Who's been most screwed by the Bills? Of All Time.

[Peter]

8 hours ago, Sweats said:

Its got to be Flutie and its not even close.

 

The guy busts his nuts getting the team to the playoffs and then they bench him............i mean, come on man, if that doesn't have the all time Bills fail, then i don't know what does.

 

6 hours ago, Albwan said:

flutie took them to a 10-5 record this year and then replaced him with RJ

This epitomizes screw job.

Imagine how crazy everyone would go in the media and a portion of the fans 

if TT won 10 games and then was benched.

The meltdown would be epic

 

Thurman Thomas on Flutie (at various times during linked audio of John Murphy show):

 

http://www.wgr550.com/media/audio-channel/11-15-thurman-thomas-john-murphy-show-0

 

Spoiler Alert - Thurman is not a fan.

 

Edited November 17, 2017 by Peter

[EasternOHBillsFan]

Wade Phillips, BY FAR. The others deserved exactly what they got, from poor drafts to poor play against good teams!

 

Eric Moulds is my second choice. HE NEVER got a QB worthy of his talent level except Bledsoe for one good season as the second greatest WR to ever wear the Bills uniform, and that includes James Lofton. IMHO Eric Moulds would have been a Hall of Famer on any good team while he played.

 

Edited November 17, 2017 by EasternOHBillsFan

[Paulus]

20 hours ago, LA Grant said:

 

First of all, the bolded sentence is such a dumb take. I have no interest in getting into the weeds on your personal definition of "elite" -- especially if being "a franchise guy for a long time" and a "top 7 or 8" QB doesn't cut it for you.

 

To be clear, my "elite claim," as you put it, is that Tyrod could indeed develop that way, given time in the right system. I think that is possible Tyrod would continue to develop and improve, as he has demonstrated, and as we have seen from other QBs afforded time and consistency. Your position is that improving is impossible. Somehow I think you're speaking from experience.

 

Anyway.

 

Here's an interesting comparison: 

 

 

It's surprising the Titans haven't benched Mariota with those numbers.

 

He certainly played the Steelers like TT would have...

[EasternOHBillsFan]

22 hours ago, LA Grant said:

 

First of all, the bolded sentence is such a dumb take. I have no interest in getting into the weeds on your personal definition of "elite" -- especially if being "a franchise guy for a long time" and a "top 7 or 8" QB doesn't cut it for you.

 

To be clear, my "elite claim," as you put it, is that Tyrod could indeed develop that way, given time in the right system. I think that is possible Tyrod would continue to develop and improve, as he has demonstrated, and as we have seen from other QBs afforded time and consistency. Your position is that improving is impossible. Somehow I think you're speaking from experience.

 

Anyway.

 

Here's an interesting comparison: 

 

 

It's surprising the Titans haven't benched Mariota with those numbers.

 

 

WAIT FOR IT... Hold my beer...!

 

Quote

Steelers 40, Titans 17: Marcus Mariota throws 4 INTs, Ben Roethlisberger throws 4 TDs

http://www.tennessean.com/story/sports/nfl/titans/2017/11/16/steelers-40-titans-17-marcus-mariota-4-ints-ben-roethlisberger-4-tds-thursday-night-football/860700001/

 

[LA Grant]

Mariota's a bust! Bench him! 

[section122]

obvious answer is us fans.  You almost have to go out of your way to be as inept as the Bills have been.  Or cheap out on coaches, scouts, etc...

 

Fun answer:

 

Thurman Thomas - he should have been the MVP of SB 25 but Jim Kelly's ego wouldn't let that happen.  The Bills should have won that game going away running the ball down the Giants throats.

11 minutes ago, LA Grant said:

Mariota's a bust! Bench him! 

 

Mariota is part of a list that includes Eli, Flacco, Jameis Winston, and Carson Palmer that Tyrod was outplaying.  I don't think those teams did as much to sabotage their qb as the Bills did getting rid of his top 3 receivers, competent #2 rb, and hiring a coach that wants to force a system on a player instead of fitting the system to the player either but I digress. 

[Alphadawg7]

Seeing some answers that are factoring in what happened after the fact rather than factoring in how they were treated at the time of the screw job.

 

Most Screwed:  Toss up of Wade Phillips and Bill Polian.  I vote Polian.  

 

Honorable mention:  Travis Henry (drafting McGahee), Lynch/Jackson (Drafting Spiller), London Fletcher, EJ Manuel.

 

I think Henry and Lynch/FJ situation was a big FU to guys who were strengths of the team to try and get shiny new toys when this team had not respected what those guy had already been contributing and not respecting how other positions could have been much bigger impacts to the improvement of the team.

