JohnC Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 3 minutes ago, Augie said: One point to paint the larger picture. Don’t miss the point yourself. I see it for what it is and am indeed looking forward while recognizing the present. It worked 2 years in a row. In the NFL you are lucky if you can “fool” anyone 2 weeks in a row. What has changed is the OC. I’m not a huge fan of the QB or the OC. Next year there is a good chance that both individuals that you find unsatisfying won't be involved with the team. The player for sure and with lesser odds the OC, also.
ColoradoBills Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 16 minutes ago, RyanC883 said: Good post by the OP. I'd imagine that obtaining either Keenum or Smith would cost the least amount of picks (I think Keenum is a FA?). In Smith's case, KC likely wants to start Mahommes anyway. KC is 3 million over the cap with only 41 players signed. Everyone thinks Smith will be traded. He only has 1 year left on his contract.
Augie Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 2 minutes ago, JohnC said: Next year there is a good chance that both individuals that you find unsatisfying won't be involved with the team. The player for sure and with lesser odds the OC, also. I said “I’m not a huge fan”, and I agree with you on that. It's possible that with a guy who who suits his scheme better, and a few other additions, Dennison will present an entirely different offense with better results.
Bills757 Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 39 minutes ago, JohnC said: Changing schemes has little to do with the running qb's struggle with accuracy, eading defenses and going through progressions. You either have an ability to do it or you don't. Blaming the multiple OCs he has played under to adjust to his limitations is a distraction and divergence from the real issue of inherit deficiencies that he has. Teams are adjusting to Taylor by doing their best to contain him and force him to play in a way that he is not comfortable with. The limited book on him is on full display. The running qb has had seven years to add another dimension to his game that would allow him to be a more complete qb. He has not been able to do it. What you now see is what you are going to get. Whaley wanted to move on from Taylor. The new regime apparently wants to move on from him. The storyline is baked in: Taylor will not be on the Bills' roster next year. It will be because he simply isn't good enough for an organization that has higher aspirations other than being mediocre. It’s funny that Taylor’s accuracy is better when on the move. What happened to Dennison rolling him out, taking advantage of his mobility? Let’s face it, they didn’t want him from the beginning.
atlbillsfan1975 Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 25 minutes ago, Augie said: Try to pay attention people: I’m NOT loving on Tyrod, simply pointing out that the previous 2 years we scored plenty of points and ran the ball pretty well. This year? Not so much.... Tyrod’s inability to see the field and go through progressions maddens me as much as the next guy. But you can use him in a way to score more points than we have this year. We just refused to do that because we were married to “a scheme”. It changed a bit over time when they saw it wouldn’t work, but not enough. Looks to me like an OC who is a one trick pony. What scheme adjustment? I don’t think the Bills are doing anything that different from last year. We heard some about the blocking and then it was adjusted but other than that what do you want different? Maybe face the facts that teams had more tape and more time to look at what Tyrod is. Maybe There is not a scheme to make Taylor look better
Augie Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 13 minutes ago, atlbillsfan1975 said: What scheme adjustment? I don’t think the Bills are doing anything that different from last year. We heard some about the blocking and then it was adjusted but other than that what do you want different? Maybe face the facts that teams had more tape and more time to look at what Tyrod is. Maybe There is not a scheme to make Taylor look better It seems to me that, for the most part, the Bills threatened much more with Tyrod’s legs in the past, both with running and moving the pocket. This thread was about playing well from the pocket. THAT is not his thing. In 2015/16 he average about 100 rushes for roughly 575 rushing yards/year. Through 14 games this year he has 75 rushes for 376 yards. That also has a ripple effect in the rest of the rushing game. I’m NOT saying that is the way to go, but IF he is your QB, you try to set him up for success. Oh, and maybe we could stop throwing that screen into the left flat that seems to hit the RDE in the arms every time?
atlbillsfan1975 Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 9 minutes ago, Augie said: It seems to me that, for the most part, the Bills threatened much more with Tyrod’s legs in the past, both with running and moving the pocket. This thread was about playing well from the pocket. THAT is not his thing. In 2015/16 he average about 100 rushes for roughly 575 rushing yards/year. Through 14 games this year he has 75 rushes for 376 yards. That also has a ripple effect in the rest of the rushing game. I’m NOT saying that is the way to go, but IF he is your QB, you try to set him up for success. Oh, and maybe we could stop throwing that screen into the left flat that seems to hit the RDE in the arms every time? I think we witnessed teams realizing what Tyrod does well and they took it away from him. We heard it a few times this year from other teams ‘we wanted to make Taylor be a QB’. Taylor isn’t a pocket passer and disciplined D’s that keep him in the pocket made the offense one dimensional.
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 Geez— how is Flacco so low? If he is terrible in the pocket, he must be atrocious outside of it.
westerndecline Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 Would love cousins or smith. Give those guys a good enough pass rush on the other side. I can see us going very far
Augie Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 Just now, atlbillsfan1975 said: I think we witnessed teams realizing what Tyrod does well and they took it away from him. We heard it a few times this year from other teams ‘we wanted to make Taylor be a QB’. Taylor isn’t a pocket passer and disciplined D’s that keep him in the pocket made the offense one dimensional. I don’t think NFL teams are that slow to catch on. It was what it was for 2 solid years. What has changed? The OC and the OLine coach. Again, I’m ready for something new, but just pointing out what seems obvious to me.
