Big Turk Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 (edited) 1 minute ago, Jasovon said: The way i see it any sexual behaviour is inappropriate in a work environment unless you work in the sex industry. You are not paid to pick up women. Also consent is king, women are not robots and can make their own choices. There are some opinions in this thread that are truly worrying, we are not animals we are intelligent enough to rise above "animal urges" it's why we have a crime against killing someone to take their stuff. Except the problem lies in a woman can consent in the moment and then wish she hadn't a week later due to regret, etc and then now it becomes a whole new situation if she goes to the police...how many times have we seen this play out? Or nowadays, 15 or 20 years later. Edited December 12, 2017 by matter2003
billsfan1959 Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, TakeYouToTasker said: We absolutely do have to define what is appropriate and what is inappropriate, because that's what the issue is about. And you don't get to make fiat declarations for the entire species about that those actually are. There is a discussion which needs to be had about exactly this, and the discussion needs to be inclusive of either the established legitimacy or illegitimacy of sexuality as transactional. That is not what the issue is about - that is what you want the issue to be about. You can talk all you want about the biological imperatives of male sexual behavior. What separates you from animals is the ability to reason - to understand what is appropriate or inappropriate in any give situation - and moderate your own behaviors accordingly 2
GunnerBill Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 2 minutes ago, Jasovon said: The way i see it any sexual behaviour is inappropriate in a work environment unless you work in the sex industry. You are not paid to pick up women. This. x1000. 1
Jasovon Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, matter2003 said: Except the problem lies in a woman can consent in the moment and then wish she hadn't a week later due to regret, etc and then now it becomes a whole new situation if she goes to the police...how many times have we seen this play out? I don't know but i do know it is a tiny number compared to how many times two people get it on and neither side presses charges. The problem with anecdotal evidence is that it is not representative of the whole picture. 1
Big Turk Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 (edited) 2 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said: That is not what the issue is about - that is what you want the issue to be about. You can talk all you want about the biological imperatives of male sexual behavior. What separates you from animals is the ability to reason - to understand what is appropriate or inappropriate in any give situation - and moderate your own behaviors accordingly True to an extent but I think you fail to realize just how strongly hormones can exert their will over what your "thoughts" are at any given time and to a large extent your logic and reasoning. Edited December 12, 2017 by matter2003
GunnerBill Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, Jasovon said: I don't know but i do know it is a tiny number compared to how many times two people get it on and neither side presses charges. The problem with anecdotal evidence is that it is not representative of the whole picture. It seems we are in the anecdote > evidence age sadly enough.
billsfan1959 Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 4 minutes ago, matter2003 said: I think your actual interactions with women in real life are what need to be called into question. None of which have ever involved inappropriate sexual behavior, thank you.
TakeYouToTasker Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 1 minute ago, GunnerBill said: I actually agree that what is appropriate and what is inappropriate is not an absolute. As I alluded to earlier - there is a level of flirting and sexual "banter" short of unwanted physical contact that I would consider appropriate in a bar or (to use the example above) on a dating app that I would consider entirely inappropriate in a work environment. We spend more time socializing at work than we do anywhere else, and spend more time with our co-workers. Normal human interaction doesn't go away. Workplace behavioral standards are in place because in order to legally absolve businesses, not for any other reason. There is nothing wrong with sexually pursuing someone at work.
Big Turk Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, GunnerBill said: It seems we are in the anecdote > evidence age sadly enough. Starting with unsubstantiated claims from 20 years ago against guys that are being treated as fact. Just now, billsfan1959 said: None of which have ever involved inappropriate sexual behavior, thank you. I've fixed that for you.
Jasovon Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, billsfan1959 said: None of which have ever involved inappropriate sexual behavior, thank you. Which if i'm following the argument is because of your low testosterone level. Apparently. 1
TuelTime Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 2 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said: No, appropriate or inappropriate rests entirely on your behavior... No, appropriate or inappropriate behavior is a matter of perspective. This is why women must sign a non-disclosure agreement before they can party with Shady.
GunnerBill Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 1 minute ago, TakeYouToTasker said: We spend more time socializing at work than we do anywhere else, and spend more time with our co-workers. Normal human interaction doesn't go away. Workplace behavioral standards are in place because in order to legally absolve businesses, not for any other reason. There is nothing wrong with sexually pursuing someone at work. I am sorry I totally, totally disagree. I am a professional. When I am at work I act professional. I don't curse, I don't "sexually pursue" (horrible phrase) people, I don't drink alcohol..... I don't do any number of things that are not appropriate in the work place. 1
Big Turk Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 (edited) 2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: I am sorry I totally, totally disagree. I am a professional. When I am at work I act professional. I don't curse, I don't "sexually pursue" (horrible phrase) people, I don't drink alcohol..... I don't do any number of things that are not appropriate in the work place. Which is likely why you've never seen a woman act in the way I talked about earlier around you at the workplace...just saying. There is nothing wrong with that, but others tend to not display certain behaviors around certain people, so to speak. Edited December 12, 2017 by matter2003
billsfan1959 Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, matter2003 said: I've fixed that for you. Very impressive. Did you do that all on your own?
GunnerBill Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, matter2003 said: Which is likely why you've never seen a woman act in the way I talked about earlier around you at the workplace...just saying. Which is exactly how it should be! 1
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 (edited) I think part of the problem is that individual women are given the power to decide what is and what isn't appropriate. There's no clear-cut standard. Which, again, is why i have a policy of total non-engagement with female coworkers. I am HIGHLY hesitant to allow a woman to make judgements about my behavior, so better to avoid the situation altogether. Edited December 12, 2017 by joesixpack
HappyDays Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 11 minutes ago, matter2003 said: how many times have we seen this play out? You tell me. What's a good example of that happening like you say?
Big Turk Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, joesixpack said: I think part of the problem is that individual women are given the power to decide what is and what isn't appropriate. There's no clear-cut standard. Which, again, is why i have a policy of total non-engagement with female coworkers. I am HIGHLY hesitant to allow a woman to make judgements about my behavior. These days that is a recipe for jail time and financial ruin.
billsfan1959 Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, GunnerBill said: Which is exactly how it should be! Novel concept, right?
TakeYouToTasker Posted December 12, 2017 Posted December 12, 2017 (edited) 20 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said: That is not what the issue is about - that is what you want the issue to be about. You can talk all you want about the biological imperatives of male sexual behavior. What separates you from animals is the ability to reason - to understand what is appropriate or inappropriate in any give situation - and moderate your own behaviors accordingly Wrong. You aren't talking about the ability to reason. You're actually eschewing the ability to reason. Reasoning would encompass not seeking to build social institutions that run afoul of normal human behavior; seeking to prop up those institutions which would severely disadvantage half the population to the benefit of the other half is not reasonable. The fact that you're unwilling to have a conversation about what is normal behavior, instead seeking to impose your own viewpoint about appropriateness based on your studies of the pathology of criminals by fiat declaration lends itself towards my argument, not yours. Edited December 12, 2017 by TakeYouToTasker 2
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