believed that the earth was flat.

 

A round earth appears at least as early as the sixth century BC with Pythagoras, who was followed by Aristotle, Euclid, and Aristarchus, among others in observing that the earth was a sphere. Although there were a few dissenters--Leukippos and Demokritos for example--by the time of Eratosthenes (3 c. BC), followed by Crates(2 c. BC), Strabo (3 c. BC), and Ptolemy (first c. AD), the sphericity of the earth was accepted by all educated Greeks and Romans.

 

Nor did this situation change with the advent of Christianity. A few--at least two and at most five--early Christian fathers denied the sphericity of earth by mistakenly taking passages such as Ps. 104:2-3 as geographical rather than metaphorical statements. On the other side tens of thousands of Christian theologians, poets, artists, and scientists took the spherical view throughout the early, medieval, and modern church. The point is that no educated person believed otherwise.

 

Historians of science have been proving this point for at least 70 years (most recently Edward Grant, David Lindberg, Daniel Woodward, and Robert S. Westman), without making notable headway against the error. Schoolchildren in the US, Europe, and Japan are for the most part being taught the same old nonsense. How and why did this nonsense emerge?

 

In my research, I looked to see how old the idea was that medieval Christians believed the earth was flat. I obviously did not find it among medieval Christians. Nor among anti-Catholic Protestant reformers. Nor in Copernicus or Galileo or their followers, who had to demonstrate the superiority of a heliocentric system, but not of a spherical earth. I was sure I would find it among the eighteenth-century philosophes, among all their vitriolic sneers at Christianity, but not a word. I am still amazed at where it first appears.

 

No one before the 1830s believed that medieval people thought that the earth was flat.

 

[Foxx]

9 hours ago, DC Tom said:

 

That doesn't prove the Earth is round, that just proves a plate is moving with respect to another one..  

 

Of course, that would prove plate tectonics, which only works if the Earth is round...unless Big Seismology is faking the mid-Atlantic Ridge.  WAKE UP SHEEPLE!

it might also prove the Earth is ever expanding.

[SoTier]

10 hours ago, DC Tom said:

 

I would dispute the Druids.  And the Mayans and Aztecs believed in a flat Earth...which is actually surprising, since Mayan astronomy was sufficiently advanced that they could have hypothesized the world was spherical.

 

 

Mea culpa.  I mistakenly called the Stone Age people who built Stone Henge and the other stone circles scattered around Britain Druids, but they came much later.  The recent theories about Stone Henge is that it was used in solstice celebrations.  

 

Without assuming that the Earth was spherical, the ancient astronomers would have never been able to so accurately predict solstices and eclipses because they wouldn't be able to mesh their celestial observations, calculations, and predictions with any other model.   It may have been that the priest castes saw the idea of a flat earth as being a metaphorical explanation for the masses, which is also similar to what happened in early Christianity.

 

9 hours ago, Reed83HOF said:

Actually as an elective in graduate studies I enrolled and loved my Ancient Religions class. You should check out the Epic of Gilgamesh, it is an ancient Sumerian story that was written down around 2100BC when people actually had first learned to write...

 

A quick summary will basically break it down to the story of a singular God who talked to someone and told him to build a boat, put his animals on it and that it rained for 6 days and seven nights....Heard that old story before?

 

Most historians accept that the Bible, especially the Old Testament, is an historical document which relates events that happened in the area of the Fertile Crescent before most of the people living in the region had written language (like the ancient Israelites).  History isn't science, however.

 

[DC Tom]

5 hours ago, Foxx said:

it might also prove the Earth is ever expanding.

 

Turtles are more likely.

[shrader]

2 hours ago, DC Tom said:

 

Turtles are more likely.

 

Only if the turtle shell is flat.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

1 hour ago, shrader said:

 

Only if the turtle shell is flat.

the bottom is relatively flat.  

otherwise they'd be weebles 

[sleeby]

4 hours ago, SoTier said:

Most historians accept that the Bible, especially the Old Testament, is an historical document which relates events that happened in the area of the Fertile Crescent before most of the people living in the region had written language (like the ancient Israelites).  History isn't science, however.

 

Correct.  I'm an atheist and of the opinion that the old testament is one of the most important books on human history.  Isaac asimov wrote a huge guide to it explaining it all with that view.  Those are the stories of our pre history as told from generation to generation and finally written down by several people - hence they differ.  

