Greybeard Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 On 1/14/2018 at 4:28 PM, Ennjay said: He's not a bad coach but he's not special either -- he's no legend. Seems to me the Steelers are kind of stale and they should have done better most of this year, not just today. Would you rearrange the coaching just to freshen things up? Or leave things as they are and hope for better results next year? Did you wonder the same thing about Polian?
Mr. WEO Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Oh, I agree - and ultimately, the buck for all decisions stops with the HC. I do think Haley has persuaded the whole organization to go with his analytics/probability based approach, and I think if Haley hadn't made so many goofball calls, it wouldn't have come down to an onside kick. But fundamentally the Steelers problem with that game is that their defense was facing a "meh" offense with a great RB, and they couldn't shut it down. The problem wasn't that Haley's offense didn't score enough points. It's that it's defense got way behind early to an inferior offense that managed 10 points against the Bills. The problem was that this HC was completely unprepared and seemed to have made no changes after this same Bortles led offense blew him out, also at home, earlier this season. What exactly is Tomlin good at, other than "menacing glare"? If this post season didn't get him fired, the Rooney Rulers are never letting him go. 31 minutes ago, Greybeard said: Did you wonder the same thing about Polian? ??
Alphadawg7 Posted January 16, 2018 Posted January 16, 2018 On 1/14/2018 at 1:28 PM, Ennjay said: He's not a bad coach but he's not special either -- he's no legend. Seems to me the Steelers are kind of stale and they should have done better most of this year, not just today. Would you rearrange the coaching just to freshen things up? Or leave things as they are and hope for better results next year? Fair question... IMO Tomlin is overrated. He makes a lot of poor decisions over the course of his career, decisions that cost them. The Steelers are as well run as NE, and people over look that. Just like with QB's, Head Coaches both get way too much credit at times and way too much blame at times. Tomlin greatly benefits from an organization that continually drafts well and makes good personnel decisions to keep the team competitive to very good. To be clear, while I think he is overrated, I also do not think Tomlin is a terrible coach and the Pittsburgh could do a lot worse than him. Honestly, his personality, demeanor and who is as a person he is a great fit for that team. I don't think he should be fired yet, but also don't think he should be untouchable either or blameless. I would say its warranted to say his seat should be warm, just don't know it should be categorized yet as being on the "hot" seat.
berg1029 Posted January 17, 2018 Posted January 17, 2018 As Bills fans, I'm sure there are plenty here that would agree with this fact: you can do a lot worse than Mike Tomlin
26CornerBlitz Posted January 17, 2018 Posted January 17, 2018 23 minutes ago, berg1029 said: As Bills fans, I'm sure there are plenty here that would agree with this fact: you can do a lot worse than Mike Tomlin We've seen much worse with the Bills too many times in the team's history.
dave mcbride Posted January 17, 2018 Posted January 17, 2018 On 1/14/2018 at 8:16 PM, YoloinOhio said: Yes. He’s an idiot. I question his situational skills, but I honestly think most people don't understand how difficult it is to unite 53 players game after game, especially when half of them are violent sociopaths. Consistently leading players and getting buy-in are not easy things to do, and he's good at that part of it. A lot of coaches aren't good at it. I always go back to Joe Torre. Was he the greatest late-game manager? No. But he was a great manager of people, and was able to keep a team of superstar millionaires (many of them inherently selfish) united and team-oriented for a long time. 22 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said: Fair question... IMO Tomlin is overrated. He makes a lot of poor decisions over the course of his career, decisions that cost them. The Steelers are as well run as NE, and people over look that. Just like with QB's, Head Coaches both get way too much credit at times and way too much blame at times. Tomlin greatly benefits from an organization that continually drafts well and makes good personnel decisions to keep the team competitive to very good. To be clear, while I think he is overrated, I also do not think Tomlin is a terrible coach and the Pittsburgh could do a lot worse than him. Honestly, his personality, demeanor and who is as a person he is a great fit for that team. I don't think he should be fired yet, but also don't think he should be untouchable either or blameless. I would say its warranted to say his seat should be warm, just don't know it should be categorized yet as being on the "hot" seat. See above. He has definite weaknesses, but too many don't look at the strengths he possesses because all they see are the games. A lot more goes into it. 1
Reed83HOF Posted January 17, 2018 Posted January 17, 2018 1 minute ago, dave mcbride said: I question his situational skills, but I honestly think most people don't understand how difficult it is to unite 53 players game after game, especially when half of them are violent sociopaths. Consistently leading players and getting buy-in are not easy things to do, and he's good at that part of it. A lot of coaches aren't good at it. I always go back to Joe Torre. Was he the greatest late-game manager? No. But he was a great manager of people, and was able to keep a team of superstar millionaires (many of them inherently selfish) united and team-oriented for a long time. Not to be a homer, but you could include Marv in that comment as well, minus Torre's success of course... Steelers problems also stem from the lack of veteran leadership that used to be there...
