Tyrod' Trade Value

[K D]

a desperate team might give you a late rounder just to make sure they are able to sign him because he wouldn't want to sign there otherwise (Cleveland) but other than that he would most likely be cut.  if they find a QB in the draft and said QB and Peterman both play well in the preseason then yes i believe they would cut Tyrod loose

[Teddy KGB]

Get a 5th from the Cardinals perhaps.   Or value is zilch.  

[GunnerBill]

11 minutes ago, mjt328 said:

I disagree with most of the posters here.  I'm pretty sure Tyrod Taylor does have trade value around the league.

 

Despite what some fans claim, there are actually a lot of great qualities about Taylor.  He's easily the most mobile quarterback in the league, and a dangerous weapon that defenses must always account for.  He almost never turns the ball over.  He is a hard worker and great teammate. 

 

Many Bills fans only want to know "Is he a franchise quarterback?"  If the answer is no, they are ready to move on to the next guy.  And I can't blame them for that mentality.  But the franchise QB pile in this league is very small.  Teams looking for quality passers run out of options pretty quickly.  That's why mediocre guys like Ryan Tannehill get massive extensions.  That's why free agents who have done nothing like Mike Glennon get huge contracts.  That's why teams will trade two drafts worth of picks for a strong prospect.  That's why journeymen like Josh McCown and Ryan Fitzpatrick are never short of work.

 

Taylor's cap hit in 2018 is relatively small (just over $8 million).  Once the dust clears on free agency and the draft, I could see some teams getting desperate.  Assuming the Bills land their guy, and assuming they like Nathan Peterman to step into the backup role next year... there may be a market for Taylor.  I wouldn't anticipate it going higher than a Day 2 pick, but the idea that nobody could possibly want him is foolish.

 

 

I generally agree with your post.  But you are wrong on his cap hit.  It is $18m next year.  My understanding is the Bills eat about $7.5m of that if they trade him before 1 June.... so that would mean the new team being on the hook for about $10.5m  

[Kirby Jackson]

5 hours ago, NewEra said:

I bet Denver would give up a pick for him 

That’s where I’m at. They have a win now defense and no QB. Sam Bradford got a 1st and a 4th on a worse contract. Alex Smith got 2 2nds I think. We need to understand the market.  I wouldn’t even be a little surprised if you got a 2nd from Denver or Arizona or Jacksonville. Those teams all have talented rosters and no QB. His contract will be rock solid for a team trading for him. His contract is a positive for a team looking at him not a negative!! We still don’t get it...

Edited November 15, 2017 by Kirby Jackson

[GunnerBill]

2 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

That’s where I’m at. They have a win now defense and no QB. Sam Bradford got a 1st and a 4th on a worse contract. Alex Smith got 2 2nds I think. We need to understand the market.  I wouldn’t even be a little surprised if you got a 2nd from Denver or Arizona or Jacksonville. Those teams all have talented rosters and no QB. His contract will be rock solid for a team trading for him. His contract is a positive for a team looking at him not a negative!! We still don’t get it...

 

I think a 2nd might be too steep.  The Bradford price was ramped up by WHEN the Vikings lost their QB.  Alex Smith was just a year removed from going to an NFC Title game.  I think a 3rd is maybe possible.... a 4th just feels right.... maybe a 4th that can become a 3rd if the team makes the playoffs and a 6th or something?

[Kirby Jackson]

8 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I think a 2nd might be too steep.  The Bradford price was ramped up by WHEN the Vikings lost their QB.  Alex Smith was just a year removed from going to an NFC Title game.  I think a 3rd is maybe possible.... a 4th just feels right.... maybe a 4th that can become a 3rd if the team makes the playoffs and a 6th or something?

Allow me to make my argument using just one team, the Denver Broncos. The Broncos boast one of, if not the, best defenses in the NFL. They won a Super Bowl a couple of years ago with worse QB play than Taylor provides. The Broncos invested a 1st round pick on a QB that 25 games into his career they don’t trust to play above Brock Osweiler!! Do you think that they have a ton of confidence in Lynch? Do you think that they would rather roll the dice again early on a QB or take the modest cap hit for a guy that’s proven he can win? Tyrod played GREAT against that Broncos defense this year (126 rating). You don’t think for a second that the leaders of that team (guys like Von Miller) wouldn’t be begging management for competent QB play? This goes without saying that you can’t find his level of stability at his price tag. It is a match made in heaven. 

