Bills salary cap 2018

[USABuffaloFan]

21 minutes ago, Manther said:

Agreed!  Maybe we will be pleasantly surprised at lack of demand.  Maybe $7 M/year.  But, I think he will be around $9 M.  I do agree between scheme specific and injury history it could really limit interested teams and amount of interest from them.

Don't disagree with any of this.  If Glenn is healthy he should be on the team and producing!  He always has when healthy.  Our cap is fine next year and amazing in 2019.  Glenn is a good contract value wise vs the cap for quality LTs.  Move him to RT, whatever, that is fine too.  Geepers, with our cap space move him to Guard.  He is a very good player!

We have allot of holes now with losing Wood, depth thin now because Groy needs to move up. This year we need to get younger now, if QB there you like great but don't move up, we need every pick. If a great offer comes in for McCoy, take it. I would move on from Glenn, take hit this year. 2019 Bills could be in a great position again especially if we are in the bottom 10 teams. You will sell out McDermott's future going for it now with a thin bench. Shore up team and let it grow like our 1986 teams did with Levy. Otherwise if your going for now you have to trade for a top QB or sign for $30mil/yr 

[Shaw66]

2 hours ago, USABuffaloFan said:

 

Can't afford him without trading all high contracts, too much dead money.

That's not correct, according to Horned what's his face, posted in this thread earlier today:

 

Quote

For those of you who are interested, If you use the Fanspeak salary cap manager(i'll include a link) it uses OTC data I believe; it does a reasonable job, I think, of simulating the different situations. In the included scenario I have for arguments sake removed Tyrod, Cordy and Wood, this has the Bills at just shy of 56M in cap space. I then went ahead and offered EJ Gaines 3 years/ 4M 40% signing bonus, Kirk Cousins 5yr/ 25 M 60% signing bonus and Star Lotulelei 4yrs/8.5 they all accepted in this scenario with still 30 M in cap available https://fanspeak.com/mtc/freeagency.php. I have done  this type of scenario with Paul Richardson and 5 yrs 9 M before and the other approximately where they are. It doesn't always work...sometimes Cousins take 27.5 and Lotulelei 9-9.5 and you get rejected, but it gives and idea.

There's room.   The question isn't cap room; the question is whether they want him.  

[nucci]

5 hours ago, USABuffaloFan said:

Attendance way down in league this year has to have effected future money. 

Fox Sports has outbid every Network for Thursday football. Wait til Amazon and Yahoo start bidding for rights.

[MrEpsYtown]

43 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

That's not correct, according to Horned what's his face, posted in this thread earlier today:

 

There's room.   The question isn't cap room; the question is whether they want him.  

I also think we will have quite a bit of competition. I'm down with Cousins, but I don't see us outbidding Cleveland, the Jets, Minnesota, even Washington.  Us Jacksonville, Arizona, and Denver are all pretty much neck and neck with cap space. 

 

I think the question is can we sell him on us? I think you make some great points, but we are going to have to woo him. That also means somehow beating out John Elway, Arizona weather, Jacksonville and Minnesota's readiness to win, the Jets and Browns $$$$. It's going to be tough to come out with Cousins. 

 

Should have just drafted him instead of TJ Graham

[Hapless Bills Fan]

5 hours ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

...my opinion and don't need to defend it period..............

 

Well, no, you don't need to defend it.

 

But if you want your opinion to be taken seriously beyond the "he agrees with my uninformed opinion so he must be great!" gang, it does need to have some objective basis.

[Kwai San]

9 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

The other thing that could limit the market for Gaines is that he’s somewhat scheme-specific. He’s good in McD’s D but I wouldn’t put him in, say, a secondary that plays mostly man like Rex’s.

 Personally I wouldn't ever wanna see ANY thing Rex ever again......any where any place....well maybe he would be good for laughs over in the XFL......thats about it tho

[Hapless Bills Fan]

35 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

I also think we will have quite a bit of competition. I'm down with Cousins, but I don't see us outbidding Cleveland, the Jets, Minnesota, even Washington.  Us Jacksonville, Arizona, and Denver are all pretty much neck and neck with cap space. 

 

I think the question is can we sell him on us? I think you make some great points, but we are going to have to woo him. That also means somehow beating out John Elway, Arizona weather, Jacksonville and Minnesota's readiness to win, the Jets and Browns $$$$. It's going to be tough to come out with Cousins. 

 

Should have just drafted him instead of TJ Graham

 

Do you really see all those teams as lining up to "sell the farm" to buy Cousins?

