Opinion/Theory - Is this team being over-coached?

[blacklabel]

It's interesting how so many are now saying Dennison's system is wrong for Taylor. When they hired Dennison, people automatically made the connection to their time in Baltimore so there was "familiarity" there which "should help" in getting the scheme going in the right direction. Then, analysis of Dennison's concepts were praised as a positive for Taylor because his scheme involved a lot of bootlegs, designed rollouts and other ways to move Taylor away from the pocket in order to open up his view of the field.

 

Then they limp through the first few weeks while using nothing but plays from Dennison's system. Taylor can't execute the 3-step drops and short/quick passes. The OL hadn't adequately mastered the zone blocking scheme so McCoy was being bottled up rather easily. So then Dennison sits down with the offense and takes their feedback about what they do well and what they would like to install into the offense. They end up reinstalling some of the blocking schemes used over the last two seasons and that's when the run game picked back up. They moved Taylor around a bit more and he was able to be efficient and make a few plays when they needed them.

 

And then we see the disasters vs. the Jets and Saints. I really wanted to call the Jets game a fluke. I just assumed the entire team was way less than 100%, they weren't able to prepare the way they normally would and the results were ugly. So we figure, hey, they got 10 days to prep for the Saints, we should hopefully see them get back to playing the way they did against Oakland, Atlanta, Denver, etc. Instead, the offense stays on the field for barely more than one quarter. The defense was giving different pre-snap looks, moving around, shifting at the line, doing some things we normally haven't seen this season, all probably in an effort to throw off Brees but instead it caused them to be out of their gaps time and again and by the third quarter the team was just ready to get out of there. 

 

And now, the switch to Peterman seems to be motivated by the fact that most think he can execute Dennison's offense better than Tyrod. So did they scrap the elements of the 2015-16 offenses and go back to using Dennison's offense 100%? Did the defense get away from their straightforward scheme in an effort to switch it up so they don't look so predictable on film? At the midway point of the season, most teams try to switch things up or use some plays that they haven't used much or at all during the season. 

 

Did the coaches get in their own heads? Did they get away from what was working simply to show teams something different? I can appreciate the emphasis McD puts on detail and preparation... but is it possible the team is being over-coached? Are they preaching too many details at the moment? After Sunday's game, McD, Dennison and Frazier all said similar things about getting back to either fundamentals or doing what they do best. Another coach (may have been a player) stated, "That's not us. That hasn't been us in back to back weeks, that's not how we play our game." It's just my theory but maybe they got away from their bread and butter plays in favor of trying to evolve on both sides of the ball or in an effort to simply give teams different looks. I'm not saying they made the schemes more difficult or anything. I'm just wondering if they have these guys thinking a little too much and it's preventing them from playing fast like they normally do.

[bigK14094]

Its pretty clear that not only did TT have trouble executing the Dennison Offense, the O line also has troubles.  Putting Peterman in  won't fix the fact that the line/Shady have not done well in Dennison's zone blocking scheme.  My prediction...Peterman plays like the rookie he is..........gets two games, and then we have TT again.

[simool]

FFS.  I think you give yourself too much credit.  You don't have all of the variables to solve the equation professor.

[The Now Moment]

7 minutes ago, bigK14094 said:

Its pretty clear that not only did TT have trouble executing the Dennison Offense, the O line also has troubles.  Putting Peterman in  won't fix the fact that the line/Shady have not done well in Dennison's zone blocking scheme.  My prediction...Peterman plays like the rookie he is..........gets two games, and then we have TT again.

Actually, if Peterman connects on passes down the field and gets the defenders to stop crowding the line and actually respect our passing game...that would certainly open up the run game at least a little in my opinion.  Tyrod just hasn't been able to do that this year and Shady has paid for it

[buffalobloodfloridahome]

Getting the Ball out quickly negates the pass rush. Brady has been doing it to us for years. He dink and doinks us to death then when our dline is tired he starts taking shots down the field. Has anyone been paying attention. Then the passes down field open up the run and screen game just to bait us into crowding the line then he throws it over the top again or does slants and short routes. It's how a game is supposed to be called against a good defense. 

