LB3 Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 48 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: Except he is the 4th highest rated passer in the league under pressure. When he escapes good things happen. That’s not when he struggles. Honest question. Does it count as a pressure when he escapes a clean pocket?
CodeMonkey Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 53 minutes ago, reddogblitz said: With that attitude they certainly won't. Or anytime soon for that matter. A coach that accepts losing is not a good look. "The coach that is rebuilding is rebuilding for the next coach that comes in." --Bill Parcells I doubt it would be just first year McCoach coming to that realization on his own and acting on it.
Kirby Jackson Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 1 minute ago, LBSeeBallLBGetBall said: Honest question. Does it count as a pressure when he escapes a clean pocket? Don’t know the answer but we are seeing that all over the league. Moving the pocket and playing outside of the pocket is a trend. For those that love Baker (I’m a fan too) get used to it. The game is heading that way. 1
Boatdrinks Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 20 minutes ago, Scott7975 said: It was what you are doing though. You are trying to justify the Ints. Like Kirby said Taylor would be crucified. He gets crucified for taking a sack or being off a hair in a 60 yard pass. Yet here we are explaining away interceptions. I don't think we would have win with Taylor either. But I do think we would have had a better chance. I don't care what they do at this point just pick a direction and stick with it. Don't bench a loyal hard working guy that the teammates love then ask him to bail out the embarrassment of the guy he got benched for. If they want the best chance to win start Taylor. If they gave up on the season start Peterman. But be decisive and stick with it and be honest. Fans can agree to disagree if Taylor gave the Bills a better chance to win vs LAC. Apparently the coach(es) didn't and that's all that matters. IF and I stress IF, the move was made in the interest of winning the football game. We all saw what happened. Giving up on the season and starting Peterman is in no way acceptable at any level. " You play to win the game" in the words of Herm Edwards. If the Peterman move last week was made for evaluation purposes or any other reason than winning , McDermott must be fired. Plain and simple. Being decisive and honest about it would not ever excuse the cardinal sin of not trying to win football games. That's what the job is. I don't think in any way that McD has given up on the season at this point. If he disproves that assumption tomorrow and announces Peterman as starter, he should be relieved of his duties immediately .
Scott7975 Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 4 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: I don’t think that anyone disagrees with this. The Bills have to get their guy in this draft. No one is arguing that. Don’t try to lie to us though and tell us that you are trying to win now. It’s impossible that McDermott believes (or believed) that Peterman gave them a better chance to win. He’s either completely and utterly incompetent or a liar. Pick your poison I'm tired of being aggravated so I'm gonna throw a funny out there... A third option to your points is our defense is so bad Nate might look as good as Brady in practice.
Boatdrinks Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 1 minute ago, Kirby Jackson said: Don’t know the answer but we are seeing that all over the league. Moving the pocket and playing outside of the pocket is a trend. For those that love Baker (I’m a fan too) get used to it. The game is heading that way. Baker Mayfield has been my favorite QB prospect all season and continues to be. I know the behavior has become an issue as of late, but I love the way this guy plays QB. He needs to show more maturity for sure, but he is a winner.
aceman_16 Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 After listening to recent pressers.... I think it will be Peterman.
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 7 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: I don’t think that anyone disagrees with this. The Bills have to get their guy in this draft. No one is arguing that. Don’t try to lie to us though and tell us that you are trying to win now. It’s impossible that McDermott believes (or believed) that Peterman gave them a better chance to win. He’s either completely and utterly incompetent or a liar. Pick your poison Maybe the story got convoluted. We are not tanking - purposefully losing We are trying to win - while evaluating every player Playoff mentality - doesn't mean he actually pulled a Rex and promised a playoff game. Yeah it sucks. It's out of my control
Hapless Bills Fan Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 4 hours ago, ShadyBillsFan said: I posted this before and it needs to be posted again for the people with blinders. Yes Nate sucked with 5, But he is not the only one. Many QB's are on the list 3, 4 and 5 times Player INT's In One Game Steve DeBerg 7 TAM Tampa Bay Buccaneers vs. SF 49ers, September 7, 1986 Ken Stabler+ 7 OAK Oakland Raiders vs. Denver Broncos, October 16, 1977 Joe Namath+ 6 NYJ New York Jets vs. Houston Oilers, October 15, 1967 Vinny Testaverde 6 TAM Tampa Bay Buccaneers vs. Minnesota Vikings, October 23, 1988 Joe Namath+ 6 NYJ New York Jets vs. Baltimore Colts, October 18, 1970 Peyton Manning 6 IND Indianapolis Colts vs. San Diego Chargers, November 11, 2007 Brett Favre+ 6 GNB Green Bay Packers vs. St. Louis Rams, January 20, 2002 Ryan Fitzpatrick 6 NYJ New York Jets vs. Kansas City Chiefs, September 25, 2016 Chris Chandler 6 STL St. Louis Rams vs. Carolina Panthers, December 12, 2004 Heath Shuler 5 WAS Washington Redskins vs. Arizona Cardinals, October 16, 1994 Jay Cutler 5 CHI Chicago Bears vs. SF 49ers, November 12, 2009 Ben Roethlisberger 5 PIT Pittsburgh Steelers vs. Jacksonville Jaguars, October 8, 2017 Tony Romo 5 DAL Dallas Cowboys vs. Buffalo Bills, October 8, 2007 Joe Flacco 5 BAL Baltimore Ravens vs. Buffalo Bills, September 29, 2013 Ken Stabler+ 5 OAK Oakland Raiders vs. Miami Dolphins, December 10, 1978 Ken Stabler+ 5 OAK Oakland Raiders vs. New York Jets, October 21, 1979 Troy Aikman+ 5 DAL Dallas Cowboys vs. New York Giants, October 15, 2000 Ken Stabler+ 5 HOU Houston Oilers vs. Pittsburgh Steelers, September 7, 1980 Ken Stabler+ 5 HOU Houston Oilers vs. Seattle Seahawks, October 5, 1980 Tony Romo 5 DAL Dallas Cowboys vs. Chicago Bears, October 1, 2012 Brett Favre+ 5 GNB Green Bay Packers vs. Cincinnati Bengals, October 30, 2005 Drew Brees 5 NOR New Orleans Saints vs. Atlanta Falcons, November 29, 201 Thats a given the way the defense has been playing. I'm trying to figure out where you're going with this. A lot of these guys were vets, with a long track record at the point where they had a crap game, including a track record of being hot-and-cold, bounce-back guys. Can you find one of those guys who did this in the first half of their first game, and do you have any idea why that might be seen as a problem?