 

London Fletcher:  Unfairly thrown under the bus for why guys were making tackles down field.  He was NOT the problem and went on to be a great addition the Redskins for many more years while we suffered through mostly meh players at LB, especially after getting rid of his replacement Poz who was even slower than Fletcher and couldn't stay healthy.

 

EJ Manuel:  I know, he isnt in the category of any of the others mentioned.  But I think this kid had his potential career severely hurt spending it here.  Like idiots, they brought a QB made of paper mache in Kolb to try and let him sit and develop.  Because of that stupidity, he was force to start way before he was ready.  Then despite showing some promise, they decided to just yo yo the kid and crush his confidence while also simultaneously fielding a pretty talent challenged offense around him.  I dont know if EJ would have ever been a starter having been drafted to a better situation, but he sure as hell would have had a much better chance at it.  He was grossly mishandled here, and when you are a more raw prospect, that grooming plays a significant role in your development more than anyone.   

 

 

14 hours ago, EasternOHBillsFan said:

Wade Phillips, BY FAR. The others deserved exactly what they got, from poor drafts to poor play against good teams!

 

Eric Moulds is my second choice. HE NEVER got a QB worthy of his talent level except Bledsoe for one good season as the second greatest WR to ever wear the Bills uniform, and that includes James Lofton. IMHO Eric Moulds would have been a Hall of Famer on any good team while he played.

 

 

I was too gonna add Moulds, but he was never directly screwed by this team.  Yes, he suffered through some tough years, but he was always treated and paid well by the team.  He was more unlucky and unfortunate than actually screwed.  Ended his career as a highly respected and talented WR regardless.

Edited November 17, 2017 by Alphadawg7

[Gavin in Va Beach]

14 hours ago, Peter said:

 

 

Thurman Thomas on Flutie (at various times during linked audio of John Murphy show):

 

http://www.wgr550.com/media/audio-channel/11-15-thurman-thomas-john-murphy-show-0

 

Spoiler Alert - Thurman is not a fan.

 

 

I love Thurman but could give a **** what he thinks about Flutie. If Flutie was too much of a prick in the Bills locker room and Bills players didn't like him, so !@#$ing what? Did they like winning? Flutie was justified in being a prick anyway because he was initially signed being told he had a shot at the starting job prior to the Bills signing Brittle Rob Johnson, only to be regulated to the bench immediately. 

 

Most screwed is a toss up between Wade and Flutie, but I'll give it to Flutie. You don't bench a QB who got you to the playoffs.

[Peter]

4 minutes ago, Gavin in Va Beach said:

 

I love Thurman but could give a **** what he thinks about Flutie. If Flutie was too much of a prick in the Bills locker room and Bills players didn't like him, so !@#$ing what? Did they like winning? Flutie was justified in being a prick anyway because he was initially signed being told he had a shot at the starting job prior to the Bills signing Brittle Rob Johnson, only to be regulated to the bench immediately. 

 

Most screwed is a toss up between Wade and Flutie, but I'll give it to Flutie. You don't bench a QB who got you to the playoffs.

 

Therein lies the problem.  Thank you for illustrating it.  Did they win because of Flutie or did they win because of the amazing defense the Bills had? 

 

I will never forget Flutie's post game press conferences.  When the the Bills won, Flutie would use the pronoun "I."  When the Bills lost, Flutie would say "we."

 

 

[Gavin in Va Beach]

1 minute ago, Peter said:

 

Therein lies the problem.  Thank you for illustrating it.  Did they win because of Flutie or did they win because of the amazing defense the Bills had? 

 

I will never forget Flutie's post game press conferences.  When the the Bills won, Flutie would use the pronoun "I."  When the Bills lost, Flutie would say "we."

 

 

 

Riddle me this: what was the Bills record with that amazing defense with Rob Johnson starting? With Doug Flutie starting? I'll hang up and listen.

[Peter]

3 minutes ago, Gavin in Va Beach said:

 

Riddle me this: what was the Bills record with that amazing defense with Rob Johnson starting? With Doug Flutie starting? I'll hang up and listen.

 

When RJ walked off the field in the Bills last playoff game, the Bills were winning.  As Thurman said, the Bills did NOT lose because Flutie did not play.  Hence, Flutie was not screwed and we were not screwed by the decision to sit him down.

 

As for their relative records as starters, I would have to go back and take a look.  Needless to say, the best and most important ingredient to the success of those Bills teams was not Flutie notwithstanding that Flutie and his minions would have you believe that there were 11 Fluties on offense and 11 Fluties on defense.

[Royale with Cheese]

On 11/15/2017 at 11:39 PM, Thurman#1 said:

Tyrod could be "elite"? Puh-leeze! Good grief. With the money and the chances they gave him he has been treated fairly. I totally understand why Tyrod would feel frustrated and angry. It's how nearly any player would feel. But he simply hasn't played well enough. He's handling this like a pro, like the good guy that he is. But if he'd played better, this move never would have happened.

