Augie Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 8 minutes ago, Nihilarian said: Mel Kiper has him ranked #1 overall after his performance at the senior bowl. Crazy stuff! I get the whole “tools/upside” thing, but was he about 56% through college? It’s hard to get past that. 1
transplantbillsfan Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 Yuck to Josh Allen... seriously?!
WideRightRevenge Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 I can't believe I'm going to say this .... but the more I read ... I'm leaning to Jackson (as we don't have to trade away our entire draft to get him) .. and think maybe he can be different than Tyrod ... given below analysis among others of multiple reads and pocket passing. His arm based on highlights looks like a rocket. I was thinking Mason at first .. but the intangibles with Jackson outweigh Rudolph in my opinion who plays in a wide open Big 12 (heave it up and they will catch it). I also like White from Western Ky but don't see him in first round .. so who knows take two QB's? Who Needs veterans -- now that is out of the box thinking ... Nate, Jackson, and White? 4. Lamar Jackson, Louisville, 6’3, 211 lbs. Jackson has an amazing skill set with a powerful arm that allows him to make throws off a platform that many NFL quarterbacks couldn’t even dream of making. He is tough in the pocket, knows his scheme well, and has amazing athleticism and speed as a runner. Jackson looks like a taller and right-handed version of Michael Vick. In 2017, Jackson completed 59 percent of his passes for 3,660 yards with 27 touchdowns and 10 interceptions. He averaged 6.9 yards per carry on the ground on his way to 1,601 yards and 18 rushing touchdowns. Jackson isn’t respected enough as a quarterback though. The knocks are predictable: He’s too skinny, his footwork needs to be improved and he doesn’t win from the pocket. Those arguments don’t take into account multiple factors. First, Jackson improved each season from the pocket. Second, Bobby Petrino’s offense asked him to make multiple reads in the passing game. Finally, Jackson is only 20 years old and still developing. No one can deny his production and consistent dominance against top competition.
PaattMaann Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 13 hours ago, TheTruthHurts said: I think he bases his rankings mostly on what he hears. I'm willing to bet the top 3 is how most of the real NFL scouts see it. That is not at all how he compiles his rankings, he actually does the leg work, which makes him a better talent evaluator then other media pundits. My point was this: he is the best media talent evaluator out there, not necessarily a mocker, but talent evaluator so I tend to trust his thoughts on prospects more than others. BUT, he has a bad track record at the QB position
NewEraBills Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 I like Mike but there's just no way Allen from a production standpoint and even when you look at film, there's no way he's the #2 QB. Mike has to have him here on potential alone because there's nothing else to support that ranking. NOTHING!!
SoCal Deek Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 The Bills should sit tight and take whichever QB is still there at 22. Take your higher rated player at 21. What’s the worst that can happen? If he doesn’t work out is it really that much worse than Lawson, Ragland, Sammy or the long list of high picks that went on to ‘greatness’ for the franchise.
FeelingOnYouboty Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 (edited) 8 hours ago, Nihilarian said: Mel Kiper has him ranked #1 overall after his performance at the senior bowl. His son works for the Jets and they're super high on him. This is Mel getting ahead of the story when they take him at #6. Edited February 16, 2018 by FeelingOnYouboty
DCOrange Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 15 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Interesting stat to look at. Interesting stat for sure, but I don't really know what to make of it. Using percentage for air yards seems weird to me. You could argue a high percentage = your ball placement isn't good, resulting in a lack of YAC and also argue that a low percentage = you rely on YAC and can't push the ball down the field. I don't know why someone would choose to use the percentage instead of just average air yards per attempt or something. 27 minutes ago, NewEraBills said: I like Mike but there's just no way Allen from a production standpoint and even when you look at film, there's no way he's the #2 QB. Mike has to have him here on potential alone because there's nothing else to support that ranking. NOTHING!! Well, sure, obviously potential is a major factor when it comes to drafting your future players. Having a ton of potential should absolutely boost a player's draft stock.
26CornerBlitz Posted February 16, 2018 Author Posted February 16, 2018 Mike Mayock Breaks Down His Top 5 QB Prospects in 2018 NFL Draft (3:17)
I_want_2_BILL_Lieve Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 This ranking will change after the combine an pro days. It's February, we need a QB so this is what we do. In the WGR piece Mayock said that Allen may have the highest floor. He said Allen has prototypical size, and his big arm will make GMs fall in love with him. He does everything well, but doesn't do any one thing great. Each one of the top 6 - 8 QB in this class has concerns. Whether it's turnovers, completion percentage, previous injuries, size, character concerns, offensive system , etc, etc. But they are all legitimate first round grades. I've talked myself in and out of each of these guys. Will we trade up for a top 2 guy? (whoever that is) or sit tight and see who falls to us at 21? I cannot wait for the draft.
Buffalo_Stampede Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 1 hour ago, PaattMaann said: That is not at all how he compiles his rankings, he actually does the leg work, which makes him a better talent evaluator then other media pundits. My point was this: he is the best media talent evaluator out there, not necessarily a mocker, but talent evaluator so I tend to trust his thoughts on prospects more than others. BUT, he has a bad track record at the QB position He scouts, I still think he uses a lot of what he hears. His rankings often differ from the majority.
PaattMaann Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 7 minutes ago, TheTruthHurts said: He scouts, I still think he uses a lot of what he hears. His rankings often differ from the majority. his are different from the majority BECAUSE he scouts/watches film and knows football. The majority just parrots each other / group thinks / sells for their station/network/news outlet.