 

I didn’t even mention Arizona or Jacksonville both of whom have a similar problem. That’s how the price goes up.

Edited November 15, 2017 by Kirby Jackson

[26CornerBlitz]

1 minute ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Allow me to make my argument using just one team, the Denver Broncos. The Broncos boast one of, if not the, best defenses in the NFL. They won a Super Bowl a couple of years ago with worse QB play than Taylor provides. The Broncos invested a 1st round pick on a QB that 25 games into his career they don’t trust to play above Brock Osweiler!! Do you think that they have a ton of confidence in Lynch? Do you think that they would rather roll the dice again early on a QB or take the modest cap hit for a guy that’s proven he can win? Tyrod played GREAT against that Broncos defense this year (126 rating). You don’t think for a second that the leaders of that team (guys like Von Miller) wouldn’t be begging management for competent QB play? This goes without saying that you can’t find his level of stability at his price tag. It is a match made in heaven. 

 

I didn’t even mention Arizona or Jacksonville both of whom have a similar problem. That’s how the price goes up.

 

Lynch is still not healthy enough to play, but I do get your point.

[DriveFor1Outta5]

Denver is entirely possible. Elway has shown a real eye for recognizing QB talent ? 

[GunnerBill]

3 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Allow me to make my argument using just one team, the Denver Broncos. The Broncos boast one of, if not the, best defenses in the NFL. They won a Super Bowl a couple of years ago with worse QB play than Taylor provides. The Broncos invested a 1st round pick on a QB that 25 games into his career they don’t trust to play above Brock Osweiler!! Do you think that they have a ton of confidence in Lynch? Do you think that they would rather roll the dice again early on a QB or take the modest cap hit for a guy that’s proven he can win? Tyrod played GREAT against that Broncos defense this year (126 rating). You don’t think for a second that the leaders of that team (guys like Von Miller) wouldn’t be begging management for competent QB play? This goes without saying that you can’t find his level of stability at his price tag. It is a match made in heaven. 

 

The Broncos game is one of the best 3 games in Tyrod's career IMO.  I do get your point, I just don't know why that makes him worth a 2nd to them.  Because Tyrod has proven he can win 8 games.  He is just a smidgen above a .500 QB at this point.  If they end up 5-11 why would they not just cut their losses and draft another one?  Tyrod is a band aid solution for them.  They also have the advantage of being one of the most attractive potential destinations for him IF the Bills end up releasing him.  If they wanted to give us a 2nd round pick we should rip their arm off.  I just don't see it.  

[DriveFor1Outta5]

4 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Allow me to make my argument using just one team, the Denver Broncos. The Broncos boast one of, if not the, best defenses in the NFL. They won a Super Bowl a couple of years ago with worse QB play than Taylor provides. The Broncos invested a 1st round pick on a QB that 25 games into his career they don’t trust to play above Brock Osweiler!! Do you think that they have a ton of confidence in Lynch? Do you think that they would rather roll the dice again early on a QB or take the modest cap hit for a guy that’s proven he can win? Tyrod played GREAT against that Broncos defense this year (126 rating). You don’t think for a second that the leaders of that team (guys like Von Miller) wouldn’t be begging management for competent QB play? This goes without saying that you can’t find his level of stability at his price tag. It is a match made in heaven. 

 

I didn’t even mention Arizona or Jacksonville both of whom have a similar problem. That’s how the price goes up.

This is all great, and very well written. There is just one major problem. This isn’t a dominant Denver defense anymore. They still have talent, but Wade Phillips is gone. I don’t think that they are a Tyrod level QB away. The Super Bowl champ Broncos were a historically great D. Everything worked that season. They did what the 2017 Bills did during the winning streak, but for the entire season. 