 

If you have the top draft pick as Cleveland does, it makes the most sense under the salary cap to draft a QB high and focus on him.  Use your FA $ to put talent around him.

If you have a fairly high pick, as the Jets do, it may still make the most sense to take a QB high, especially if you can bring your capable journeyman back for a year.  You aren't that good.  You need a lot of pieces.

 

I think the teams that are most likely to go after Cousins are Arizona and Denver.  Both of those teams perceive themselves as having talent windows that are closing, and being able to go for a championship with adequate talent at QB.  Also, teams tend to have organizational mindsets that linger through HC changes; both Denver and 'Zona have a history of going for FA QB rather than trying to develop through the draft.

 

I could also see Minn. adopting that mindset, since they have 3 FA QB they might see as "not quite good enough" to take them there.

 

You are right, it will be a matter of selling Cousins on the situation he's going into, which is why unless they franchise him, I don't think Washington, Jets, Cleveland get much of a look.  I could be wrong, though, I often am.

 

It will be interesting to see what Jax does at QB.  I think poor play calling and a few questionable penalties are more to blame for their collapse than Bortles is, in fact he played pretty well vs. Pitt and NE.  But coaches do sometimes look for a nice "fall guy".

[Kwai San]

8 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

So, for example, Wood retiring makes it more likely that the Bills will trade Glenn for a pick.   If I have it right, he will cost the Bills $14 million in cap space to keep him and $11 million if they trade him.   The Bills have Dawkins to play left tackle, they seem at least satisfied with Mills on the right.   If they can trade Glenn for, say, a third round pick, they save $3 million in cap space (making it easier to sign a QB).  Then they can use a first round pick to get a quality center, if there is one in the draft, and use the third round pick they get for Glenn to draft another olineman to groom.  

 

 

 

Respectfully - yer nuts.  I see them keeping Glenn, IF he is truly healthy .  Groy will slide into that Center spot quite nicely and leave that pick you wasted on a Center for a REAL positional need.  DL and LB.  Lets face it - as bad as we need a QB we need to solidify the front 7.......

8 hours ago, bobobonators said:

Next year's bills team is going to look very different. We have so many spots to either add or replace. If we cut TT/Glenn, we need:

 

2 DL - Dareus replacement and an edge rusher

1 LB - we need an upgrade at MLB- REALLY NEED 2-3 LB's

2 OL - Wood and either a RG or RT; Incognito is old as hell too 3 OL?? UMM - Richie just went to the Pro Bowl???  Groy did just fine in EW's spot.

1 QB

 

That's 6 starting caliber players we need to draft/sign; possibly 7. Beane is going to earn his pay this off season.

 

In an ideal world, I would:

 

1. Cut TT/Glenn

2. Sign Cousins - NOT gonna happen in this world

3. Sign the best DL we can afford in FA  Or draft one!

4. Rebuild the entire OL through the draft (drafting 2-3 OL)

5. Draft a MLB

6. Resign Gaines  AGREE 110%

 

It's a lot but it's doable. We would have to hit on our draft picks:  MLB/DL in first round; OL/OL in second round, is how I would go. Then in 3rd round go with a speedy deep threat at WR to compliment KB and Zay

 

My thoughts.....

[Shaw66]

1 hour ago, MrEpsYtown said:

I also think we will have quite a bit of competition. I'm down with Cousins, but I don't see us outbidding Cleveland, the Jets, Minnesota, even Washington.  Us Jacksonville, Arizona, and Denver are all pretty much neck and neck with cap space. 

 

I think the question is can we sell him on us? I think you make some great points, but we are going to have to woo him. That also means somehow beating out John Elway, Arizona weather, Jacksonville and Minnesota's readiness to win, the Jets and Browns $$$$. It's going to be tough to come out with Cousins. 

 

Should have just drafted him instead of TJ Graham

I don't think it's a question of outbidding anyone.  The team that gets him will have more or less made or matched the best offer, but Cousins is a serious guy and he's not going to chase the money.   His deal, wherever he goes, is going to make him really rich.   He's going to decide among those teams that offer enough money, but not necessarily the most money.   So I think the winner will be the team that offers him things he's looking for.   I doubt the weather would move him, but Elway and that defense could, Jacksonville (are they looking?) and Minnesota could be attractive.   My point was that the Bills have a lot that makes them attractive, too.  I think if they decide they want to spend the money, the Bills could be a serious bidder. 

