Arians: Best QB Class In 15-20 Years

[PaattMaann]

7 minutes ago, TheTruthHurts said:

I just can't see Mayfield going that high. He has nothing GMs drool over. Even Manziel fell like a rock until the Browns bit the bullet. 

 

 

"Even Manziel" like hes some type of a god? Other than being short I see very little similarities between Manziel and Mayfield. 

 

I hope you are correct that he doesn't go that high, be much easier to trade up into the mid teens than top 10

[BigBuff423]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

 

The problem with that approach is I don't think there is that much quality depth in this draft at other positions.  It is not a great draft to rely on to remake your roster.  We could do some things with the LB corps and there is some DT talent and running back talent that helps... but if you are looking at this draft and thinking you remake your WR room or your pass rushing stable from it I think you are in for a rude awakening.  

 

JMO, but to me what you named: LB / DT / RB is exactly where I think the Bills need to go most, except for QB. WRs are a dime a dozen in the NFL these days, and if they don't get a high priced QB, there's money for another decent WR, plus obviously it's also all about where in the Draft you're getting those guys. People will shout me down and throw insults, but I would trade Shady, sign Crowell and Draft a guy like Sony Michel or Ronald Jones in the 2nd. I would sign Paul Richardson or Brice Butler, Tahir Whitehead for LB, Bodine for C, Bromley for DT, Andrew Norwell for Guard, Lawson as a CB and use the picks for QB, DT, LB, RB, LB, CB, DE, DT, WR. And that's assuming the Bills don't trade Tyrod for a mid round pick, or Hughes...I would like to keep Glenn if possible, but I would move him to LG which is where he was projected by a number of "experts", and only because Dawkins is younger and hasn't had the mobility issues Glenn has had with his feet recently. 

 

Point being, the Bills have FA money and will have more if / when they trade Tyrod and Hughes. And I know I'm alone, but I think Beane makes more "surprising" changes this Off-season than people expect. 

[26CornerBlitz]

14 minutes ago, TheTruthHurts said:

I just can't see Mayfield going that high. He has nothing GMs drool over. Even Manziel fell like a rock until the Browns bit the bullet. 

 

 

Manziel being selected anywhere in the 1st round was a joke.

[Steptide]

5 hours ago, Doc Brown said:

15 to 20 years is an odd range.  I'd go for more the 2004 class of E. Manning, Rivers, and Roethlisberger.  I guess you can argue 1999 was full of good prospects, but only half panned out.

 

 

Hits and misses during those years.

 

1998 - Peyton Manning and Matt Hasselback   Busts:  Ryan Leaf

1999- Donivan Mcnabb and Daunte Culpepper Busts: Tim Couch, Akili Smith, Cade McNown

2000- Chad Pennington, Mark Bulger, Tom Satan  Busts: Nobody as Pennington only first round pick

2001-  Michael Vick, Drew Brees  Busts:  Nobody as Vick only first round pick

2002 - Davad Garrard   Busts: Carr, Harrington, Ramsey

I agree with 2004. If we get three qbs out of the 2018 draft as good as the 3 out of 2004, that would be awesome because the bills have a chance to get one. 

 

It still makes me wanna puke that out of those qbs available in 2004, we took jp losman. 

[MrEpsYtown]

6 hours ago, Jamie Muellers Ghost said:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/02/01/bruce-arians-believes-college-qb-crop-may-be-best-in-the-last-15-or-20-years/

 

Bruce Arians believes college QB crop may be “best in the last 15 or 20 years”

Posted by Curtis Crabtree on February 1, 2018, 1:03 AM EST

 

Bruce Arians may not be coaching the Arizona Cardinals anymore, but that doesn’t mean he’s not still invested in the game he coached for 42 years.

 

In an interview with Josh Weinfuss of ESPN.com at the Waste Management Open on Wednesday, Arians spoke glowingly about the group of college quarterbacks eligible to be drafted in April.