Buffalo_Stampede Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 (edited) 1 minute ago, PaattMaann said: his are different from the majority BECAUSE he scouts/watches film and knows football. The majority just parrots each other / group thinks / sells for their station/network/news outlet. I have always liked Mayock but I don't believe he gets his rankings on his own. I think the league helps him. Edited February 16, 2018 by TheTruthHurts
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 23 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Quarterback 1. Sam Darnold, USC 2. Josh Allen, Wyoming 3. Josh Rosen, UCLA 4. Baker Mayfield, Oklahoma T-5. Lamar Jackson, Louisville T-5. Mason Rudolph, Oklahoma State Fortunately for them, draft pundits have zero accountability for their draft prospect rankings. I would be quite shocked if any NFL team had them ranked that way. 1 hour ago, PaattMaann said: his are different from the majority BECAUSE he scouts/watches film and knows football. The majority just parrots each other / group thinks / sells for their station/network/news outlet. I dunno. I think that's a very strange ranking for a guy who scouts/watches film and knows football
Buffalo_Stampede Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 Just now, Hapless Bills Fan said: Fortunately for them, draft pundits have zero accountability for their draft prospect rankings. I would be quite shocked if any NFL team had them ranked that way. Josh Allen is what GM's get excited for and also fired for. I wouldn't be shocked if he goes 1 or 2.
26CornerBlitz Posted February 16, 2018 Author Posted February 16, 2018 1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Fortunately for them, draft pundits have zero accountability for their draft prospect rankings. I would be quite shocked if any NFL team had them ranked that way. I wouldn't be at all. They all have different criteria with some making projections based on potential and the ability of their coaching staff to correct flaws.
PaattMaann Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 19 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Fortunately for them, draft pundits have zero accountability for their draft prospect rankings. I would be quite shocked if any NFL team had them ranked that way. I dunno. I think that's a very strange ranking for a guy who scouts/watches film and knows football again, he has been GREAT at every other position but has SUCKED when evaluating QBs
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 14 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: I wouldn't be at all. They all have different criteria with some making projections based on potential and the ability of their coaching staff to correct flaws. Well, in 2011 Locker, Gabbert, and Ponder all went in the 1st. So you could be right. Let's just say I hope that's not how our board looks.
DCOrange Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 11 minutes ago, PaattMaann said: again, he has been GREAT at every other position but has SUCKED when evaluating QBs What exactly is your basis for this? His QB rankings over the years basically look the way the draft actually played out: 2017: Watson, Trubisky, Mahomes, Kizer, Webb - He had Watson higher than he ended up going and currently looks smart for it 2016: Wentz, Goff, Lynch, Cook, Hackenburg - He missed on Dak like everybody else and seems to be correct about Wentz > Goff right now 2015: Mariota, Jameis, Petty, Hundley, Mannion - After the top 2, this class was horrible. Mariota has arguably been better than Jameis so far. 2014: Manziel, Bortles, Carr, Garoppolo, tie between Bridgewater and Mettenberger - Obviously Manziel was a bust, hard to say what could have been if not for his off-field issues. Obviously right now you'd take Garoppolo and Carr over Bortles, but these rankings are more or less in line with how everyone else felt that year, with the exception that he was higher on Carr and Garoppolo than most. 2013: Doesn't really matter; that whole class was awful. 2012: Luck, RG3, Tannehill, Weeden, Cousins - He didn't have Russell Wilson in here but nobody really did. I think these rankings pretty much mirror how everyone else felt at the time. Couldn't find 2011 or 2010, but 2009: Sanchez, Stafford, Josh Freeman, Pat White, Stephen McGee - This was basically a 1 QB draft and he screwed up by having Sanchez over Stafford. I don't know; I don't look at those rankings and think "man this dude sucks at evaluating QBs".
PaattMaann Posted February 16, 2018 Posted February 16, 2018 26 minutes ago, DCOrange said: What exactly is your basis for this? His QB rankings over the years basically look the way the draft actually played out: 2017: Watson, Trubisky, Mahomes, Kizer, Webb - He had Watson higher than he ended up going and currently looks smart for it 2016: Wentz, Goff, Lynch, Cook, Hackenburg - He missed on Dak like everybody else and seems to be correct about Wentz > Goff right now 2015: Mariota, Jameis, Petty, Hundley, Mannion - After the top 2, this class was horrible. Mariota has arguably been better than Jameis so far. 2014: Manziel, Bortles, Carr, Garoppolo, tie between Bridgewater and Mettenberger - Obviously Manziel was a bust, hard to say what could have been if not for his off-field issues. Obviously right now you'd take Garoppolo and Carr over Bortles, but these rankings are more or less in line with how everyone else felt that year, with the exception that he was higher on Carr and Garoppolo than most. 2013: Doesn't really matter; that whole class was awful. 2012: Luck, RG3, Tannehill, Weeden, Cousins - He didn't have Russell Wilson in here but nobody really did. I think these rankings pretty much mirror how everyone else felt at the time. Couldn't find 2011 or 2010, but 2009: Sanchez, Stafford, Josh Freeman, Pat White, Stephen McGee - This was basically a 1 QB draft and he screwed up by having Sanchez over Stafford. I don't know; I don't look at those rankings and think "man this dude sucks at evaluating QBs". evaluations not rankings
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