Is Tom Brady better than Jordan?

[Buffalo716]

34 minutes ago, BigDingus said:

They're talking about it on ESPN Radio right now, and I have to say I sadly think yes, he is.

Jordan is considered the GOAT in the NBA. He has 6 Championship rings. However, there have been several players with more than that like Bill Russell, Robert Horry, Sam Jones, etc. but Jordan gets more credit because he did it in the modern era and was the leader of those teams.

Again, we have people like Kareem Abdul Jabbar with 6, same with Scottie Pippen, and plenty of people who were also leaders of their team with 5. Tom Brady is tied right now with Charles Haley with most rings regardless of position, but could possibly surpass that with a win. 

I'd argue his 5 rings in the NFL as a QB leading his team is more significant than 6 rings in the NBA, but if he gets 6, there's no contest. He already has the stats to back up everything (just like Jordan), and has more championship game appearances. He's also played 36 post season games (the equivalent of over 2 full NFL seasons) which is absolutely nuts. Jordan also played just over 2 full seasons worth of games in the post season.

 

Jordan was a 6 time Finals MVP, 5 time League MVP, and is 4th all time in scoring. Brady is 4 time SB MVP (most all time), 2 time AP League MVP, and 4th all time in yards/3rd all time in TDs. Brady is also the winningest QB of all time with 223 wins (Peyton is 2nd with 200), while also being the winningest post-season QB ever with 27 wins & 9 losses (.750 win percentage) compared to 2nd place Joe Montana's 16 wins & 7 losses (.696 win percentage).

The fact that Brady dwarfs his peers in post season success, has the stats to back it up in the regular season, stands alone at the top for championship wins & championship appearances (literally played in a SB every other year of his career on average), completed the first & only 16-0 regular season record, 2nd all time in 4th quarter comebacks, 3rd best 4th quarter passer rating all time (behind Tony Romo & Matt Ryan), and makes his teammates better solidifies his spot in my opinion.

On top of all that, he's done it in the era of Free Agency (insane!) and without star players loading up the roster. They gifted him some great receivers in Moss & Welker once, and they were fantastic, but otherwise he has a rotating cast of role players that he elevates, and Gronk. To put how crazy this is in perspective, before Brady the Pats had 2 SB appearances, 0 wins. In their franchise HISTORY, the Steelers & Cowboys have 6 SB championships each with 8 appearances.

 

In one generation, Brady himself has 8 appearances! In that one generation, he has the chance to tie the top 2 franchises in SB wins himself! In the Brady era, he has put the Patriots in the same league as the Cowboys & Steelers in franchise relevance. Jim Kelly is a legend with 4 SB losses...even if Brady loses this SB, that'll almost tie him with Kelly's losses, with the caveat that he also has 5 wins on top of it! 

Overall, I'd say 5 NFL SB rings as a QB is more exclusive and difficult than 6 NBA rings. The fact more people aren't straight up calling him the GOAT *period* as they did Jordan is weird to me. If he wins this game, that'll change fast.

 

Michael Jordan is acknowledged by the NBA as the best ever because his accolades and acclamation. Not his championship rings 

 

He owns the most records in NBA history so by acclamation and accolades the league calls him the greatest basketball player of all time 

Edited January 22, 2018 by Buffalo716

[row_33]

7 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

Michael Jordan is acknowledged by the NBA as the best ever because his accolades. Not his championship rings 

 

He owns the most records in NBA history so by acclamation the league calls him the greatest basketball player of all time 

 

MJ wouldn't be the best in today's game,  it has changed that much since he finally retired.

 

 

[Buffalo716]

25 minutes ago, row_33 said:

 

MJ wouldn't be the best in today's game,  it has changed that much since he finally retired.

 

 

 

I don't think he's the greatest.

 

I still think Larry Bird was better... and I'm a huge Kobe fan

 

stupid phone auto corrects Bird to Byrd... I don't care about Jairus Byrd!

Edited January 22, 2018 by Buffalo716

[row_33]

9 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

I don't think he's the greatest.

 

I still think Larry Byrd was better... and I'm a huge Kobe fan

 

I put MJ way way up there, but what they are doing today makes his day look like Bob Cousy's during the Magic/Bird era.

 

(Bird came along perfectly for my high school / undergrad years...)

 

Nobody could have foreseen how they utilize basically every square in of the court on O and LeBron and Curry play way better in their own way than MJ in his prime, with the most due and worthy respect for MJ.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 22, 2018 by row_33

[Steve O]

18 minutes ago, LABillzFan said:

Brady* will never be better than Jordan because Jordan didn't need to cheat.

