Alphadawg7 Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 On 12/13/2017 at 6:45 PM, essential said: I didn't create the picture, just found the link. https://imgur.com/a/MzYYQ Bills: 15) Roquan Smith - LB Georgia 21) Vita Vea - DT Washington Expand This is what I have been saying that the cost to trade Dareus was much more than just shedding Dareus for a 6th round pick. There is a HIGH probability we will invest a first or 2nd round pick on a DT to TRY and replace Dareus. That was my issue with the trade. Had we kept Dareus until at least the offseason, we could have seen if McD and MD could work it out and if not, hopefully get more back for him in the offseason after finishing the season off now that he was healthy. Had we NOT given him away at his lowest value, we many not have to use a high pick to replace him and instead could invest in the OL, LB, or replacing Kyle. Or at least traded him after being productive and gotten a higher pick like a 3rd or 2nd to help offset some of the cost trying to replace him. Oh well...outside of that, I totally agree if the draft fell this way (which it won't) we would hands down take Baker unless we made a big QB move in FA. And if we did go after a QB in FA, then I would love both these picks...but truthfully no way Smith is on the board at 15 IMO and Vita may not be there either at 21. I could actually see us taking Vita at 15 if Smith wasn't there. 2
White Linen Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 (edited) On 12/13/2017 at 9:15 PM, Alphadawg7 said: This is what I have been saying that the cost to trade Dareus was much more than just shedding Dareus for a 6th round pick. There is a HIGH probability we will invest a first or 2nd round pick on a DT to TRY and replace Dareus. That was my issue with the trade. Had we kept Dareus until at least the offseason, we could have seen if McD and MD could work it out and if not, hopefully get more back for him in the offseason after finishing the season off now that he was healthy. Had we NOT given him away at his lowest value, we many not have to use a high pick to replace him and instead could invest in the OL, LB, or replacing Kyle. Or at least traded him after being productive and gotten a higher pick like a 3rd or 2nd to help offset some of the cost trying to replace him. Oh well...outside of that, I totally agree if the draft fell this way (which it won't) we would hands down take Baker unless we made a big QB move in FA. And if we did go after a QB in FA, then I would love both these picks...but truthfully no way Smith is on the board at 15 IMO and Vita may not be there either at 21. I could actually see us taking Vita at 15 if Smith wasn't there. Expand Of course there's a cost to the Dareus trade who knows about high probability of drafting one. Free agency is definitely a possibility as much as the draft. They may do both. Obviously they identified that his antics, effort and contract weren't copacetic. Hard for me to believe you're ok with a coach hating the effort of a player and you wanting to keep him. Could you possibly be ok with that? I'm not sure I totally understand the cap problems but clearly he wasn't the easiest player to trade. Even at the height of his performance you're not getting a 2nd or a 3rd round pick for him. I'm not shooting down you're entire post but let's switch to Baker. I know there's examples of 6 foot tall QB's doing well in the NFL but it's a legit concern. The player has to be so special to overcome that. I'm also concerned that he runs a lot. I think the NFL has shown that a rushing QB inevitably leads to injury. The kid is a legit baller and I love so much about him, but I'd have to take a long look at how I'd translate him in an NFL pocket. Edited December 13, 2017 by White Linen
BobDVA Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 I am officially not on the draft a QB no matter what bandwagon. Past the top two, I do not see one worth it. Get me a new right side of the OL and let Peterman go at it.