Edited January 28, 2018 by Shaw66

[cba fan]

1 hour ago, MrEpsYtown said:

I also think we will have quite a bit of competition. I'm down with Cousins, but I don't see us outbidding Cleveland, the Jets, Minnesota, even Washington.  Us Jacksonville, Arizona, and Denver are all pretty much neck and neck with cap space. 

 

I think the question is can we sell him on us? I think you make some great points, but we are going to have to woo him. That also means somehow beating out John Elway, Arizona weather, Jacksonville and Minnesota's readiness to win, the Jets and Browns $$$$. It's going to be tough to come out with Cousins. 

 

Should have just drafted him instead of TJ Graham

They need to get the Bills crack PR dept on this.

 

McDermot selling the process. Beano lock step and yet bold power to make the move that many Bills fan(myself many times) don't like but he has the winning vision. Show the playoff drought ending hilites, fan passion, how he will own this town if he makes Bills a winner...etc etc.......meet and greet and eat with the Pegulas.  It can be done..

[John from Riverside]

Too me this is all a bout whether they think Glenn can recover......I REALLY do not want to give up Glenn you dont get better by giving up your young proven talent if it fits your scheme (and switching back to a power based run scheme is totally Glenn)

[MrEpsYtown]

55 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I don't think it's a question of outbidding anyone.  The team that gets him will have more or less made or matched the best offer, but Cousins is a serious guy and he's not going to chase the money.   His deal, wherever he goes, is going to make him really rich.   He's going to decide among those teams that offer enough money, but not necessarily the most money.   So I think the winner will be the team that offers him things he's looking for.   I doubt the weather would move him, but Elway and that defense could, Jacksonville (are they looking?) and Minnesota could be attractive.   My point was that the Bills have a lot that makes them attractive, too.  I think if they decide they want to spend the money, the Bills could be a serious bidder. 

 

Your post a couple of pages ago is really the first time I thought seriously about the situation. You really have made the first convincing argument that I've read that makes me feel good about the possibility of Cousins happening. I just think that there are a ton of moving parts and good amount of competition. I hope we come out on top because he really does seem like a McDermott type of guy. 

[Shaw66]

10 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

 

Your post a couple of pages ago is really the first time I thought seriously about the situation. You really have made the first convincing argument that I've read that makes me feel good about the possibility of Cousins happening. I just think that there are a ton of moving parts and good amount of competition. I hope we come out on top because he really does seem like a McDermott type of guy. 

Thanks.   

 

Obviously, I don't know what will happen.    There are probably 10 teams that would like to have him, and probably five that are serious enough to pursue him at his price.   I think the Bills could be one of the five, and I don't think it's crazy to think they could land him.  

 

All we can do is wait and watch. 

15 minutes ago, John from Hemet said:

Too me this is all a bout whether they think Glenn can recover......I REALLY do not want to give up Glenn you dont get better by giving up your young proven talent if it fits your scheme (and switching back to a power based run scheme is totally Glenn)

I hear you, but as I've said earlier, I think Beane and McD have already shown you what they think about giving up young proven talent.   You can argue about whether Watkins was "proven," and you can argue about Dareus and you can argue about Gilmore and you can claim that Darby wasn't a talent, but really?   Those four guys were probably all among the Bills' top 10 or 12 in talent.   You really think that Beane and McD were okay giving up Watkins, Gilmore, Darby and Dareus for picks or less, and somehow they're going to hold onto Glenn because he's a proven talent?    I don't think so, especially because of his injury history.   

[Hapless Bills Fan]

2 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

I hear you, but as I've said earlier, I think Beane and McD have already shown you what they think about giving up young proven talent.   You can argue about whether Watkins was "proven," and you can argue about Dareus and you can argue about Gilmore and you can claim that Darby wasn't a talent, but really?   Those four guys were probably all among the Bills' top 10 or 12 in talent.   You really think that Beane and McD were okay giving up Watkins, Gilmore, Darby and Dareus for picks or less, and somehow they're going to hold onto Glenn because he's a proven talent?    I don't think so, especially because of his injury history.   

 

Gilmore technically was let walk before Beane came on board I think.  I don't know that I disagree with the evaluation that he wasn't worth what he wanted to us.

I was ticked at the Darby trade, because he is a young talent on a rookie deal, and I feel you need to fit your scheme to your guys.  But I'll give them a mulligan maybe they realized how poor we were at WR and thought Jordan Matthews was worth bringing in on a 1 year "try before buy" as well as the pick.

