Josh McDaniels Withdraws from Colts' HC Job

[Mat68]

2 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

And the point of that is?  Who cares what Tony Dungy thingks?  You think he has any more info than you, me or anyone else?  Trust me, he doesn't.  

 

Since when does Tony know what NE offered him in those meetings?  Since when does Tony know what is best for McDaniels career?  Since when does Tony know what is best for McDaniels family?

 

You think McDaniels kids give 2 craps what Tony thinks?  Lol

To a man dont have other people change their jobs and uproot there families just to leave them at the alter.  Report is that many found out when it was reported and not from the man himself.  That is the only wrong thing he did.  Family is the biggest B.S excuse.  Nothing changed in the last 2 weeks or last 2 days.  Its one of those things people throw out there because family comes before all else so no one will question it.  Hes a douche always will be. You cant recruit your staff while renegotiating with Kraft, and have your staff sign contracts with Indy, only to back out and claim you never signed anything.  Be a man.  I believe his only chance at a job is NE. Buffalo will be better off for it once it happens.

[GG]

2 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said:

 

You're really gonna die on this hill, alone and in the rain?

 

At least hold up a boom box with Gabriel on

[PIZ]

Didn't Billy Donovan do this to the Orlando Magic?

[Wily Dog]

McDaniels will only be a HC in New England IF, Krafty  keeps his word. 50/50 chance, i think. GM is not in the cards for Douche. Even Kraft can  see what character Douche exhibits and would not want him too close to the crown jewels.

Edited February 8, 2018 by Wily Dog

[Alphadawg7]

28 minutes ago, Mat68 said:

To a man dont have other people change their jobs and uproot there families just to leave them at the alter.  Report is that many found out when it was reported and not from the man himself.  That is the only wrong thing he did.  Family is the biggest B.S excuse.  Nothing changed in the last 2 weeks or last 2 days.  Its one of those things people throw out there because family comes before all else so no one will question it.  Hes a douche always will be. You cant recruit your staff while renegotiating with Kraft, and have your staff sign contracts with Indy, only to back out and claim you never signed anything.  Be a man.  I believe his only chance at a job is NE. Buffalo will be better off for it once it happens.

 

How can you say "nothing changed in the last 2 weeks"???  He got a BETTER offer from NE in that 2 weeks lmao.  Thats the whole point.  He didn't welch and go with a previous offer...NE came hard for him and got him with a new offer that wasn't on the table 2 weeks earlier when they were still in the playoffs.  All this crying over spilt milk is just silly.  

 

Colts had their shot, NE upped the ante to keep him after the fact once the season was over.  He took the NEW offer, weighed it to the Colts deal and decided to go in a different direction.  Yet somehow he is in the wrong for taking into consideration a NEW offer that wasn't presently on the table while they were still playing as a team.  

[BringBackOrton]

5 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

To everyone...its all good.  Hate him all you want, I am there with you...I just hate him because I always hated him.  I think people have a right to choose the best decisions for them and their families, and sometimes those choices don't always come at the same time and tough decisions need to be made.  

 

I wonder if anyone would have felt bad for McDaniels though if he got fired after 8 games if they started 0-8 with that bad roster, especially after uprooting his family to Indy.  No one cares about the player/coach when the team breaks their commitment to them and breaks their contract...and they sure don't think about what the families go through either.  

Didn't you hate on Marrone and call him a quitter?

[IDBillzFan]

2 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said:

 

That the dude from Broadchurch?

 

Yes, but I believe that's from Dr. Who.

[Mat68]

2 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

How can you say "nothing changed in the last 2 weeks"???  He got a BETTER offer from NE in that 2 weeks lmao.  Thats the whole point.  He didn't welch and go with a previous offer...NE came hard for him and got him with a new offer that wasn't on the table 2 weeks earlier when they were still in the playoffs.  All this crying over spilt milk is just silly.  

 

Colts had their shot, NE upped the ante to keep him after the fact once the season was over.  He took the NEW offer, weighed it to the Colts deal and decided to go in a different direction.  Yet somehow he is in the wrong for taking into consideration a NEW offer that wasn't presently on the table while they were still playing as a team.  

Nothing with Lucks health or family.  The excuses used.  He had assistant coaches sign contracts to join indy when didnt is a problem.  Its a level to where his agent had to drop him.  Im a proffessional I understand nothing is final until you sign your name on the line, dont request other men do something you havent.  If you change your mind look after your guys and be a man and tell them before they see it on there phones.

[PatsFanNH]

1 hour ago, K-9 said:

All of this transpired after McDaniels committed to Indy, hired coaches, and then reneged? Seems sudden. After all, it was pretty much known since the regular season ended that McDaniels was going to be hired by the Colts. 

They may have seen a chance to keep him when he went for the second. Review during the buy week (before the SB). It's been reported here that was to reassure McDaniels to take the job.