Many of the names assumed to have been people are actually countries or tribes.

[MTBill]

A "truth" fell from this thread.

 

We have some bright folks here whose scope of knowledge is well beyond football.

 

It is very fascinating to see the work that the Greeks did to model their geocentric theory by explaining variance using orbits inside of orbits.  Note - these theories mostly threw out the older mythology around a flat earth and recognize the spherical nature of Earth.

 

There was a fascinating link above which discussed the 'myth' presenting that Columbus was out to prove the Earth was round in 1492.  It is no wonder some people are confused by this "history" lesson everyone learns in grade school.  The real history lesson is that history is often fabricated or 'spun' to benefit someone.  One of the worst travesties in our history is the number of burned libraries - burned books, and other forms of forced loss of knowledge.  We tend to think of ourselves as 'modern' and 'cultured', but if you really study history and look for root truths as opposed to the popular history, you uncover that really we just have different (sometimes better, sometimes not) tools at our disposal.  History is unfortunately written by the victor - and the loser's history is intentionally lost.  Note that the "good side" generally wins - because we hear the story from the victor.  It is this modern information age when we have the benefit of more perspective - so we can decide for ourselves if the victor was indeed the 'good' guy.  But even this is spun and fabricated much of the time.

[KW95 - JA17]

I saw the Moon last night. It had a sphere like shape. I saw the sun early today behind fog.  It really had this sphere shape.  I see my anus, yup Sphere shape.  Making the connections?

Edited March 1, 2018 by KW95

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

I heard from Dunkirk Don and he told me that the new Bills stadium will be located at the edge of the earth ?. 

 

 

 

 

 

Kidding.  DD is long gone (or so I believe). 

 

 

 Back to a topic of 2 pictures being the same.  

 

When on the ISS the rate of travel is 4.76 miles/s.  

How can one take the same picture and have it the same at that rate?  

That is a typical orbital path repeated daily.   As seen the path is different on each pass.     

 

 

Edited March 1, 2018 by ShadyBillsFan

[nedboy7]

For such a stupid species we sure destroyed the planet in amazing fashion. 

7 hours ago, sleeby said:

 

Correct.  I'm an atheist and of the opinion that the old testament is one of the most important books on human history.  Isaac asimov wrote a huge guide to it explaining it all with that view.  Those are the stories of our pre history as told from generation to generation and finally written down by several people - hence they differ.  

Many of the names assumed to have been people are actually countries or tribes.

 

The Bible, Koran and Old Testament are basically books of toilet paper. Feel free to wipe your ****ty ass with them. 

[sleeby]

52 minutes ago, nedboy7 said:

For such a stupid species we sure destroyed the planet in amazing fashion.

 

I agree with you on this at least.  Our epic story's end is near and we or our grandkids will likely be left holding the ball when it ends most embareassingly.

Couple million years of humans and we reached 1 billion in 1800ad, 2 billion in 1930, 4 billion in 1975 and 8 billion in 2016.  Finite planet needs a finite ask.  

My draft website and thoughts.  Human overpopulation is the root cause of all that ails us (save for the bills of the past 20 years) and so the only path out.

 

Www.rightsized.org

Edited March 1, 2018 by sleeby

[K-9]

4 hours ago, MTBill said:

A "truth" fell from this thread.

 

We have some bright folks here whose scope of knowledge is well beyond football.

 

It is very fascinating to see the work that the Greeks did to model their geocentric theory by explaining variance using orbits inside of orbits.  Note - these theories mostly threw out the older mythology around a flat earth and recognize the spherical nature of Earth.

 

There was a fascinating link above which discussed the 'myth' presenting that Columbus was out to prove the Earth was round in 1492.  It is no wonder some people are confused by this "history" lesson everyone learns in grade school.  The real history lesson is that history is often fabricated or 'spun' to benefit someone.  One of the worst travesties in our history is the number of burned libraries - burned books, and other forms of forced loss of knowledge.  We tend to think of ourselves as 'modern' and 'cultured', but if you really study history and look for root truths as opposed to the popular history, you uncover that really we just have different (sometimes better, sometimes not) tools at our disposal.  History is unfortunately written by the victor - and the loser's history is intentionally lost.  Note that the "good side" generally wins - because we hear the story from the victor.  It is this modern information age when we have the benefit of more perspective - so we can decide for ourselves if the victor was indeed the 'good' guy.  But even this is spun and fabricated much of the time.