[Wayne Arnold]

No. I think the players being coached are under-talented.

[row_33]

There cannot be too many current Bills on the "big chart of players the coaches are going to want around in 2 years for that playoff run."

 

cut them gleefully by the half-dozen when the time comes

 

 

[xsoldier54]

They're not "over coached" but you are definitely over thinking things.  Taylor performed poorly for an extended period as he has been known to do and they replaced him with Peterman in hopes of getting better results.  Period.

35 minutes ago, blacklabel said:

It's interesting how so many are now saying Dennison's system is wrong for Taylor. When they hired Dennison, people automatically made the connection to their time in Baltimore so there was "familiarity" there which "should help" in getting the scheme going in the right direction. Then, analysis of Dennison's concepts were praised as a positive for Taylor because his scheme involved a lot of bootlegs, designed rollouts and other ways to move Taylor away from the pocket in order to open up his view of the field.

 

Then they limp through the first few weeks while using nothing but plays from Dennison's system. Taylor can't execute the 3-step drops and short/quick passes. The OL hadn't adequately mastered the zone blocking scheme so McCoy was being bottled up rather easily. So then Dennison sits down with the offense and takes their feedback about what they do well and what they would like to install into the offense. They end up reinstalling some of the blocking schemes used over the last two seasons and that's when the run game picked back up. They moved Taylor around a bit more and he was able to be efficient and make a few plays when they needed them.

 

And then we see the disasters vs. the Jets and Saints. I really wanted to call the Jets game a fluke. I just assumed the entire team was way less than 100%, they weren't able to prepare the way they normally would and the results were ugly. So we figure, hey, they got 10 days to prep for the Saints, we should hopefully see them get back to playing the way they did against Oakland, Atlanta, Denver, etc. Instead, the offense stays on the field for barely more than one quarter. The defense was giving different pre-snap looks, moving around, shifting at the line, doing some things we normally haven't seen this season, all probably in an effort to throw off Brees but instead it caused them to be out of their gaps time and again and by the third quarter the team was just ready to get out of there. 

 

And now, the switch to Peterman seems to be motivated by the fact that most think he can execute Dennison's offense better than Tyrod. So did they scrap the elements of the 2015-16 offenses and go back to using Dennison's offense 100%? Did the defense get away from their straightforward scheme in an effort to switch it up so they don't look so predictable on film? At the midway point of the season, most teams try to switch things up or use some plays that they haven't used much or at all during the season. 

 

Did the coaches get in their own heads? Did they get away from what was working simply to show teams something different? I can appreciate the emphasis McD puts on detail and preparation... but is it possible the team is being over-coached? Are they preaching too many details at the moment? After Sunday's game, McD, Dennison and Frazier all said similar things about getting back to either fundamentals or doing what they do best. Another coach (may have been a player) stated, "That's not us. That hasn't been us in back to back weeks, that's not how we play our game." It's just my theory but maybe they got away from their bread and butter plays in favor of trying to evolve on both sides of the ball or in an effort to simply give teams different looks. I'm not saying they made the schemes more difficult or anything. I'm just wondering if they have these guys thinking a little too much and it's preventing them from playing fast like they normally do.

 

[BillsFan130]

41 minutes ago, bigK14094 said:

Its pretty clear that not only did TT have trouble executing the Dennison Offense, the O line also has troubles.  Putting Peterman in  won't fix the fact that the line/Shady have not done well in Dennison's zone blocking scheme.  My prediction...Peterman plays like the rookie he is..........gets two games, and then we have TT again.

I agree with most of what you said, except I think TT is done in Buffalo. I cant see them going back to him, unless Peterman gets injured

[row_33]

If he gets hurt, does Joe Webb get his break?