 

“Oh, I think it’s outstanding,” Arians said. “Maybe the best in 15 or 20 years. The number of quality guys with height, stature, arms, statistics… I really wish I had the chance to meet each and every one and do all the evaluations but I think right now you could be sitting at 14 and get a quarterback. People are going to start trading up and everything but there’s enough quality guys to go around for everybody.

 

Arians’ former team needs a quarterback following the retirement of Carson Palmer after the season. They will certainly be one of the teams pouring time into evaluations of all of the quarterbacks available in the class.

 

Arians said there’s a lot of quarterbacks that have made an impression on him from this year’s crop.

 

“Talent-wise, I mean, Sam Darnold, Josh Rosen, (Josh) Allen,” he said. “Baker (Mayfield) has that charisma. I love Lamar Jackson. I think he’s got an unbelievable skill set. Mason Rudolph beat my (Virginia Tech) Hokies with that deep ball and he may have the best deep ball of all of them. You could go on and on.”

 

I mean I know we are all experts here, but I trust Arians' judgement. His big mistake was Logan Thomas, but I mean it was the fourth round. 

 

Allen, Darnold, Rosen all have the potential to be big time franchise quarterbacks. Rosen kind of reminds me of Eli, Darnold reminds me of Rivers, Allen could possibly be Big Ben with development.

 

Mayfield and Jackson could be big time players if put in the right system and an offense that will fit their abilities. I don't like Rudolph, but I could see him being a Joe Flacco type. Falk could be something and then you have those Senior Bowl guys with the athletic ability like White and Lauletta. You have Litton,  Ferguson, Benkert etc. Heck you even have Kyle Allen, Houston QB and former five star recruit as a possible UDFA with loads of arm talent. There is high level potential and possible solid starters in this draft class. 

 

 

21 minutes ago, BigBuff423 said:

But, trading UP in a class with a breadth of talent and not necessarily a single elite talent, does not make sense to me and it gives away the Bills' strength this Draft: quantity. 

 

Bills should make that quantity work for them and utilize all of those Draft choices to re-make the roster AND get their QB. You just don't trade up....and in THIS class, I don't think you need to unless 5 QBs go in the top 10....which is possible, but unlikely. One thing us fans should keep in mind, the Draft NEVER, EVER goes the way everyone *thinks* it will and prospects fall and slide. 

 

I think Rosen is that guy. I think he's an elite talent but nobody is talking about him right now. If his last name were Manning, he'd be guaranteed to be the first pick in the draft. I also think Darnold and Allen have elite potential, while Mayfield and Jackson could be really special in the right spot. We need that franchise changing guy. Anything short of that and we are just spinning wheels. I gotta try to trade up for Rosen. 

[thebandit27]

42 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

I think it is probably somewhere close to 2004.  What I would say is different is that the 2004 guys were not as contrasting in style.  Yes Big Ben is different to Eli and Rivers is maybe a bit in between the two but there were all in essence pocket guys. The college game has changed and I think a lot of the evaluation of these guys is going to involve looking at system fits and what you need to put around them to let them have success early.  

 

If I am drafting Josh Rosen I want to make sure my offensive line is really sound and I have speed on the outside.  If I am drafting Sam Darnold I want to make sure that I have a running game that can take the pressure off him to throw every down in his rookie year and receivers that can get separation.  If I draft Baker Mayfield I want to ensure I have an offensive coordinator with experience working with a Quarterback who does much of his best work out of the pocket and receivers who can get YAC. If Rudolph I want big guys on the outside and a run game that can be varied and dynamic.  

 

 

 

Good analysis as usual Gunner.

 

I'll add that if you're drafting Lamar Jackson, you need to make sure that you have him surrounded by speed guys to take advantage of his zone/read and scrambling ability.

 

Oh, and if you're drafting Josh Allen, you should surround him with clergymen who will pray that he finds a way to translate his outstanding physical gifts, attitude, and work ethic into actually playing good football more often than not.