 

I understand why he doesn't have a lot of total yards, but his YPA was 6.6. I mean that's awful, it's 30th in the league.  Teams know Tyrod now and how to shut him down. It's not surprising they had to make a change.

 

Will putting in Peterman make the Bills better? Won't teams figure him out too and learn how to shut him down? Maybe. Hard to say, but I totally understand this move. They aren't getting it done. Changes are necessary. We may see more as things move along.

 

As for being screwed ... Fred Jackson, maybe, but I'd say Travis Henry. Remember when he kept playing on a broken leg? The guy was tough and good, and put it all on the line for the team, and they drafted Willis McGahee. 

 

Henry turned out to be an idiot, trafficking cocaine and burying himself in child support payments, but the Bills treated him badly and McGahee IMHO wasn't any better. Waste of a draft pick.

 

Didnt even think of Henry but it’s probably as good an answer as Phillips.

[Best Player Available]

56 minutes ago, Peter said:

 

When RJ walked off the field in the Bills last playoff game, the Bills were winning.  As Thurman said, the Bills did NOT lose because Flutie did not play.  Hence, Flutie was not screwed and we were not screwed by the decision to sit him down.

I am not a fan of Fluties ego, etc.

But since when is Thurman "lost my helmet" Thomas the final say on anything? The same guy who played for the fish, then years later moves too Buffalo for $$$$$$ & recognition. He was a great Bill a HOF player. His opinion on the game is as pertinent as anyone's here. . 

[Marty McFly]

The fans. Then Flutie. Then Wade. Then Tyrod.

[dave mcbride]

Daryle Lamonica. Is it even arguable? He's one of the best qbs in league history and spent 4 years on the bench in Buffalo behind an inferior qb (Kemp). The Bills were good between 1964 and 1966 because of defense and the running game. Kemp was bad. Lamonica's teams went 66-16-6 when he started, and his numbers in Oakland were off the charts.

16 hours ago, EasternOHBillsFan said:

Wade Phillips, BY FAR. The others deserved exactly what they got, from poor drafts to poor play against good teams!

 

Eric Moulds is my second choice. HE NEVER got a QB worthy of his talent level except Bledsoe for one good season as the second greatest WR to ever wear the Bills uniform, and that includes James Lofton. IMHO Eric Moulds would have been a Hall of Famer on any good team while he played.

? - Say what you will about Flutie, but he had a special connection with Moulds. The best receiving year in all of Bills history is Moulds' 1998 season, and it ain't even that close.

Edited November 17, 2017 by dave mcbride

[EasternOHBillsFan]

2 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

Daryle Lamonica. Is it even arguable? He's one of the best qbs in league history and spent 4 years on the bench in Buffalo behind an inferior qb (Kemp). The Bills were good between 1964 and 1966 because of defense and the running game. Kemp was bad. Lamonica's teams went 66-16-6 when he started, and his numbers in Oakland were off the charts.

? - Say what you will about Flutie, but he had a special connection with Moulds. The best receiving year in all of Bills history is Moulds' 1998 season, and it ain't even that close.

 

Flutie would have NEVER made him a HOF player... and he only started in 10 of the 16 games that season. You don't get into the Hall of Fame based upon one season... if he would have had a franchise QB to throw to him, his Hall selection would have been unquestioned. He had almost 10,000 receiving with some real scrub QBs.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

3 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Didnt even think of Henry but it’s probably as good an answer as Phillips.

Was it Henry that had an accident at 2am? 

Or CJ 

 

One has 7 baby mommas.  

Point being immature and drove themselves OOT

[Peter]

3 hours ago, Best Player Available said:

I am not a fan of Fluties ego, etc.

But since when is Thurman "lost my helmet" Thomas the final say on anything? The same guy who played for the fish, then years later moves too Buffalo for $$$$$$ & recognition. He was a great Bill a HOF player. His opinion on the game is as pertinent as anyone's here. . 

 

In my judgment, it really is informative and telling to know what teammates think of another teammate. 

 

It is particularly instructive here where far too many people think that Flutie was the original " St. Doug" when, in fact, teammates thought otherwise (to put it mildly)- particularly someone as respected as Thurman Thomas.

[Manther]

On 2017-11-15 at 11:42 PM, Gugny said:

Wade, hands down.

 

Flutie can choke on a bag of HIV infested penises.

Wow, just wow

[Royale with Cheese]

53 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

Was it Henry that had an accident at 2am? 

Or CJ 

 

One has 7 baby mommas.  

Point being immature and drove themselves OOT

 

That was Henry...also with a 14 year old girl.