Active shooter at Florida high school

[Figster]

1 minute ago, Azalin said:

 

That's a more fair characterization of the president's suggestion than "Our president is asking school teachers to inflict death on another human being". 

 

For what it's worth, I don't care for the idea either but I think we can be a little more fair to him than that.

Myself personally, drones or trained attack dogs are the safest, fastest way to neutralize a would be shooter. 

 

Metal detection with silent alarm...

[B-Man]

The one and only Mark Steyn.

 

A Total Failure of the State

by Mark Steyn

 

 

During Wednesday's horrible fiasco of a "Town Hall", Broward County Sheriff Scott Israel spelled it out:

What I'm asking the law makers to give police all over this country is more power.

I was sufficiently struck by the above to write it down - because it was clear even then that Sheriff Israel is an incompetent deployer of the power he already has. The scale of his department's appalling failure in the Parkland massacre gets worse almost hourly. I was on air with Tucker Carlson when I heard that Stoneman Douglas High's on-site "school resource officer" - Sheriff's Deputy Scot Peterson, uniformed, trained and armed - had declined to enter the building and had stayed safely outside until Nikolas Cruz had finished killing everybody.

 

After a day on supension without pay, Deputy Peterson has now "retired", which assuredly comes with pay.

 

But, as I said, it gets worse. Three of his fellow deputies, from Sheriff Israel's department, then showed up at the school and also decided not to enter the building but to remain crouched behind their vehicles until the shooting had stopped

 

 

 it seems to be a crackerjack police department in terms of response time: They're first on the scene - and then they just sit back and watch at a safe distance. Or as Dr Jesse Kelly tweets:

"911, what's your emergency?"

 

"There's someone breaking into my house. Could you send the Broward County Sheriff's Department to water my garden while I kill the intruder?"

 

Back when there was known to be merely one of Sheriff Israel's deputies hanging around outside, his predecessor as Broward Sheriff, Al Lamberti, told The Miami Herald:

These events are over in three to five minutes. You don't have the luxury to wait. You might not have the best equipment, you might have small numbers, but you're armed. Those kids are not armed. You have to go in and engage the shooter. Our job is to protect and serve.

Sheriff Israel, on the other hand, sees his job as to self-protect and self-serve, So he showed up at Wednesday's "Town Hall" to showboat and shift blame. And many of the audience fell for it, booing their lungs out at Marco Rubio and the NRA, fell for it: The one local guy on the stage - the one man who could possibly have prevented the slaughter, and certainly (with competent policemen) could have reduced the death toll - skated. Instead, he sneered at the NRA's Dana Loesch for presuming to bring up the dozens of calls to his office about Nikolas Cruz because, unlike him, she's not privy to the inside dope.

 

More at the link

[Deranged Rhino]

2 minutes ago, Figster said:

Myself personally, drones or trained attack dogs are the safest, fastest way to neutralize a would be shooter. 

 

Metal detection with silent alarm...

 

...Drones? How would drones stop a school shooter without blowing up a chunk of the school itself?

[Figster]

Just now, Deranged Rhino said:

 

...Drones? How would drones stop a school shooter without blowing up a chunk of the school itself?

pepper spray, tazzer, gas ot how about suicide mission and fly the drone right into the face of the shooter.

 

use your imagination...

[Deranged Rhino]

2 minutes ago, Figster said:

pepper spray, tazzer, gas ot how about suicide mission and fly the drone right into the face of the shooter.

 

use your imagination...

 

That's not how drones work though, which I guess was my point. 

[sherpa]

1 minute ago, Figster said:

pepper spray, tazzer, gas ot how about suicide mission and fly the drone right into the face of the shooter.

 

use your imagination...

 

Forget about drones at current technology level.

Drones need GPS to be stable. Not possible inside.

Further, a drone operator would be incredibly vulnerable. It takes both hands on the controls and looking at a display to operate.

I have a commercial drone license, and it isn't possible.

23 minutes ago, Figster said:

If you research it like I just did over two dozen states allow firearms on school grounds and naturally Texas is leading the charge.

 

I'm not talking about legality.

The statement was made that students in the US "know their teachers are armed."

That is not my experience.

[Figster]

Just now, sherpa said:

 

Forget about drones at current technology level.

Drones need GPS to be stable. Not possible inside.

Further, a drone operator would be incredibly vulnerable. It takes both hands on the controls and looking at a display to operate.

I have a commercial drone license, and it isn't possible.

Drones are already being utilized for security purposes. More surveillance albeit.

 

I was under the impression a drone could be operated by camera from a secure location.

[Deranged Rhino]

Just now, Figster said:

Drones are already being utilized for security purposes. More surveillance albeit.

 

I was under the impression a drone could be operated by camera from a secure location.

 

These do...

 

But these aren't what you're thinking of, I'm assuming. 

[Just Jack]

9 minutes ago, sherpa said:

Forget about drones at current technology level.

Drones need GPS to be stable. Not possible inside.

Further, a drone operator would be incredibly vulnerable. It takes both hands on the controls and looking at a display to operate.

I have a commercial drone license, and it isn't possible.

 

Maybe he means this type of drone....

 

 

[sherpa]

Just now, Figster said:

Drones are already being utilized for security purposes. More surveillance albeit.