Alphadawg7 Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 On 12/13/2017 at 9:52 PM, White Linen said: Of course there's a cost to the Dareus trade who knows about high probability of drafting one. Free agency is definitely a possibility as much as the draft. They may do both. Obviously they identified his antics, effort and contract wasn't copacetic. Hard for me to believe you're ok with a coach hating the effort of a player and you wanting to keep him. Could you possibly be ok with that? I'm not sure I totally understand the cap problems but clearly he wasn't the easiest player to trade. Even at the height of his performance you're not getting a 2nd or a 3rd round pick for him. I'm not shooting down you're entire post but let's switch to Baker. I know there's examples of 6 foot tall QB's doing well in the NFL but it's a legit concern. The player has to be so special to overcome that. I'm also concerned that he runs a lot. I think the NFL has shown that a rushing QB inevitably leads to injury. The kid is a legit baller and I love so much about him, but I'd have to take a long look at how I'd translate him in an NFL pocket. Expand The other topic has been discussed enough, and everyone has various opinions and I understand yours too. As far as Baker goes, he is listed at 6-1 which is 2 inches taller than Wilson, 1" taller than Brees, and only 1" shorter than Rodgers. Someone in another thread countered that is what the school lists him at but he's probably gonna be shorter at combine. Well thats rare, in fact Brees and Wilson had the same height measurement at the combine, school, and NFL level for example. So, out of the top 4 QB's currently in the NFL, 2 of which are surefire HOF players (Brees and Rogers), he is taller than 2 of them and shorter by 1" than the other. For me, his height isn't a very big concern. Now, your concerns about running are obviously valid, as a QB doesn't help you if he isn't on the field. But thats the risk/reward benefit with a guy who can make plays with his legs. Personally, I like the running threat in todays NFL, so it isn't something I am too concerned about. Baker is someone I both think is worth drafting and makes sense for us to go after if we don't make a big move in FA. Then again, there is a LOT of time between now and the draft, and there are a number of QB's who can quickly rise up the draft board like Allen, Mason, and Lamar for instance. It happens every year, so I am totally excited to see how it all starts to shake out after the combine
Dr. Who Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 On 12/13/2017 at 8:38 PM, njbuff said: Unless they get Cousins or trade a 2019 first round pick for Luck............ How do the Bills not aggressively get to the top of this draft for Darnold or Rosen? Expand You see Cleveland or the Giants trading out? I don't.
njbuff Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 On 12/13/2017 at 10:08 PM, Dr. Who said: You see Cleveland or the Giants trading out? I don't. Expand Cleveland has done it multiple times before........... not to say they will do it this year......... and the Giants new brass might think enough of Webb and might wanna get more assets. If, for example, the Bills offer 3 1's and a 2 for the 2nd overall pick, it might be hard to pass up and Darnold or Rosen is the new Buffalo QB, if they both come out.
BuffaloHokie13 Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 On 12/13/2017 at 10:11 PM, njbuff said: Cleveland has done it multiple times before........... not to say they will do it this year......... and the Giants new brass might think enough of Webb and might wanna get more assets. If, for example, the Bills offer 3 1's and a 2 for the 2nd overall pick, it might be hard to pass up and Darnold or Rosen is the new Buffalo QB, if they both come out. Expand And their GM was just replaced for it. Dorsey has enough picks to be happy. He doesn't need to trade out.
Dr. Who Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 On 12/13/2017 at 10:11 PM, njbuff said: Cleveland has done it multiple times before........... not to say they will do it this year......... and the Giants new brass might think enough of Webb and might wanna get more assets. If, for example, the Bills offer 3 1's and a 2 for the 2nd overall pick, it might be hard to pass up and Darnold or Rosen is the new Buffalo QB, if they both come out. Expand That's a king's ransom. I'd be surprised still, but I guess it's possible.
njbuff Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 On 12/13/2017 at 10:12 PM, BuffaloHokie13 said: And their GM was just replaced for it. Dorsey has enough picks to be happy. He doesn't need to trade out. Expand You are correct, but this is Cleveland, so you never know. If the new GM is smart......... stay put and get your QB. On 12/13/2017 at 10:12 PM, Dr. Who said: That's a king's ransom. I'd be surprised still, but I guess it's possible. Expand Trading up for a QB is very costly and I bet the Giants would even want a player thrown into that deal (Glenn).
buffaloboyinATL Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 I only see this happening if we do something else for our QB situation first, like Cousins. If we don't draft a QB (a big if) we could really make some big strides through the draft in other positions.
Dr. Who Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 On 12/13/2017 at 10:14 PM, njbuff said: Trading up for a QB is very costly and I bet the Giants would even want a player thrown into that deal (Glenn). Expand Yes, I know about the cost. My skepticism was that you could pull off the deal, even with the expense. Throwing in Glenn actually makes it more plausible. It's just so many resources for a team with lots of holes and you add LT (or RT if Dawkins is a viable LT). But I am on the side of those who believe franchise qb trumps every other need by a wide margin. Just better get it right at that price.