[BuffaloHokie13]

Bruce! Please come to Buffalo and teach our young QB!

[DCOrange]

Knowing Arians likes his QBs big with big arms, it makes sense that he'd like this class so much. Even beyond Rosen, Darnold, Allen, and Lamar who all have the arm that Arians covets, you have Day 2/3 guys like Mike White, Chase Litton, and Kurt Benkert that all fit the mold Arians would look for.

 

I think it's a really talented class overall, but there's a pretty massive dropoff after the top 5 (Rosen, Darnold, Allen, Mayfield, Lamar in whatever order you like). I personally have Lauletta #6 and then another large dropoff from him to #7, but point being, it's a great class at the top and an interesting class at the bottom but there's basically no middle-class.

 

5 QBs being deserving of going in the 1st round alone makes this a great QB class.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

30 minutes ago, PaattMaann said:

 

"Even Manziel" like hes some type of a god? Other than being short I see very little similarities between Manziel and Mayfield. 

 

I hope you are correct that he doesn't go that high, be much easier to trade up into the mid teens than top 10

At the time he was talked about in the top 10. 

[26CornerBlitz]

4 minutes ago, BuffaloHokie13 said:

Bruce! Please come to Buffalo and teach our young QB!

 

His next gig will be as a television analyst.

[PaattMaann]

3 minutes ago, TheTruthHurts said:

At the time he was talked about in the top 10. 

 

I dont care about where pundits predict players to go, because they are always wrong.

 

I am talking about their play. They play nothing alike as QB, Mayfield can actually be a threat passing the ball, all Manziel did was run around. 

 

I am not concerned about Mayfields "off field" stuff whatsoever. He is a fiery competitor and once got drunk in public, for shame! 

 

Mayfield is an actual QB who has gotten better every year and has been learning from a great coach down there. He is a born leader and all of his teammates love the kid. Sign me up.

[JohnC]

46 minutes ago, BigBuff423 said:

Of course only time will tell whether Arians' statement proves to be true, like the 2004 and 1983 Draft class, but when you look at history, it does suggest this year is a year in which the Draft is "due" for a great QB class. Also, since we have no way of knowing the future (unless you're Dunkirk Don) there is no "sure thing", no guarantee. Heck, even Luck was a "sure thing" and while he was amazing for a few years, injuries and coaching have sidetracked his trajectory, but not derailed it.

 

So, I like Rudolph where the Bills are and Mike White for their choice in 3rd round should he last that long. Honestly, Darnold may evolve into something fantastic, Rosen may be the "chosen one" and Josh Allen might very well be the next John Elway (based on arm strength alone) as Jackson might be the next Vick. But, trading UP in a class with a breadth of talent and not necessarily a single elite talent, does not make sense to me and it gives away the Bills' strength this Draft: quantity. 

 

Bills should make that quantity work for them and utilize all of those Draft choices to re-make the roster AND get their QB. You just don't trade up....and in THIS class, I don't think you need to unless 5 QBs go in the top 10....which is possible, but unlikely. One thing us fans should keep in mind, the Draft NEVER, EVER goes the way everyone *thinks* it will and prospects fall and slide. 

I understand your position but disagree with it. The Bills need to identify the top tier qbs in this class and be aggressive in putting themselves in a position to get that particular prospect. Why wait for the prospect to drop into your lap when because of the demand other teams can take that same prospect before you or trade up ahead of you and take your preferred prospect. 

 

No one is arguing that you should recklessly and wastefully give away picks to get your preferred prospect but being passive this year and hoping your prospect falls to you is playing this draft board too passively. This is the year to get a high end prospect in the pipeline. Why not judiciously use a portion of your draft assets in this draft  to get a franchise qb that you have lacked for almost a quarter of a century? If not now, then when? 

[DCOrange]

It would appear that people have forgotten how good of a passer Manziel was in college. Manziel didn't thrive in as structured an environment as Mayfield did (which is saying something because a large part of Mayfield's game relies on him improvizing), but he was a very accurate passer in his own right. I don't think it's a diss to compare the two of them anyways; I think Manziel would have been an effective starting QB if not for his drug addiction.