 

I was under the impression a drone could be operated by camera from a secure location.

 

As I said, I have a commercial drone license. Not that important to this discussion, but I am very familiar with current capability.

First, they are are extremely unstable unless adequate GPS data is available, and it isn't, inside.

Second, the cameras are relatively small field of view, and to fly one into someone heavily armed, inside a building and effect a stop would be nearly impossible. Anyone with an automatic weapon would shoot it down way before it would be able to act offensively, and no jurisdiction would accept the liability associated with an unmanned, unstable, remote controlled  vehicle with offensive weapons.

Just not reality. 

[Figster]

1 minute ago, Just Jack said:

 

Maybe he means this type of drone....

 

 

I don't think it will fit down the hallways, 

 

can I order a mini version?

[sherpa]

Put a trained sniffer beagle at the door.

Classes take turns taking care of it.

End 90% of this crap.

 

[Figster]

13 minutes ago, sherpa said:

 

As I said, I have a commercial drone license. Not that important to this discussion, but I am very familiar with current capability.

First, they are are extremely unstable unless adequate GPS data is available, and it isn't, inside.

Second, the cameras are relatively small field of view, and to fly one into someone heavily armed, inside a building and effect a stop would be nearly impossible. Anyone with an automatic weapon would shoot it down way before it would be able to act offensively, and no jurisdiction would accept the liability associated with an unmanned, unstable, remote controlled  vehicle with offensive weapons.

Just not reality. 

I was thinking more like 5 of them armed with non lethal weapons , but appreciate the inside track on a drones current capabilities.

 

thanks

Edited February 25, 2018 by Figster

[sherpa]

9 minutes ago, Figster said:

I was thinking more like 5 of them armed with non lethal weapons , but appreciate the inside track on a drones current capabilities.

 

thanks

 

A beagle makes more sense.

[Figster]

11 minutes ago, sherpa said:

 

A beagle makes more sense.

It probably does sherpa,

 

I really like the idea of using mans best friend to protect our children.

[row_33]

1 hour ago, Figster said:

I was thinking more like 5 of them armed with non lethal weapons , but appreciate the inside track on a drones current capabilities.

 

thanks

 

Just announcing that a school is protected will be helpful.

 

 

[sherpa]

I just sent this suggestion to my state delegate.

I'll see what happens.

I am certain that the community that I live in could get enough in contributions to fund a test of this, and who knows?

 

I have had the idea for quite a while, but never got around to proposing it to an elected official.

I did propose a similar suggestion on another issue,

I suggested to my state rep and both senators that explosive manufactures be required to impregnate high explosives used in hand held bombs, like C4 etc., with strong scents or other easily detectable markers.

Much like we require natural gas to have a specific odor so leaks can be in detected in a home.

It would be very easy to detect explosives attempted to be carried on an airliner if they were impregnated with some detection component.

 

Interestingly, my state rep and both senator's staffs claimed it was a great idea, one stating it was a "no brainer."

Noting has ever been done.

[Sig1Hunter]

14 hours ago, Figster said:

 Our president is asking school teachers to inflict death on another human being. Its not natural, but we would all like the school shooter shot.

 

Do you see anything wrong with this picture SigHunter? 

Do I see anything wrong with the assertion that normal,  well adjusted humans (not psychopaths) are averse to killing other humans? I'm not saying that when under threat,  we can't/won't do it. Certain people still won't.  Certain people are sheep,  and are terrified to paralysis at the moment of truth.  Check out this link for a fantastic, if not simplistic view, on this. https://www.killology.com/sheep-wolves-and-sheepdogs

 

You seem to be confusing what I was saying initially though.  I'm talking about the school shooters in these situations, and the question was asked whether violent video games could play a part in getting them to that point.  I'm not talking about humans not being able to defend themselves by killing another human that threatens them. Though,  the averseness to it will show up in feelings of guilt and other similar emotions even when someone legally and morally takes another's life. 

 

So,  no. I don't necessarily see anything wrong with arming and training certain teachers.  There are sheepdogs in all walks of life.  There are teachers that are sheepdogs,  and unfortunately some cops turn out to be sheep. A badge, or a gun doesn't make one a sheepdog.

Edited February 25, 2018 by Sig1Hunter

[Sig1Hunter]

On 2/24/2018 at 3:56 PM, Koko78 said:

Ultra realistic is a bit of a stretch.

At risk of running off on a tangent,  I would ask if you have played any of the new generation of FPS video games (non sci fi  shooters)? Companies spend a lot of money making them look as realistic as possible. Virtual reality is becoming more mainstream, so it's only going to get worse (or, better?).  Pretty much the only thing that is missing is the smell of gunpowder and the iron in the blood.  I'm sure smell-o-vision isn't too far off though.  

Edited February 25, 2018 by Sig1Hunter

[row_33]

3 minutes ago, Sig1Hunter said:

At risk of running off on a tangent,  I would ask if you have played any of the new generation of FPS video games (non sci fi  shooters)? Companies spend a lot of money making them look as realistic as possible. Virtual reality is becoming more mainstream, so it's only going to get worse (or, better?).  Pretty much the only thing that is missing is the smell of gunpowder and the iron in the blood.  I'm sure smell-o-vision isn't too far off though.  

 

There cant be much good in playing this constantly for years.