34-78-83 Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 6 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: Don’t know the answer but we are seeing that all over the league. Moving the pocket and playing outside of the pocket is a trend. For those that love Baker (I’m a fan too) get used to it. The game is heading that way. Most average fans don't watch other teams with the same level of detail, and aren't aware of any trend except for everyone's favorite - "it's a passing league". They might be SHOCKED seeing the number of stating NFL QB's (some that they admire greatly) who only carry 2 reads on a given passing play for their team. Remember, there are only drop-back pocket passers in the NFL The guy we've got is a decent to good starter when the offense plays to his strengths... Great? Nope. Draft one next year? Yep. 1
BADOLBILZ Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 19 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: Don’t know the answer but we are seeing that all over the league. Moving the pocket and playing outside of the pocket is a trend. For those that love Baker (I’m a fan too) get used to it. The game is heading that way. You'd think a younger HC would get that. Maybe a beat up Peyton Manning defeating his team in the SB by basically not making any sudden movements has convinced him he can't win catering an offense to a dual threat QB.
Kirby Jackson Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 28 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said: Maybe the story got convoluted. We are not tanking - purposefully losing We are trying to win - while evaluating every player Playoff mentality - doesn't mean he actually pulled a Rex and promised a playoff game. Yeah it sucks. It's out of my control The part in the middle they can’t straight face though. Maybe it’s a matter of semantics but these decisions aren’t predicated on trying to win. They are predicated on trying to evaluate things and if wins happen, they happen. 3 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said: You'd think a younger HC would get that. Maybe a beat up Peyton Manning defeating his team in the SB by basically not making any sudden movements has convinced him he can't win catering an offense to a dual threat QB. Yeah, the day of stand in the pocket and deliver are dying. The best guys at it are great at moving within the pocket (like Brady). Other than that, every young QB to enter the league in the last 10 years plays in and out of the pocket (Smith, Wentz, Rodgers, Luck, Wilson, Dak, etc...). It is a new day
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 47 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: I'm trying to figure out where you're going with this. A lot of these guys were vets, with a long track record at the point where they had a crap game, including a track record of being hot-and-cold, bounce-back guys. Can you find one of those guys who did this in the first half of their first game, and do you have any idea why that might be seen as a problem? 1) Pro Football Reference. 2) Does it matter? 6 INT's by a seasoned pro should be worse imo No? 2a) I do believe Nate tired or broke a record that went way way back.
Bills Pimpin' Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 44 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said: Fans can agree to disagree if Taylor gave the Bills a better chance to win vs LAC. Apparently the coach(es) didn't and that's all that matters. IF and I stress IF, the move was made in the interest of winning the football game. We all saw what happened. Giving up on the season and starting Peterman is in no way acceptable at any level. " You play to win the game" in the words of Herm Edwards. If the Peterman move last week was made for evaluation purposes or any other reason than winning , McDermott must be fired. Plain and simple. Being decisive and honest about it would not ever excuse the cardinal sin of not trying to win football games. That's what the job is. I don't think in any way that McD has given up on the season at this point. If he disproves that assumption tomorrow and announces Peterman as starter, he should be relieved of his duties immediately . I really disagree with this and think it is this way of thinking that has helped keep the Bills out of the playoffs for so many years. I do think there is a responsibility to try to win every game and I don't think McD has ever said differently. But I believe it is just as important a job for the head coach, and maybe more so to win a Championship. That should be the ultimate goal. So I agree with you that McD hasn't given up on the season, but he has to think big picture too and he has. Starting Peterman is a big picture championship seeking decision. Starting Tyrod is a single game winning decision that has haunted this organization for 10 plus years. I'll try the big picture decisions for once and see how it goes. All that being said, I think Peterman will as good as an option as Tyrod in a few weeks if he's allowed to start.