John from Riverside Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 On 12/13/2017 at 10:14 PM, njbuff said: You are correct, but this is Cleveland, so you never know. If the new GM is smart......... stay put and get your QB. Trading up for a QB is very costly and I bet the Giants would even want a player thrown into that deal (Glenn). Expand The cost really does not matter if the QB ends up being special
Sig1Hunter Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 On 12/13/2017 at 10:19 PM, John from Hemet said: The cost really does not matter if the QB ends up being special Expand It matters if he ends up busting, though.
BobChalmers Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 (edited) On 12/13/2017 at 10:04 PM, jr1 said: LB seems less of a need with Milano starting Expand I don't think (and I don't think OBD thinks) that Preston Brown is the answer they want at MLB. This scheme wants a serious difference maker at MLB. For QB's - What am I missing about Mason Rudolph? Edited December 13, 2017 by BobChalmers
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 On 12/13/2017 at 6:45 PM, essential said: I didn't create the picture, just found the link. https://imgur.com/a/MzYYQ Bills: 15) Roquan Smith - LB Georgia 21) Vita Vea - DT Washington Expand ...interesting....Astrobot's Drafttek site had Buffalo going OL/DL or DL/OL with 1st round picks and Falk as their QB in 2nd with I believe #43.....
wppete Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 I don’t like it. We need to trade up and get a QB. Either Sam Darnold, Josh Rosen or Josh Allen. We have to take a risk on one of these guys.
RyanC883 Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 On 12/13/2017 at 9:55 PM, BobDVA said: I am officially not on the draft a QB no matter what bandwagon. Past the top two, I do not see one worth it. Get me a new right side of the OL and let Peterman go at it. Expand I've got a modified version. I would not move up for anyone but Darnold or Rosen. If Mayfield falls to the Bills or Lamar Jackson I'd grab either of them. Or Luke Faulk in the 2nd round.
BuffaloPride Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 On 12/13/2017 at 9:15 PM, Alphadawg7 said: This is what I have been saying that the cost to trade Dareus was much more than just shedding Dareus for a 6th round pick. There is a HIGH probability we will invest a first or 2nd round pick on a DT to TRY and replace Dareus. That was my issue with the trade. Had we kept Dareus until at least the offseason, we could have seen if McD and MD could work it out and if not, hopefully get more back for him in the offseason after finishing the season off now that he was healthy. Had we NOT given him away at his lowest value, we many not have to use a high pick to replace him and instead could invest in the OL, LB, or replacing Kyle. Or at least traded him after being productive and gotten a higher pick like a 3rd or 2nd to help offset some of the cost trying to replace him. Oh well...outside of that, I totally agree if the draft fell this way (which it won't) we would hands down take Baker unless we made a big QB move in FA. And if we did go after a QB in FA, then I would love both these picks...but truthfully no way Smith is on the board at 15 IMO and Vita may not be there either at 21. I could actually see us taking Vita at 15 if Smith wasn't there. Expand I don't get why everyone thinks we will draft Mayfield. Mcdermott is always preaching about character and building a certain culture in the locker room. Mayfield does not fit the profile of the type of player he's looking for and if we did draft him I would see it as a panic move much like they did with EJ Manuel. I know they are high on Allen. If he's not there or decides not to come out look for Mike White out of E.Kentuckey.
BuffAlone Posted December 13, 2017 Posted December 13, 2017 On 12/13/2017 at 7:04 PM, jrober38 said: Ya, there's no way they don't take Mayfield with their first pick. Expand Be a wrong man to assume anything at this point. Just get "our" guy n let the rest of the draft fall to us. We need to fill alot of holes. QB the biggest, no doubt On 12/13/2017 at 11:35 PM, BuffaloPride said: I don't get why everyone thinks we will draft Mayfield. Mcdermott is always preaching about character and building a certain culture in the locker room. Mayfield does not fit the profile of the type of player he's looking for and if we did draft him I would see it as a panic move much like they did with EJ Manuel. I know they are high on Allen. If he's not there or decides not to come out look for Mike White out of E.Kentuckey. Expand Yikes! No way. Either darnod, rosen, or wait till cousins gets booted on a 2 year deal n try again....
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