Bills757 Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 13 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: I don't agree. I don't think it is outstanding but it is adequate in my mind. And as people who have been here years will know I am not a great believer in arm strength being the most important factor. I'm with you. Rudolph looks to me the type of QB who has enough velocity to get it done. He also has really good touch and some wiggle to extend plays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 Just now, Woodman19 said: Yeah, I put Jackson up there with Rosen but realistically Rosen and Jackson go 1-2 and then you likely need a top 5 pick for Darnold. Then you start getting into the the 10-15 range where we will likely be. I don't think we are going to blow all our picks for a QB when we have so many holes in a draft class that you can still get a solid QB prospect with the picks we will have If Darnold were to come out, I strongly believe he'd go #1 overall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Who Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 1 hour ago, Luka said: I came here to say this. He's also athletic though. Was running the option last year in a couple games. I think he's also a second rounder, which allows the front office to get much better front 7 players in the first. If we got Mayfield in the second I would be ecstatic. With the inflated value at qb, still think he gets picked mid first, maybe a bit later if Darnold enters the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodman19 Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 1 minute ago, dave mcbride said: If Darnold were to come out, I strongly believe he'd go #1 overall. Either way, Darnold, Jackson and Rosen will likely be out of reach and teams are going to bend over backwards to move up for them. The economical move would be to hover for the tier 2 class that we can pick without spending a ton of draft capital. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Woodman19 said: Either way, Darnold, Jackson and Rosen will likely be out of reach and teams are going to bend over backwards to move up for them. The economical move would be to hover for the tier 2 class that we can pick without spending a ton of draft capital. I think the wise move is to spend a crapload of draft capital in the one year we have it and get a franchise qb. A franchise QB is a dozen-year investment. If he pans out, he covers up everything else. I do not want to settle for Brady Quinn, JP Losman, Christian Ponder, or Brandon Weeden. If the team actually believes that one of the top guys is a sure-thing franchise qb, do what you have to do to get him. We will have the ability to do it for once this year. I still wince at the fact that the Bills couldn't muster up enough draft capital to trade up past Pitt in 2004 and get Roethlisberger, who they loved. The "economical move" doesn't really apply here because in football it's a winner-take-all market in which the QB is everything. Edited November 30, 2017 by dave mcbride 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ndirish1978 Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 This cheap "tier-two" mentality is gross. Trade up and pick a top 2 QB or don't bother. I dunno why you guys seem to think there are 4-5 franchise QBs in this draft, there are maybe 3. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bills Pimpin' Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 He is a great college QB that most likely will not translate to the Pro level. There is a slim chance he is Russell Wilson 2.0 and that's why he should be drafted in the 3rd round like Wilson was. I'd put it at 90% 1st round bust if taken in the 1st and 10% 3rd round steal if taken in the 3rd. Simply not worth the risk IMO.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodman19 Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 1 minute ago, ndirish1978 said: This cheap "tier-two" mentality is gross. Trade up and pick a top 2 QB or don't bother. I dunno why you guys seem to think there are 4-5 franchise QBs in this draft, there are maybe 3. The cheap "tier 2" would have been top 10 picks last year (Allen at least for sure). It's not like we are talking mid round guys here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 28 minutes ago, BrooklynBills said: Rudolf has too weak of an arm to be a 1st round pick. IMO, as a prospect, he is a taller Peterman. McBeane strikes me more of the type that will not reach in round one for a middling prospect based on need, a la Manuel or Losman. They will shoot their shot trying to get one of the top 3 guys or will bow out of the QB game completely this draft. It wouldn't surprise me if they trade out of one of those 1sts this draft to try to pick up a 1st in next year's draft if they fail to get the trade up that they want. Taking a Mayfield or Rudolf or Falk in round 1 would be forcing it IMO, and I don't think these guys are going to force that decision. The one perk is if they take one without trade is, much like EJ, the trade back (in this case last year) for qb plus pick instead of trading up makes it a softer blow if the risky qb flops. pair that guy with a vet (even TT) and you can still add a lot of outside talent. It’s not the worst but not the dream come true of getting a TOP prospect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 4 minutes ago, ndirish1978 said: This cheap "tier-two" mentality is gross. Trade up and pick a top 2 QB or don't bother. I dunno why you guys seem to think there are 4-5 franchise QBs in this draft, there are maybe 3. Problem is you and everyone else has no idea what a franchise QB looks like prior to the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 3 minutes ago, Bills Pimpin' said: He is a great college QB that most likely will not translate to the Pro level. There is a slim chance he is Russell Wilson 2.0 and that's why he should be drafted in the 3rd round like Wilson was. I'd put it at 90% 1st round bust if taken in the 1st and 10% 3rd round steal if taken in the 3rd. Simply not worth the risk IMO.... Not unfair- I’m not an expert on mayfield but things like hard working and pudgy are hard to reconcile for me. With Wilson it was clear he checked every box but had height questions. With mayfield there are a ton of question marks across the board. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Who Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 (edited) 15 minutes ago, dave mcbride said: I think the wise move is to spend a crapload of draft capital in the one year we have it and get a franchise qb. A franchise QB is a dozen-year investment. If he pans out, he covers up everything else. I do not want to settle for Brady Quinn, JP Losman, Christian Ponder, or Brandon Weeden. If the team actually believes that one of the top guys is a sure-thing franchise qb, do what you have to do to get him. We will have the ability to do it for once this year. I still wince at the fact that the Bills couldn't muster up enough draft capital to trade up past Pitt in 2004 and get Roethlisberger, who they loved. The "economical move" doesn't really apply here because in football it's a winner-take-all market in which the QB is everything. Some folks want to spend crazy to move up. I am reticent to do that, but I do think your basic point is correct. If you identify a franchise qb and don't have one, you have to go get the fella. Just having one should make attracting free agents easier. Imo, Rosen and Darnold are the only qbs I would put in that class. I just doubt Cleveland or the Giants move off their pick if they are at #1 and #2 and that leaves you trying to grab third best qb on your chart. I have Mayfield and Jackson as targets more likely in our range. I think both have a chance at being very good qbs, but there are more question marks. Edited November 30, 2017 by Dr. Who Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Dr. Who said: Some folks want to spend crazy to move up. I am reticent to do that, but I do think your basic point is correct. If you identify a franchise qb and don't have one, you have to go get the fella. Just having one should make attracting free agents easier. Imo, Rosen and Darnold are the only qbs I would put in that class. I just doubt Cleveland or the Giants move off their pick if they are at #1 and #2 and that leave you trying to grab third best qb on your chart. I have Mayfield and Jackson as targets more likely in our range. I think both have a chance at being very good qbs, but there are more question marks. I think you're right. Cleveland for a host of reasons HAS to take a qb #1 overall whether they fully believe in the player or not, and the Giants are a franchise that just made it very, very clear that they're taking a QB #1 overall. Their history suggests that they may even move up to draft the guy they want if they can (i.e., trading their first, second, and third plus next year's first to move from 3 to 1 or 2, depending). They are a smart organization that lucked into a bad season when the upcoming qb draft was good. That's obviously the big problem for the Bills. It's great to think about in theory, but at the end of the day, teams at the top are likely to be absolutely committed to taking a QB early. And let's not forget that the last thing the Browns need is more draft picks. It's possible that they may even have too many at this point. Edited November 30, 2017 by dave mcbride 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ndirish1978 Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 16 minutes ago, Woodman19 said: The cheap "tier 2" would have been top 10 picks last year (Allen at least for sure). It's not like we are talking mid round guys here. The last time we tried to get a bargain and even traded up to get someone thought to be hovering near the top prospects at QB we got JP Losman. I don't care if we need to trade both our 1sts and next year's first and another pick to move up, we need a real blue-chipper, not another project. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2003Contenders Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 I don't know. The more I look into the guy, the more I like him. He may be cocky, but I do not see that as "bad character" To me he is the anti-Johnny Football. Mayfield has had to earn everything he's ever received -- so no sense of entitlement here. He is also poised and plays VERY well under pressure: https://www.diehards.com/oklahoma/baker-mayfield-pro-football-focus-oklahoma-sooners-2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yungmack Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 2 hours ago, BuffaloBill said: This is nothing more than an off the cuff remark made by some “NFL Executuve.” It took about one-point-three seconds of thought and that is all it is worth. Sounds like the full phrase should be "NFL executive with close ties to Robert Kraft." NE will be laughing up their sleeve if the Bills take Mayfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooklynBills Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 6 minutes ago, Dr. Who said: Some folks want to spend crazy to move up. I am reticent to do that, but I do think your basic point is correct. If you identify a franchise qb and don't have one, you have to go get the fella. Just having one should make attracting free agents easier. Imo, Rosen and Darnold are the only qbs I would put in that class. I just doubt Cleveland or the Giants move off their pick if they are at #1 and #2 and that leave you trying to grab third best qb on your chart. I have Mayfield and Jackson as targets more likely in our range. I think both have a chance at being very good qbs, but there are more question marks. The third best QB(Josh Allen) is a great QB prospect who likely would have been the 1st QB taken last year. It is not unrealistic to think that the Bills would be able to swing a trade with either the Colts, Browns(they have the Texans 1st), 49ers, Bucs, or Bears, all of whom will be picking in the top 10, with a great chance that the Bears, 49ers, and Colts are in the top 5. Those 3 teams will absolutely be looking for extra draft picks after making trades for QBs(49ers, Bears) or having needs at literally every position besides QB(Colts). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ndirish1978 Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 19 minutes ago, TheTruthHurts said: Problem is you and everyone else has no idea what a franchise QB looks like prior to the draft. You minimize the risk as much as you can by taking a consensus top player, you don't just sit pat and hope someone drops into your lap and happens to be good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 I don't have any evidence for this, but at the end of the day I think Darnold comes out. Too many people think he's the best prospect in the draft, and I think he'd go #1 overall if he leaves SC. I don't see how he can turn that up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted November 30, 2017 Share Posted November 30, 2017 6 hours ago, Buffalo Barbarian said: "There's no telling who the Bills will favor when the draft rolls around, but one NFL executive believes the best fit for the Bills in the rookie class is Oklahoma's Baker Mayfield. The unnamed executive told NFL.com's Daniel Jeremiah that Mayfield would be the starting quarterback as soon as he arrived in Buffalo. "Mayfield isn't as athletic as Tyrod Taylor but he's a much better passer," said the NFL executive. "I think he would be the starter as soon as he arrived." http://www.newyorkupstate.com/buffalo-bills/index.ssf/2017/11/nfl_executive_says_buffalo_bills_are_perfect_fit_for_oklahoma_qb_baker_mayfield.html Was it just Bob Kraft being a prick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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