For all of the "cheating" the patriots have done over the years, the thing they have benefitted most from is perfectly legal. Brady was the 15th highest paid qb in 2017. This allows NE to sign free agents to contracts that other teams can't match because of salary cap and having big bucks invested in their quarterbacks. While perfectly legal, not having huge $ tied up in their franchise quarterback has given NE a big advantage in free agency.

[Gordio]

In my lifetime(I am 44) there has been two guys that have dominated their respective sport like I have never seen & that is Jordan & Gretzky.  The numbers both those guys put up are unreal.  But...when you break it down like the OP has, man it is tough to argue for Brady not at least being in the conversation.  What the Patriots have done in the last 16 years is mind blowing.  Absolutely mind blowing. 

 

On a side note, I will say one thing.  What amazes me about Jordan is his brand is still as strong as ever.  My son is 13 & plays basketball, both for school & travel.  Jordan sneakers/shirts etc.. are still worn by kids that have never even seen him play.  I find that amazing.   

[row_33]

9 minutes ago, Gordio said:

In my lifetime(I am 44) there has been two guys that have dominated their respective sport like I have never seen & that is Jordan & Gretzky.  The numbers both those guys put up are unreal.  But...when you break it down like the OP has, man it is tough to argue for Brady not at least being in the conversation.  What the Patriots have done in the last 16 years is mind blowing.  Absolutely mind blowing. 

 

On a side note, I will say one thing.  What amazes me about Jordan is his brand is still as strong as ever.  My son is 13 & plays basketball, both for school & travel.  Jordan sneakers/shirts etc.. are still worn by kids that have never even seen him play.  I find that amazing.   

 

Lawrence Taylor completely changed the D to this day.

 

 

[Mat68]

50 minutes ago, BigDingus said:

They're talking about it on ESPN Radio right now, and I have to say I sadly think yes, he is.

Jordan is considered the GOAT in the NBA. He has 6 Championship rings. However, there have been several players with more than that like Bill Russell, Robert Horry, Sam Jones, etc. but Jordan gets more credit because he did it in the modern era and was the leader of those teams.

Again, we have people like Kareem Abdul Jabbar with 6, same with Scottie Pippen, and plenty of people who were also leaders of their team with 5. Tom Brady is tied right now with Charles Haley with most rings regardless of position, but could possibly surpass that with a win. 

I'd argue his 5 rings in the NFL as a QB leading his team is more significant than 6 rings in the NBA, but if he gets 6, there's no contest. He already has the stats to back up everything (just like Jordan), and has more championship game appearances. He's also played 36 post season games (the equivalent of over 2 full NFL seasons) which is absolutely nuts. Jordan also played just over 2 full seasons worth of games in the post season.

 

Jordan was a 6 time Finals MVP, 5 time League MVP, and is 4th all time in scoring. Brady is 4 time SB MVP (most all time), 2 time AP League MVP, and 4th all time in yards/3rd all time in TDs. Brady is also the winningest QB of all time with 223 wins (Peyton is 2nd with 200), while also being the winningest post-season QB ever with 27 wins & 9 losses (.750 win percentage) compared to 2nd place Joe Montana's 16 wins & 7 losses (.696 win percentage).

The fact that Brady dwarfs his peers in post season success, has the stats to back it up in the regular season, stands alone at the top for championship wins & championship appearances (literally played in a SB every other year of his career on average), completed the first & only 16-0 regular season record, 2nd all time in 4th quarter comebacks, 3rd best 4th quarter passer rating all time (behind Tony Romo & Matt Ryan), and makes his teammates better solidifies his spot in my opinion.

On top of all that, he's done it in the era of Free Agency (insane!) and without star players loading up the roster. They gifted him some great receivers in Moss & Welker once, and they were fantastic, but otherwise he has a rotating cast of role players that he elevates, and Gronk. To put how crazy this is in perspective, before Brady the Pats had 2 SB appearances, 0 wins. In their franchise HISTORY, the Steelers & Cowboys have 6 SB championships each with 8 appearances.

 

In one generation, Brady himself has 8 appearances! In that one generation, he has the chance to tie the top 2 franchises in SB wins himself! In the Brady era, he has put the Patriots in the same league as the Cowboys & Steelers in franchise relevance. Jim Kelly is a legend with 4 SB losses...even if Brady loses this SB, that'll almost tie him with Kelly's losses, with the caveat that he also has 5 wins on top of it! 