[Kirby Jackson]

3 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

The Broncos game is one of the best 3 games in Tyrod's career IMO.  I do get your point, I just don't know why that makes him worth a 2nd to them.  Because Tyrod has proven he can win 8 games.  He is just a smidgen above a .500 QB at this point.  If they end up 5-11 why would they not just cut their losses and draft another one?  Tyrod is a band aid solution for them.  They also have the advantage of being one of the most attractive potential destinations for him IF the Bills end up releasing him.  If they wanted to give us a 2nd round pick we should rip their arm off.  I just don't see it.  

Would you say that one of his other best games was Christmas Eve last year? I would, against Vance Joseph’s defense. 

 

Why wouldnt they draft one? Well they just swung and missed on one. Their window is open now. Tyrod has proven he can win 8 games with a team that has no more than 8 win talent. Denver may have 11 win talent with anything at QB. That year they won the Super Bowl their QB play was worse than Tyrod. For them specifically, they may lean away from the unknown of another QB or they may want to continue developing Lynch? They don’t have the time to groom a guy or hope to be right. They will miss their chance.

4 minutes ago, DriveFor1Outta5 said:

This is all great, and very well written. There is just one major problem. This isn’t a dominant Denver defense anymore. They still have talent, but Wade Phillips is gone. I don’t think that they are a Tyrod level QB away. The Super Bowl champ Broncos were a historically great D. Everything worked that season. They did what the 2017 Bills did during the winning streak, but for the entire season. 

I don’t disagree that Wade hurts them but they’ve still been really, really good. They are without question a top 5 defense with an awful offense.

[GunnerBill]

Just now, Kirby Jackson said:

Would you say that one of his other best games was Christmas Eve last year? I would, against Vance Joseph’s defense. 

 

Why wouldnt they draft one? Well they just swung and missed on one. Their window is open now. Tyrod has proven he can win 8 games with a team that has no more than 8 win talent. Denver may have 11 win talent with anything at QB. That year they won the Super Bowl their QB play was worse than Tyrod. For them specifically, they may lean away from the unknown of another QB or they may want to continue developing Lynch? They don’t have the time to groom a guy or hope to be right. They will miss their chance.

 

1.  Yep, I would say that was one of his best games.

2.  I'm not convinced that this Denver is the same Denver.  Defense is showing signs of fraying at the edges, poorer coaching and the receivers look older and slower.

3.  I'm not absolutely convinced Tyrod isn't one of those guys who goes 8-8 with bad talent and 8-8 with good talent.  His play not the lose mentality causes me to doubt a little whether he is actually an 11 win Quarterback (at least a consistent level - he could certainly pull it off once or twice) even with the D in place.  I could be wrong about that but there is something in it I think.  Tannehill has basically been that with bad Dolphins teams and with good Dolphins teams.  

[Kirby Jackson]

17 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

1.  Yep, I would say that was one of his best games.

2.  I'm not convinced that this Denver is the same Denver.  Defense is showing signs of fraying at the edges, poorer coaching and the receivers look older and slower.

3.  I'm not absolutely convinced Tyrod isn't one of those guys who goes 8-8 with bad talent and 8-8 with good talent.  His play not the lose mentality causes me to doubt a little whether he is actually an 11 win Quarterback (at least a consistent level - he could certainly pull it off once or twice) even with the D in place.  I could be wrong about that but there is something in it I think.  Tannehill has basically been that with bad Dolphins teams and with good Dolphins teams.  

I don’t disagree with any of that. The point being, from Denver’s perspective, he’s probably as good of an option as there is. He’s the most proven commodity that can be had at an affordable price. It’s similar in some ways to Alex Smith to KC. The only other option, IMO, is Bradford and he has a world of question marks. Tyrod offers them a stability, at a price, that they can’t get elsewhere. 

 

Too often we look at this through such such a narrow lens (see the majority of posts in this thread). If you take a step back and look around the league and from different perspectives, of course there is a market. That market is aging teams or dominant defensive teams with bad QB play. He is a guy that can elevate those teams in the short term.

Edited November 15, 2017 by Kirby Jackson

[Helpmenow]

Seventh

[CommonCents]

9 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

I don’t disagree with any of that. The point being, from Denver’s perspective, he’s probably as good of an option as their is. He’s the most proven commodity that can be had at an affordable price. It’s similar in some ways to Alex Smith to KC. The only other option, IMO, is Bradford and he has a world of question marks. Tyrod offers them a stability, at a price, that they can’t get elsewhere. 