 

Again pure speculation on my part on why then.

[Alphadawg7]

Just now, Mat68 said:

Nothing with Lucks health or family.  The excuses used.  He had assistant coaches sign contracts to join indy when didnt is a problem.  Its a level to where his agent had to drop him.  Im a proffessional I understand nothing is final until you sign your name on the line, dont request other men do something you havent.  If you change your mind look after your guys and be a man and tell them before they see it on there phones.

 

In all fairness, his agent has to drop him...an agent without a good relationship with teams is an agent who doesn't work anymore.  

 

Like I said, with the assistants...they should have verbally agreed but not signed until McDaniels signed.  They gambled on an unsignable coach who was still coaching in the playoffs for another team eventually signing on the dotted line.  It didn't work out, thats the breaks some times when you sign before the other deal is done.  

 

Bottom line, NE made him a new offer he preferred over the Colts after the fact...and he took it.  Everything else is crying over spilt milk. 

And like I said before, I am fine with others wanting to hate on the deuche bag.  Doesn't change my position.  

 

Coaches and Players are screwed on the regular by teams and GM's who break the contracts whenever they feel like it.  He didn't even have a contract to break.  

[Mat68]

2 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

In all fairness, his agent has to drop him...an agent without a good relationship with teams is an agent who doesn't work anymore.  

 

Like I said, with the assistants...they should have verbally agreed but not signed until McDaniels signed.  They gambled on an unsignable coach who was still coaching in the playoffs for another team eventually signing on the dotted line.  It didn't work out, thats the breaks some times when you sign before the other deal is done.  

 

Bottom line, NE made him a new offer he preferred over the Colts after the fact...and he took it.  Everything else is crying over spilt milk. 

I dont care how it turned out.  That is a reflection of the mans charachter.  At that stage the coaches going had to be close at one point or another with Mcdaniels.  They were given a certain level of security or they would not have signed and would have waited.  To do that to people you respect shows who he is. 

[CA OC Bills Fan]

5 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

How can you say "nothing changed in the last 2 weeks"???  He got a BETTER offer from NE in that 2 weeks lmao.  Thats the whole point.  He didn't welch and go with a previous offer...NE came hard for him and got him with a new offer that wasn't on the table 2 weeks earlier when they were still in the playoffs.  All this crying over spilt milk is just silly.  

 

Colts had their shot, NE upped the ante to keep him after the fact once the season was over.  He took the NEW offer, weighed it to the Colts deal and decided to go in a different direction.  Yet somehow he is in the wrong for taking into consideration a NEW offer that wasn't presently on the table while they were still playing as a team.  

I read your first few posts and then skipped ahead to the last page. As with most here, I can't buy much of what you are saying.

 

Of course he has the legal right to change his mind, pretty sure no one is in dispute on that. Your argument is that there is no integrity issue with what he did since he did not sign a contract and that is where I and others disagree with you (including Tony Dungy, Bill Polian, Pat Kirwin - but, as you say, his kids could care less about what any of them or us think). You made the statement that anyone who gets a better offer and would still honor their verbal commitment is lying. I don't buy that at all. I know I have and would in the future honor my word with or without a signed agreement (I've always been an "at will" employee so a signed agreement could not stop me from changing my mind if I so desired). I've switched companies and have told the one I was leaving to not bother counter offering because I already accepted the other position. I've hired quite a few people in my time, and none has ever backed out although I've always heard that it's possible. I have had people delay giving an answer because they have been waiting for either a counter offer from their current company or an offer from someone else they've been waiting on. In those cases, yes, some have taken the other offer, but, they never accepted the position with me either verbally or in writing prior to the other offer. If they did agree and then decommitt, they would have been blackballed from every company I've worked for.

 

The point is, the time to negotiate both and to do due diligence with your family, etc. is BEFORE you give your word, before you hire others to follow you, not after. That's called integrity and in my opinion most still have it.

 

To your points that teams break contracts all the time, not really true. They act within the agreement. I.e. with coaches they pay the remainder of the contract (as you know, Rex is still taking quite a bit of money from the Pegulas), or whatever the terms were. When Ralph fired Wade and refused to pay him saying he quit but being insubordinate, I think most Bills fans were horrified by Ralph's actions and he eventually lost in court. 

[BillsFan4]

Tony Dungy's full quote (not sure if this has been posted, didn't see it if it was...) 

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/02/07/tony-dungy-josh-mcdaniels-hanging-assistants-out-to-dry-is-indefensible/

 

Quote

".... But having assistant coaches leave jobs to go with you then leave them out to dry is indefensible.”

 

“You make those decisions before you say I Do. Don’t get married start a family then say I changed my mind. He didn’t sign the contract but he said I Do,” Dungy wrote. “That is common decency and integrity. You don’t do that to the families of your peers.”