JM2009 Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 1 hour ago, Kirby Jackson said: Don’t know the answer but we are seeing that all over the league. Moving the pocket and playing outside of the pocket is a trend. For those that love Baker (I’m a fan too) get used to it. The game is heading that way. Could lose the locker room. 1 minute ago, Bills Pimpin' said: I really disagree with this and think it is this way of thinking that has helped keep the Bills out of the playoffs for so many years. I do think there is a responsibility to try to win every game and I don't think McD has ever said differently. But I believe it is just as important a job for the head coach, and maybe more so to win a Championship. That should be the ultimate goal. So I agree with you that McD hasn't given up on the season, but he has to think big picture too and he has. Starting Peterman is a big picture championship seeking decision. Starting Tyrod is a single game winning decision that has haunted this organization for 10 plus years. I'll try the big picture decisions for once and see how it goes. All that being said, I think Peterman will as good as an option as Tyrod in a few weeks if he's allowed to start. "Peterman will be as good as TT in a couple of weeks". Wow. That's all I can say to this. It never ends. You said Peterman would be better right away. At least you are backtracking a little now.lolAnd you don't start a rookie fifth round pick when the playoffs are very much a possibility in a weak AFC. A terrible move that could lose the locker room.
BuffaloHokie13 Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 19 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: Yeah, the day of stand in the pocket and deliver are dying. The best guys at it are great at moving within the pocket (like Brady). Other than that, every young QB to enter the league in the last 10 years plays in and out of the pocket (Smith, Wentz, Rodgers, Luck, Wilson, Dak, etc...). It is a new day Look at this year alone. Wentz is averaging 5 carries for 22.4 rush yards per game Wilson is averaging 5.8 carries for 37.6 rush yards per game Smith is averaging 4.2 carries for 20 rush yards per game Watson was averaging 5.1 carries for 38.4 rush yards per game before getting hurt. Dak is averaging 3.4 carries for 24.7 rush yards per game Newton is averagin 7.4 carries for 43.6 rush yards per game These guys are the future of the position (other than Smith) as the old guard slowly phases out. Rollouts, RPO's and general movement outside the pocket is only going to increase. A comparison, for those who only watch the Bills Tyrod over the last 3 years: 2015: 7.4 carries for 40.6 rush yards per game 2016: 6.3 carries for 38.7 rush yards per game 2017: 5.7 carries for 27.5 rush yards per game
reddogblitz Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 1 hour ago, CodeMonkey said: I doubt it would be just first year McCoach coming to that realization on his own and acting on it. Seems like first year coach McDermott had come to the realization that not trying to win with the playoffs on the line is OK. Disturbing.
TuelTime Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Bills Pimpin' said: I really disagree with this and think it is this way of thinking that has helped keep the Bills out of the playoffs for so many years. I do think there is a responsibility to try to win every game and I don't think McD has ever said differently. But I believe it is just as important a job for the head coach, and maybe more so to win a Championship. That should be the ultimate goal. So I agree with you that McD hasn't given up on the season, but he has to think big picture too and he has. Starting Peterman is a big picture championship seeking decision. Starting Tyrod is a single game winning decision that has haunted this organization for 10 plus years. I'll try the big picture decisions for once and see how it goes. All that being said, I think Peterman will as good as an option as Tyrod in a few weeks if he's allowed to start. I don't see how starting a guy who is not ready to start in the NFL, and may not even be a capable backup is a "big picture" move. Peterman should ride the bench until we're mathematically eliminated, and see if he can secure a backup spot next TC. After that horrendous 1st half of football, signing Kaepernick to backup Taylor for the rest of the year would make the Bills a better football team. Edited November 21, 2017 by TuelTime
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 3 minutes ago, BuffaloHokie13 said: Look at this year alone. Wentz is averaging 5 carries for 22.4 rush yards per game Wilson is averaging 5.8 carries for 37.6 rush yards per game Smith is averaging 4.2 carries for 20 rush yards per game Watson was averaging 5.1 carries for 38.4 rush yards per game before getting hurt. Dak is averaging 3.4 carries for 24.7 rush yards per game Newton is averagin 7.4 carries for 43.6 rush yards per game These guys are the future of the position (other than Smith) as the old guard slowly phases out. Rollouts, RPO's and general movement outside the pocket is only going to increase. A comparison, for those who only watch the Bills Tyrod over the last 3 years: 2015: 7.4 carries for 40.6 rush yards per game 2016: 6.3 carries for 38.7 rush yards per game 2017: 5.7 carries for 27.5 rush yards per game Only because there is a lack of a true QB in the NFL. The college coaches do not do a good job of developing real talent.
reddogblitz Posted November 21, 2017 Posted November 21, 2017 1 hour ago, Kirby Jackson said: Don’t try to lie to us though and tell us that you are trying to win now. It’s impossible that McDermott believes (or believed) that Peterman gave them a better chance to win. He’s either completely and utterly incompetent or a liar. Pick your poison I'm going with incompetent.
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