 

[blacklabel]

1 hour ago, xsoldier54 said:

They're not "over coached" but you are definitely over thinking things.  Taylor performed poorly for an extended period as he has been known to do and they replaced him with Peterman in hopes of getting better results.  Period.

 

 

Just thoughts I was sharing. Not overthinking anything. McD is meticulous about details and preparation so my thought was just, I wonder if they're doing too much, I wonder if they're trying to find a solution to every situation they may end up in. We saw it with Rex's defense, everyone knows how complicated it is and all the checks and shifts caused miscommunication and poor play. 

 

And I get the fact that they feel Peterman will be better at the short drops and short throws to slow down the pass rush. But that stuff doesn't matter if the OL collapses by the time Peterman hits his third step. Taylor was responsible for his fair share of the sacks this season but the OL was responsible for more. No QB is going to succeed when they have defenders in their face almost right away. And Peterman is barely an inch taller than Taylor, so it's not as if that solves the issue of numerous batted passes at the line each game.

 

Up until the last two games Taylor was efficient and playing mistake-free football. He alone is not solely responsible for the nosedive this offense has taken. Yeah, he misses an open receiver here and there, he looks a little hesitant to make a tight window throw, and at times he does hold the ball too long because he believes his talent at extending plays is good enough to get him out of trouble and eventually hit an open receiver. And he definitely has done that over his career here in Buffalo but it's not a style of play that can be relied on regularly. But aside from his issues, the OL has been getting whipped up and down the field. They couldn't pick up those delayed blitzes against the Jets and if I recall correctly, most film analysts said 5 of the 7 sacks in that game were on the OL. And against both the Jets and Saints, the run game never got going, there were missed assignments constantly and this group of receivers they have right now struggle to gain separation which is a bad match for a QB like Taylor who rarely throws guys open. Maybe Peterman has a skill set that will help this offense move in the right direction but to think that these abysmal performances over the last two games are primarily the fault of Taylor is just not true. The entire team from top to bottom just hasn't played well whatsoever. And if the OL continues to struggle against the duo of Bosa and Ingram this week then Peterman is in for a long day. And if he performs just as poorly as Taylor then where's that leave them? It's not just the QB in this situation. All areas of the team have had some major breakdowns over the last two weeks. 

 

And the switch to Peterman is surprising because McD preaches patience with the process and certainly seems like a "stay the course" type of coach who isn't prone to making big changes like this. 

[Jerome007]

I feel exactly like you state blacklabel, but I write "feel" not "know", as obviously we're not inside the team. Anyway, let's hope it gets better from now on. Just the run defense getting back to early season form would be quite a change!

[SoTier]

4 hours ago, Wayne Arnold said:

No. I think the players being coached are under-talented.

 

This.  Just look at how many of their first, second, and third  round picks, almost all of them starters, the Bills have shed since last season.  Look at who they replaced them with: JAGS, STers, practice squad refugees, busts.   Yeah, every once in a while a low round/UDFA guy comes along and becomes great, and many part timers play important roles on winning teams, but the reality is that the Day 3 guys and UDFAs generally have less talent than the guys drafted on Day 1.

[Sweats]

Could it be 6 different head coaches, 6 different coaching schemes, 6 different coaching philosophies, 4 different GM's and a constant revolving door of players that might attribute to bad play all around for the past 17 yrs.

 

Food for thought.

[Manther]

On 2017-11-16 at 9:41 PM, Sweats said:

Could it be 6 different head coaches, 6 different coaching schemes, 6 different coaching philosophies, 4 different GM's and a constant revolving door of players that might attribute to bad play all around for the past 17 yrs.

 

Food for thought.

That has nothing to do with the thread

[Doc Brown]

This team's been dominated at the line of scrimmage on both sides the last two games on both sides.  There may be something to your theory, but getting back to basics means blocking and tackling.  I can't remember a worse two game stretch than this.