Big C Posted January 17, 2018 Posted January 17, 2018 Talked to a friend who is a Steelers fan. He hated Haley most, but did think this past week could have been used as an opportunity to make a change at HC too. We agreed that his teams are consistently undisciplined and he still makes too many poor choices in-game. Hard to ignore the numbers over 11 years, but you have the best receiver and back in the league, a hall of fame QB and three pro-bowlers on the line and you haven't been to the Super Bowl in 7 years?
nedboy7 Posted January 17, 2018 Posted January 17, 2018 Waiting for this to turn into a TT sucks thread.
dave mcbride Posted January 17, 2018 Posted January 17, 2018 7 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said: Not to be a homer, but you could include Marv in that comment as well, minus Torre's success of course... Steelers problems also stem from the lack of veteran leadership that used to be there... I think Marv fits this too.
corta765 Posted January 17, 2018 Posted January 17, 2018 I wouldn't fire him but he did what I would have done which is fire the OC in Haley. I think its easier for fans and media to say fire a coach from the outside when they don't see the destruction replacing coaches every few years does to a franchise (minus Bills fans we know this first hand). I think one causality of having the Patriots winning and in the SB or AFC title game almost every year is people forget how hard it is to get to those places. If you were to name the top coaches in football after BB in terms of consistent success, Tomlin is on the short list with Pete Carroll, Mike McCarthy, Sean Payton, & John Harbaugh. Every one of these coaches has been in SB's, won their division, made multiple conference title games etc.. I believe that is what you would want as the standard for your teams success with a coach. I do think he blew it with this years team and he let that roster become far too focused on NE and the AFC title then just winning games. But I can't blame the guy for either Denver loss when they had multiple starters out for injuries that would've altered the game. And he did make the AFC Title game again last season. There is only one conference champion and unfortunately for him they face the Patriots every year. I think criticizing a guy like Mike McCarthy would be far more fair because of the fact they don't have a juggernaut in the NFC like NE who is so dam consistently strong.
Alphadawg7 Posted January 17, 2018 Posted January 17, 2018 2 hours ago, dave mcbride said: I question his situational skills, but I honestly think most people don't understand how difficult it is to unite 53 players game after game, especially when half of them are violent sociopaths. Consistently leading players and getting buy-in are not easy things to do, and he's good at that part of it. A lot of coaches aren't good at it. I always go back to Joe Torre. Was he the greatest late-game manager? No. But he was a great manager of people, and was able to keep a team of superstar millionaires (many of them inherently selfish) united and team-oriented for a long time. See above. He has definite weaknesses, but too many don't look at the strengths he possesses because all they see are the games. A lot more goes into it. I agree with you, which is why I said in my response that everything about Tomlin is a perfect fit for that roster and organization. He is overrated, but he is also not a bad coach. Your Joe Torre example pretty much nails my sentiment on how I feel about him as well. Good post. 1
TheFunPolice Posted January 17, 2018 Posted January 17, 2018 (edited) Tomlin is the super intense guy who smashes down or runs through brick walls in his quest to win. Meanwhile, Belichick just walks around the wall and stands there grinning while you are sitting on the ground picking pieces of shattered rock out of your arms. Meanwhile, the score is 14-0 and he's ahead. Your move. Edited January 17, 2018 by TheFunPolice 1
CommonCents Posted January 17, 2018 Posted January 17, 2018 They are going to have a hard time getting a more talented team for him to squander. I'd consider a change.
Wily Dog Posted January 17, 2018 Posted January 17, 2018 I think it would be ridiculous to fire Tomlin. Sure he has some problems but in the long run wouldn't you have wanted Mike to be our Coach for the past ten years rather than the clown show we have been forced to take , present Coach excluded.
Fadingpain Posted January 17, 2018 Posted January 17, 2018 I never saw the "it" factor that made Tomlin a well respected HC. Apparently there is a faction in ownership that wants him gone. 2 hours ago, TheFunPolice said: Tomlin is the super intense guy who smashes down or runs through brick walls in his quest to win. Meanwhile, Belichick just walks around the wall and stands there grinning while you are sitting on the ground picking pieces of shattered rock out of your arms. Meanwhile, the score is 14-0 and he's ahead. Your move. This all day long and twice on Sunday.
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