[26CornerBlitz]

1 minute ago, DCOrange said:

It would appear that people have forgotten how good of a passer Manziel was in college. Manziel didn't thrive in as structured an environment as Mayfield did (which is saying something because a large part of Mayfield's game relies on him improvizing), but he was a very accurate passer in his own right. I don't think it's a diss to compare the two of them anyways; I think Manziel would have been an effective starting QB if not for his drug addiction.

 

I couldn't disagree any more strongly.

Edited February 1, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz

[PaattMaann]

2 minutes ago, DCOrange said:

It would appear that people have forgotten how good of a passer Manziel was in college. Manziel didn't thrive in as structured an environment as Mayfield did (which is saying something because a large part of Mayfield's game relies on him improvizing), but he was a very accurate passer in his own right. I don't think it's a diss to compare the two of them anyways; I think Manziel would have been an effective starting QB if not for his drug addiction.

 

yes he threw to wide open targets all day, very hard to do

 

what drug addiction did manziel have? I mean he was a partier, but I wasn't aware he was a drug addict 

Edited February 1, 2018 by PaattMaann

[DCOrange]

6 minutes ago, PaattMaann said:

 

yes he threw to wide open targets all day, very hard to do

 

what drug addiction did manziel have? I mean he was a partier, but I wasn't aware he was a drug addict 

 

http://sports.cbslocal.com/2016/02/17/johnny-manziel-nfl-quarterback-addict/

 

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016/10/the-fight-to-save-johnny-manziel-from-self-destruction

[BadLandsMeanie]

I was a little disappointed because all Arians did was rattle off the same names. That's not really news.

 

Then he says "I could go on and on", but he doesn't.  Him going on and on would have made the article interesting because then he wouldn't just be parroting what every other Tom, Dick, and Harry is saying.

 

But we get no new information at all. I would like to give Ariens a swift kick in the pants. That reporter should have told him you are not a head coach anymore. Everybody doesn't hang on every word you say now. Say something interesting or STFU Ariens. 

 

 

 

Just kidding.

 

[PaattMaann]

3 minutes ago, DCOrange said:

 

http://sports.cbslocal.com/2016/02/17/johnny-manziel-nfl-quarterback-addict/

 

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016/10/the-fight-to-save-johnny-manziel-from-self-destruction

 

yea those articles both support exactly what I said, I knew he was a partier...but what was he addicted to? partying? 

 

you said "he would be an effective starting QB if it werent for his drug addiction"? So I ask again, what was he addicted to? All drugs? lol

 

Perhaps you meant to say "he would be an effective starting QB if he took being an NFL QB seriously, buckled down and spent time improving his mechanics, learning to play QB, and most importantly learned how to read NFL defenses and studying film all day every day like the great QBs do...instead of partying and worrying about his image"?

Edited February 1, 2018 by PaattMaann

[Lfod]

I think saying the best in 15 to 20 years is a bold statement. Like going overkill on saying that he thinks it's an amazing group. 

 

Well if he's right and it's the best one we seen in 15 years then a few teams should get franchise QBs out of it. 

 

Not saying he's wrong. Just saying it's hard to take seriously when said so strongly. 

[DCOrange]

3 minutes ago, PaattMaann said:

 

yea those articles both support exactly what I said, I knew he was a partier...but what was he addicted to? partying? 

 

you said "he would be an effective starting QB if it werent for his drug addiction"? So I ask again, what was he addicted to? All drugs? lol

 

Sounds like in the very least, he was an alcoholic. The Vanity Fair article basically makes it sound like he was down to use any drugs he could get his hands on. And he literally went to rehab to get past his addiction.

 

I don't know; I'm not a drug expert or anything, but it seems like it's pretty widely accepted that Johnny had addiction issues.

Edited February 1, 2018 by DCOrange