Good stuff. Reminds me of the old axiom: history isn’t about what happened, it’s about the telling of what happened. And that should prompt the intellectually curious among us to dig deeper for the accounts and records that aren’t popularly presented. Information is out there. 

[Reed83HOF]

4 hours ago, MTBill said:

A "truth" fell from this thread.

 

We have some bright folks here whose scope of knowledge is well beyond football.

 

It is very fascinating to see the work that the Greeks did to model their geocentric theory by explaining variance using orbits inside of orbits.  Note - these theories mostly threw out the older mythology around a flat earth and recognize the spherical nature of Earth.

 

There was a fascinating link above which discussed the 'myth' presenting that Columbus was out to prove the Earth was round in 1492.  It is no wonder some people are confused by this "history" lesson everyone learns in grade school.  The real history lesson is that history is often fabricated or 'spun' to benefit someone.  One of the worst travesties in our history is the number of burned libraries - burned books, and other forms of forced loss of knowledge.  We tend to think of ourselves as 'modern' and 'cultured', but if you really study history and look for root truths as opposed to the popular history, you uncover that really we just have different (sometimes better, sometimes not) tools at our disposal.  History is unfortunately written by the victor - and the loser's history is intentionally lost.  Note that the "good side" generally wins - because we hear the story from the victor.  It is this modern information age when we have the benefit of more perspective - so we can decide for ourselves if the victor was indeed the 'good' guy.  But even this is spun and fabricated much of the time.

 

We still can't replicate roman concrete which is significantly better than our current form of concrete...

[BillsFan4]

On 2/27/2018 at 6:01 PM, BuffAlone said:

Lmfao...ok Shady. Ask them for 2 pictures that look the same of the Earth. I tell you now, there ARE none.

Lets talk curvature.  We all (mostly) have been on lake Erie. Ever see the ship disappear to the naked eye? Only to see it plain as day with binocculars? Trick of the eye. Same as any curvature of the Earth. Its been beaten to death. Some people just refuse to ask "what if". Thats cool. But not me. Like I said, im not convinced either way, but at least im not obtuse 

Here's one

On 2/27/2018 at 6:01 PM, BuffAlone said:

Lmfao...ok Shady. Ask them for 2 pictures that look the same of the Earth. I tell you now, there ARE none.

Lets talk curvature.  We all (mostly) have been on lake Erie. Ever see the ship disappear to the naked eye? Only to see it plain as day with binocculars? Trick of the eye. Same as any curvature of the Earth. Its been beaten to death. Some people just refuse to ask "what if". Thats cool. But not me. Like I said, im not convinced either way, but at least im not obtuse 

And here's 2 -

 

 

On 2/27/2018 at 6:31 PM, BuffAlone said:

Please dont insult my intelligence. Im merely offering a "what if" scenario. 

You are aware that ALL "pictures" of Earth are artist renderings, correct??

Why? When/if we spend that money, how the hell does Nasa release 1.5 megapixel images? Lmao. 

This is absolutely false.

 

Here's links to a bunch of real pictures of the earth. I just picked the first few that came up in a google search -

 

https://newatlas.com/gallery-photograph-earth-from-space/50704/#gallery

 

https://www.cnet.com/pictures/10-space-images-that-look-fake-but-are-actually-real-pictures/

 

https://www.nasa.gov/feature/top-15-earth-images-of-2015

 

https://www.space.com/35155-best-earth-from-space-photos-2016-astronaut-gallery.html

 

http://www.ibtimes.com/5-best-nasa-photos-earth-space-2017-2634957

 

Here's a live feed from the international space station -

 

https://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/iss_ustream.html

 

 

and a youtube video slideshow posted by NASA just in case you don't want to click on the links - 

 

 

Edited March 1, 2018 by BillsFan4

[bbb]

Wait, is there really a 16 page argument about whether the Earth is flat?

[MTBill]

12 hours ago, bbb said:

Wait, is there really a 16 page argument about whether the Earth is flat?

 

 I think the flat earther left the discussion.  But yes, this is a real thread.  I also think he may have been trolling - not serious about believing the earth is flat.

[Deranged Rhino]