 

I don't think talent or $$ were the major drivers behind the Watkins and Dareus dumps.  The highest-paid guys on the team have got to be the leaders in attitude and effort or the whole "culture change" train goes off the rails.  Were they good players and could we use them? Absolutely, but I think they just weren't aligned in attitude.

 

Glenn, on the other hand, is reportedly a hard worker with a good attitude, and now a vet on an OL that just lost a key piece.  I think the relevant math for him is, what do they save vs. what will it cost to bring in a FA to fill the roster hole?  They save $4.8M if they trade him before his roster bonus comes due.  That's bottom of the league money for an LT.

[Mark Vader]

14 hours ago, FearLess Price said:

 

 

I shouldve explained better.

 

Glenn can be used as trade fodder with the Colts or Giants for us to trade up and get us Rosen, Darnold, or Mayfield without having to trade the farm.

 

Both NYG and IND need OL help SEVERLY.

 

I could see us using #21, a 2nd round pick, a 3rd round pick and Glenn to move up into either of those teams draft slots.

 

IF it works out like that we'd have a top QB prospect,  pref Mayfield or Darnold.

 

And still have a 1st, a 2nd, a 4th, 2 5ths, a 6th and a 7th etc...

 

Those 6th and 7th round picks can also be thrown in if we are in a QB draft bidding war.

 

 

 

The Bills don't have a 6th or a 7th round pick.

[GreggTX]

They'd be fools to cut Hughes. What they need to do is get another edge rusher to compliment him. He's not lazy and he can't do it all by himself. He is an above avg DE that gets too much attention because Shaq and Yarbrough are below avg.

[Manther]

17 hours ago, USABuffaloFan said:

We have allot of holes now with losing Wood, depth thin now because Groy needs to move up. This year we need to get younger now, if QB there you like great but don't move up, we need every pick. If a great offer comes in for McCoy, take it. I would move on from Glenn, take hit this year. 2019 Bills could be in a great position again especially if we are in the bottom 10 teams. You will sell out McDermott's future going for it now with a thin bench. Shore up team and let it grow like our 1986 teams did with Levy. Otherwise if your going for now you have to trade for a top QB or sign for $30mil/yr 

Huh

[hemma]

If Joe Thomas retires and/or Gettleman cuts Ereck Flowers loose, the pieces may fall into place for moving Glenn, gaining some cap space and also getting some draft capital.

[Shaw66]

17 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Gilmore technically was let walk before Beane came on board I think.  I don't know that I disagree with the evaluation that he wasn't worth what he wanted to us.

I was ticked at the Darby trade, because he is a young talent on a rookie deal, and I feel you need to fit your scheme to your guys.  But I'll give them a mulligan maybe they realized how poor we were at WR and thought Jordan Matthews was worth bringing in on a 1 year "try before buy" as well as the pick.

 

I don't think talent or $$ were the major drivers behind the Watkins and Dareus dumps.  The highest-paid guys on the team have got to be the leaders in attitude and effort or the whole "culture change" train goes off the rails.  Were they good players and could we use them? Absolutely, but I think they just weren't aligned in attitude.

 

Glenn, on the other hand, is reportedly a hard worker with a good attitude, and now a vet on an OL that just lost a key piece.  I think the relevant math for him is, what do they save vs. what will it cost to bring in a FA to fill the roster hole?  They save $4.8M if they trade him before his roster bonus comes due.  That's bottom of the league money for an LT.

As I said, you can come up with a variety of reasons why those guys are gone and why Glenn will stay.  But four of the Bills' 10 or 12 best players are gone.   Every one of the guys who left hast cleared cap room for the Bills (if you include the cap cost of Darby coming up).   Put that together with Beane's simple and clear statement that the best way to acquire talent is to sign rookies.   

 

So, yeah, maybe they like Glenn's attitude, and maybe they had one other issue or another about each of the others, but the fact remains that this leadership has shed some of the most talented players on the team and in every case saved cap room.  Beane and McD are not afraid to lose present talent to acquire younger, cheaper talent.   If they want Cousins and they need cap room, they won't have trouble unloading Glenn.   Heck, he barely played in 2017, so from McDermott's perspective he wouldn't be losing anyone. 

 

I'm not saying it WILL happen, but I won't be surprised at all if it does happen.  

[Paul Costa]

On 1/27/2018 at 10:34 AM, YoloinOhio said:

The other thing that could limit the market for Gaines is that he’s somewhat scheme-specific. He’s good in McD’s D but I wouldn’t put him in, say, a secondary that plays mostly man like Rex’s.

?