Thurman#1 Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 6 hours ago, Augie said: I’m still disappointed that we wouldn’t adjust the scheme to fit our talents. We could have a much easier path to the playoffs THIS YEAR if not for the stubbornness. Change schemes when you have the guys to make it work. No thanks, not in a year where the absolute ceiling is squeaking into the playoffs as a fodder team at the cost of performing well next year when with luck we might actually be good. Don't teach a scheme you're only going to use for a year. Teach the scheme you're going to be using for the foreseeable future. Bring in the guys who will make it work.
Augie Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 2 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said: No thanks, not in a year where the absolute ceiling is squeaking into the playoffs as a fodder team at the cost of performing well next year when with luck we might actually be good. Don't teach a scheme you're only going to use for a year. Teach the scheme you're going to be using for the foreseeable future. Bring in the guys who will make it work. Well, they are teaching the scheme of the 2nd-3rd choice OC, so I feel a little less committed. I prefer winning now while planning for the future. Having said that, I want a Big Boy Offense. They can learn the scheme when they have the QB who can execute it.
Thurman#1 Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 (edited) 5 hours ago, Augie said: Try to pay attention people: I’m NOT loving on Tyrod, simply pointing out that the previous 2 years we scored plenty of points and ran the ball pretty well. This year? Not so much.... Tyrod’s inability to see the field and go through progressions maddens me as much as the next guy. But you can use him in a way to score more points than we have this year. We just refused to do that because we were married to “a scheme”. It changed a bit over time when they saw it wouldn’t work, but not enough. Looks to me like an OC who is a one trick pony. It wasn't using Tyrod differently that caused the drop in scoring. It was changing the blocking scheme on run plays. Tyrod's been about the same all three years after the first eight or nine weeks of his first year, when they started catching on as to how to play him. He's on track to rack up maybe 200 yards less this season than the last two. That's not a big deal. Maybe a couple of passing TDs less than last year. Again, not a big deal. Whereas we have scored 11 rushing TDs so far this year (14th in the league, not bad) while last year we finished with 29, an insanely good number and by far the highest in the league. Second-best last year? Dallas with 24. 3rd-best last year? The Cardinals and Falcons, who tied with 20. That's where the drop came from. Not from not adjusting how we use Tyrod. Again, 29 rushing TDs last year and we're on a pace to not get half that this year. Edited December 21, 2017 by Thurman#1
Thurman#1 Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 26 minutes ago, Augie said: Well, they are teaching the scheme of the 2nd-3rd choice OC, so I feel a little less committed. I prefer winning now while planning for the future. Having said that, I want a Big Boy Offense. They can learn the scheme when they have the QB who can execute it. Winning now and planning for the future in this case each require different, opposed actions. Like getting a consistent deep dark sun tan while protecting yourself against future skin cancer. Winning now by not teaching the offense they'll use in the future would mean starting all over again next year. That will hurt next year's team. Dennison may not be here, I have no clue. But his offense isn't a quirky and unusual one, unless he had adjusted it to coddle Tyrod. Assuming Rico's gone they can bring in a guy who will require his QB to pass from the pocket. Great. Get the OL used to that now, and the skill position guys who'll be here next year as well.
BobbyC81 Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 7 hours ago, Call_Of_Ktulu said: I cannot tell you how happy I am that Jimmy is not a Patriot anymore. We dodged a bullet because I wouldn't be able to go through another super star top 5 QB on the Patriots. Brady will be done in two years and then we rise. Ha ha! Won't you be surprised when the Pats trade up with someone like the Browns and get one of these top college QBs. Maybe for the 1st pick to get Arnold or Rosen?
Buffalo Barbarian Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 9 hours ago, YoloinOhio said: I believe the Bills coaching staff wants a QB who can play effectively from inside the pocket in order to mesh with the scheme. There has been discussion and rumor about the team having interest in Kirk cousins and/or Alex Smith in the offseason. Found this pretty interesting to that discussion .. Always has always will.
ALF Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 I'm betting Redskins bite the bullet and sign Cousins long term.
ghostwriter Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 I knew Kirk Cousins was going to be good coming out of college but I don't think he is worth what he'll get. My concern is paying top 5 money to a guy that can't carry a franchise on his back. Alex Smith to a 2-3 year deal and Rudolph or Allen on the bench would make our QB situation better than it's ever been since Kelly/Reich.
jr1 Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 Cousins has a worse winning percentage than Tyrod
Tenhigh Posted December 21, 2017 Posted December 21, 2017 6 hours ago, Thurman#1 said: Winning now and planning for the future in this case each require different, opposed actions. Like getting a consistent deep dark sun tan while protecting yourself against future skin cancer. Winning now by not teaching the offense they'll use in the future would mean starting all over again next year. That will hurt next year's team. Dennison may not be here, I have no clue. But his offense isn't a quirky and unusual one, unless he had adjusted it to coddle Tyrod. Assuming Rico's gone they can bring in a guy who will require his QB to pass from the pocket. Great. Get the OL used to that now, and the skill position guys who'll be here next year as well. I am with Augie, while we are still in the hunt, play to your players strengths. And if Rico gets canned after this season, this offense is going to change dramatically anyway. At the very least, if you can make the playoffs with TT, it may help attract some quality free agents in the offseason.
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