 

".... This is all on Josh McDaniels. He’s a grown man and has to take responsibility for his decisions,” Dungy wrote. “I can tell you in the football coaching community it’s not even close to being acceptable.”

 

 

[26CornerBlitz]

 

[Alphadawg7]

2 hours ago, CA OC Bills Fan said:

I read your first few posts and then skipped ahead to the last page. As with most here, I can't buy much of what you are saying.

 

Of course he has the legal right to change his mind, pretty sure no one is in dispute on that. Your argument is that there is no integrity issue with what he did since he did not sign a contract and that is where I and others disagree with you (including Tony Dungy, Bill Polian, Pat Kirwin - but, as you say, his kids could care less about what any of them or us think). You made the statement that anyone who gets a better offer and would still honor their verbal commitment is lying. I don't buy that at all. I know I have and would in the future honor my word with or without a signed agreement (I've always been an "at will" employee so a signed agreement could not stop me from changing my mind if I so desired). I've switched companies and have told the one I was leaving to not bother counter offering because I already accepted the other position. I've hired quite a few people in my time, and none has ever backed out although I've always heard that it's possible. I have had people delay giving an answer because they have been waiting for either a counter offer from their current company or an offer from someone else they've been waiting on. In those cases, yes, some have taken the other offer, but, they never accepted the position with me either verbally or in writing prior to the other offer. If they did agree and then decommitt, they would have been blackballed from every company I've worked for.

 

The point is, the time to negotiate both and to do due diligence with your family, etc. is BEFORE you give your word, before you hire others to follow you, not after. That's called integrity and in my opinion most still have it.

 

To your points that teams break contracts all the time, not really true. They act within the agreement. I.e. with coaches they pay the remainder of the contract (as you know, Rex is still taking quite a bit of money from the Pegulas), or whatever the terms were. When Ralph fired Wade and refused to pay him saying he quit but being insubordinate, I think most Bills fans were horrified by Ralph's actions and he eventually lost in court. 

 

Its fine, this has really run its course.  I have enjoyed the discussion and doesn't bother me if my side isn't the popular side, but its just getting repetitive now.  I disagree that he did something wrong.  Others feel differently, no big deal, you wont change my mind and I don't expect you to change yours.  

 

And no disrespect, but there is no comparison to your real world examples and careers in the NFL.  People like to dehumanize the decisions and treat players and coaches like commodities just because of higher pay scales.  Doesn't matter how much they make, they have the right to make decisions they feel are best for their careers long term because if they make the wrong ones, their careers may be short.  Not to mention the impact on their families.  Time will tell if this was good or bad for him.

 

Bottom Line:  New England out sold the Colts on where he should be next year.  Same thing the Clippers did when they out sold Cuban on why he should stay in LA after committing to Dallas.  They were the better salesman in the end at the late hour.  Thats business.  The NFL is a BUSINESS before anything else.  

 

MOST importantly, the deal he took from NE was not on the table when he made his verbal decision.  Was it unfortunate timing the way it all worked out...sure.  But I cant fault someone for making the best decision for his career/family, which can be short if he failed again in his next choice after failing everywhere he has been outside NE as both a HC and OC.  

 

I defended DeAndre Jordan the same when he committed to Dallas, where Dallas missed out on other FA's thinking they had a big deal with him, and then Doc, CP3, and the Clippers came and made one last push for him to stay put and he did.  He made the best decision for himself.  

 

Again, I hate McDaniels.  But I am being consistent in support of people making what they feel is the best career decision for them.  Owners and GM's don't honor contracts in the NFL, so I have no sympathy for them.  

Edited February 8, 2018 by Alphadawg7

[KD in CA]

I wonder if BB was planning to retire after JM got locked in with the Colts just to screw Kraft and Brady and now he'll have to stay another year to save face.

[IDBillzFan]

21 minutes ago, KD in CA said:

I wonder if BB was planning to retire after JM got locked in with the Colts just to screw Kraft and Brady and now he'll have to stay another year to save face.

 

You say that like it's a face worth saving.

 

 

[GunnerBill]

On 2/7/2018 at 2:14 PM, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Seriously?  I don't see how you can have the Rooney Rule, and a written succession plan.

But what do I know.

 

If a coach on your staff has a contractual promise of the HC role you are exempt from the Rooney Rule.  

[JohnC]

4 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

If a coach on your staff has a contractual promise of the HC role you are exempt from the Rooney Rule.  

Is a verbal agreement a contractual promise? I doubt it. 

[GunnerBill]

Just now, JohnC said:

Is a verbal agreement a contractual promise? I doubt it. 

 

No I doubt it too... but we don't know whether there is any wording in the new contract do we?  I think to exempt you from the Rooney Rule it must be contractual.... that is my understanding at least.