 

Too often we look at this through such such a narrow lens (see the majority of posts in this thread). If you take a step back and look around the league and from different perspectives, of course there is a market. That market is aging teams or dominant defensive teams with bad QB play. He is a guy that can elevate those teams in the short term.

 

Alex  Smith operates one of the more complex offenses in the league. 

 

Tyrod is a simpleton who has never called an audible or adjusted protections under any OC/HC. He is nothing like Alex Smith. The market for a QB that operates with blinders on is most likely minimal. 

 

I dont see the comparison. 

Edited November 15, 2017 by Commonsense

[Kirby Jackson]

3 minutes ago, Commonsense said:

 

Alex  Smith operates one of the more complex offenses in the league. 

 

Tyrod is a simpleton who has never called an audible or adjusted protections under any OC/HC. He is nothing like Alex Smith. The market for a QB that operates with blinders on is most likely minimal. 

 

I dont see the comparison. 

Then you missed the point, KC was a good defensive team with bad QB play. Smith was an average NFL QB (at the time) that could be attained at a decent price.

[CommonCents]

Just now, Kirby Jackson said:

Then you missed the point, KC was a good defensive team with bad QB play. Smith was an average NFL QB (at the time) that could be attained at a decent price.

 

How much of a difference do you suppose it is between those two players when a coach/gm assign a value to a guy they are looking to lead their offense?

 

IMO it's night and day presnap with Taylor and Smith. At this point in Tyrod's career I think it's a safe bet to say that it isn't changing. 

That same point goes back to when Denver won the SB with a wounded Manning. He could still get them in and out of play calls, even if he couldn't throw. That brings his overall ability a lot closer to what a perfectly healthy Taylor could offer. 

[Kirby Jackson]

1 minute ago, Commonsense said:

 

How much of a difference do you suppose it is between those two players when a coach/gm assign a value to a guy they are looking to lead their offense?

 

IMO it's night and day presnap with Taylor and Smith. At this point in Tyrod's career I think it's a safe bet to say that it isn't changing. 

Smith had a much longer resume of mediocrity at the time. Tyrod has been a more productive player than SF Smith. He had half of a good year. I like Smith more than most but the point absolutely stands. Tyrod offers a level of stability, productivity and a resume, at a price, that pretty much no one else on the market does. That’s why there will be a market. 

[C.Biscuit97]

2 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Smith had a much longer resume of mediocrity at the time. Tyrod has been a more productive player than SF Smith. He had half of a good year. I like Smith more than most but the point absolutely stands. Tyrod offers a level of stability, productivity and a resume, at a price, that pretty much no one else on the market does. That’s why there will be a market. 

Alex Smith was a number 1 overall pick and played as a rookie.  As sad as it is, that matters. Look at all the chances Bradford gets.

 

that said, most KC fans wanted to get rid of Smith before the season.  And while he had a great start to season, does anyone see Smith winning a SB?  Taylor and Smith are middle of the pack qbs who are so dependent on the team around them.  You could do a lot worse, but you could also do much better.

 

I would happy with a 4th for TT.  I’m also open to him coming back at a reasonable price and letting him, a high draft pick rookie, and Peterman having an open competition next training camp.

[xRUSHx]

12 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Smith had a much longer resume of mediocrity at the time. Tyrod has been a more productive player than SF Smith. He had half of a good year. I like Smith more than most but the point absolutely stands. Tyrod offers a level of stability, productivity and a resume, at a price, that pretty much no one else on the market does. That’s why there will be a market. 

I can see a market for him as a backup or starter on a brain dead desperate team but IMO your putting his value a lot higher then what he is now worth anymore. If Tyrod flops on his face again this week he will have problems getting a 3rd string job IMO.

 

IMO He cant read a defense and never audibles. He has proven he is a QB the OC has to change his system for and when on the road Tyrod is more into his clothes then playing a football game. I just don't see the value you do. Years back I can see the what if value but now it's the make him be a QB fail show.

Edited November 15, 2017 by xRUSHx