Overall, I'd say 5 NFL SB rings as a QB is more exclusive and difficult than 6 NBA rings. The fact more people aren't straight up calling him the GOAT *period* as they did Jordan is weird to me. If he wins this game, that'll change fast.

Its an interesting discussion but at the end of the day Jordan never lost in the Finals.  In his prime there was never a discussion if he was the best shooting guard in the league.  He is talked about the best player ever.  No one is saying Tom Brady is the best football player ever.  There have been 2 more prolific Qbs during Bradys career.  Manning and Brees both have better numbers across the board.  Brady is probably closet to Jordan in any sport in terms of clutch.  The overall body on record is not close.   

[BillsFan130]

32 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

Nope. I'd still take Joe Montana over TB every time. He's not even close to being a Jordan. 

There is no right or wrong as everyone is entitled to their opinion, but at this point what makes you think Montana was better than Brady?

[CommonCents]

Tom Brady still hasn't hit a shot over Craig Ehlo.

[Buffalo Barbarian]

Yes

 

 

[RyanC883]

Jordan, and it's not close. (1) how many Championships did Jordan lose?  None.  Brady: two.  In fact, Brady did not win a SB between 2004 and 2014.  Jordan quit basketball, played baseball, came back and won three more Championships; (2) Brady has been caught cheating; (3) Jordan was an all-star both offensively and defensively.  Brady is a pocket QB whom I do not think would survive outside the NE system; (4) Brady never faces the pass-rush because his OL is never called for holding.  

 

Jordan is better by a mile. 

 

 

34 minutes ago, Magox said:

I'd still go with Jordan, but Brady deserves to be in the conversation as the GOAT of any sport.  For my take, he is the best football player to have ever lived, what he does is very Jordanesque in that when he decides to really turn it on he is often times unstoppable. I just can't wait till he retires.

 

Brady does have an immense help by playing behind the "zebra-line" that never gets called for holding, and getting PI calls against his WR's when either the ball is un-catch-able; and/or the defender is legitimately making a play on the ball.  The "shine" has come off the "Brady comeback" the last few years.  

[DCOrange]

This really shouldn't be a debate IMO. A basketball player simply has a far greater impact on their team's success than a football player does; it's just the nature of the sport.

 

Brady most likely won't even have the most MVPs of his era, which is a better indication of how good an individual player is than championship rings.

[firedog]

1 hour ago, BigDingus said:

Overall, I'd say 5 NFL SB rings as a QB is more exclusive and difficult than 6 NBA rings. The fact more people aren't straight up calling him the GOAT *period* as they did Jordan is weird to me. If he wins this game, that'll change fast.

 

I wouldn't say better as they're two different athletes in two different sports. I think the correct comparison would be the word "successful." And in my humble opinion I would vote for Brady as being more successful even if he doesn't win a sixth in two weeks. I will always feel it's harder to win a Super Bowl than a NBA Championship.

[ddaryl]

I got to go with Jordan just based on the fact he was likeable.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

Jordan was great because he was great at all aspects of the game. Offense, defense, handling, shooting... and overall one of the most incredible athletes on the court. 

 

A team of 5 Jordan’s would have been tough to stop. 

 

A team of 11 Brady’s beats no one. He’s very good at one position and would likely be useless at just about any other spot on the field. But because the team and system is built around him doing that 1 thing well.. they win loads of games  

 

 

[row_33]

8 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

Jordan was great because he was great at all aspects of the game. Offense, defense, handling, shooting... and overall one of the most incredible athletes on the court. 

 

A team of 5 Jordan’s would have been tough to stop. 

 

A team of 11 Brady’s beats no one. He’s very good at one position and would likely be useless at just about any other spot on the field. But because the team and system is built around him doing that 1 thing well.. they win loads of games  

 

 

 

 

yeah, 11 Brady's wouldn't hold up well against an NFL defensive line

 

[The Wiz]

Just now, row_33 said:

 

 

yeah, 11 Brady's wouldn't hold up well against an NFL defensive line

 

Sure they would.  The refs would throw flags on every play.

 

Jordan for sure.

[Fadingpain]

I feel like each player has a legitimate shot at claiming to be the best ever in his sport.

 

So to me they are equal.  You didn't provide that as an option.

 

PS:  Some of the throws Brady made yesterday in the AFC championship game were unbelievable, and they were made when the Patriots were down and the going was tough.  The guy is phenomenal.

 

 

[row_33]

8 minutes ago, The Wiz said:

Sure they would.  The refs would throw flags on every play.

 

Jordan for sure.

 

 

maybe 11 Bradys would be unstoppable, might have to rethink this....