K-9 Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 “Believe the accuser” mentality is a “liberal” creation? What a crock of schit that is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 is a story going to show up about people having intercourse some decade? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 30 minutes ago, K-9 said: “Believe the accuser” mentality is a “liberal” creation? What a crock of schit that is. It's a leftist creation, which I described as illiberal, which seeks to undo traditional liberal legal protections granted by the assumption of innocence until guilt is proven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azalin Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 2 hours ago, B-Man said: But, but....it worked....the GOP is "reeling"................lol I thought that too - I haven't seen much in the way of "reeling" by anyone in this case. 44 minutes ago, TakeYouToTasker said: It's a leftist creation, which I described as illiberal, which seeks to undo traditional liberal legal protections granted by the assumption of innocence until guilt is proven. It's refreshing to see someone say this for once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Man Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 1 hour ago, TakeYouToTasker said: It's a leftist creation, which I described as illiberal, which seeks to undo traditional liberal legal protections granted by the assumption of innocence until guilt is proven. QFT. This whole episode is actually straightforward, I'm a Conservative, I have no emotional investment in Roy Moore or the Republican Party. But I’m not prepared to join the “off with his head” mob every time an accusation comes forward. If Moore admits he’s a pervert, toss him to the courts. If he says he’s not, let’s hear him out. Throwing accusations around is pretty easy Sen. Robert Menendez may have had sex with underage hookers in Dominican Republic: prosecutors http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/sen-robert-menendez-hired-underage-hookers-feds-article-1.2336046 See. But Gator (and the like) must grab onto something to believe in, so ........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cugalabanza Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, TakeYouToTasker said: It's a leftist creation, which I described as illiberal, which seeks to undo traditional liberal legal protections granted by the assumption of innocence until guilt is proven. What's funny though is that it's big name Republicans that are calling for Roy to step down. Why? Because they see an opportunity to use it to their advantage. Edited November 10, 2017 by Cugalabanza Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 (edited) 4 hours ago, TakeYouToTasker said: I reserve judgment in this case, as I do in all cases, unless/until evidence can be presented. With that said, I find the nature of these allegations disturbing, given the timing, and the rush to condemn the accused in absence of any evidence. Is it OK to attempt to destroy individuals by making baseless charges of pedophilia/rape etc. because of a modern illiberal insistence that we "believe the accuser", especially for political gain? This is an ugly political environment, and an "ends justify the means" philosophy under which anything is excusable as long as it results in political victory seems like the unfortunate likely result of our current state of affairs. This isn’t a court of law. There is no innocent until proven guilty standard. He hasn’t been arrested. Did you actually read the story? It is very credible. They talked to 30 different sources. Some of these sources were friends of the women who say the women have talked about this long before Roy Moore had a political career. ”Given the timing.” This isn’t the first time Moore has run for public office. So you would have only believed the well-sourced credible allegations if they came in an election off-year? Oh well, most Republicans across the country that aren’t in the uneducated cesspool that is Alabama have said Moore should leave the race. Only a few nutjobs honestly think the women and all corroborating sources are lying, or that you can’t choose to believe any fact of character unless the fact is literally put on trial. Edited November 10, 2017 by HappyDays 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 1 minute ago, Cugalabanza said: What's funny though is that it's big name Republicans that are calling for Roy to step down. Why? Because they see an opportunity to use it to their advantage. They're calling for him to step down because it makes zero political sense to do anything to tie yourself to a person being accused of being a child diddler. It's easier for them if he simply goes away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cugalabanza Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 1 minute ago, TakeYouToTasker said: They're calling for him to step down because it makes zero political sense to do anything to tie yourself to a person being accused of being a child diddler. It's easier for them if he simply goes away. They wanted the exact same thing before the alleged pistol totin'. This is just their golden opportunity to get it done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 2 minutes ago, HappyDays said: This isn’t a court of law. There is no innocent until proven guilty standard. He hasn’t been arrested. Did you actually read the story? It is very credible. They talked to 30 different sources. Some of these sources were friends of the women who say the women have talked about this long before Roy Moore had a political career. ”Given the timing.” This isn’t the first time Moore has run for public office. So you would have only believed the well-sourced credible allegations if they came in an election off-year? Oh well, most Republicans across the country that aren’t in the uneducated cesspool that is Alabama have said Moore should leave the race. Only a few nutjobs honestly think the women and all corroborating sources are lying, or that you can’t choose to believe any fact of character unless the fact is literally put on trial. I'm sorry, but I won't join you in your lynch mob. Feel free to give the pitchfork you had earmarked for me to someone else who lacks the discretion to avoid destroying someone over allegations. As I mentioned earlier, it's political suicide to tie yourself to anyone accused of molesting children, so why would they? It's political expedience and CYA behavior to protect their own power and brand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 16 minutes ago, Cugalabanza said: What's funny though is that it's big name Republicans that are calling for Roy to step down. Why? Because they see an opportunity to use it to their advantage. So you have just discovered politics is dog-eat-dog with minimal loyalties? Bravo!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cugalabanza Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 Just now, row_33 said: So you have just discovered politics is dog-eat-dog with minimal loyalties? Bravo!! Just countering this absurd notion being pushed here that the left automatically believes every accusation and the GOP is calmly, patiently, sensibly weighing all the evidence before coming to any conclusions. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 1 minute ago, Cugalabanza said: Just countering this absurd notion being pushed here that the left automatically believes every accusation and the GOP is calmly, patiently, sensibly weighing all the evidence before coming to any conclusions. In this instance the left is seizing on the opportunity to paint Republicans as child molesters, and Republicans clearly understand this, and are seeking a resolution in which the problem simply goes away because it's the most politically expedient thing for them to do. That's all this is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 19 minutes ago, Cugalabanza said: Just countering this absurd notion being pushed here that the left automatically believes every accusation and the GOP is calmly, patiently, sensibly weighing all the evidence before coming to any conclusions. that's alright then, I didn't have you picked off as being against the left all the time, for some reason... Like Clyde Frazier I have no trouble saying my team took a terrible shot.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cugalabanza Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 10 minutes ago, TakeYouToTasker said: In this instance the left is seizing on the opportunity to paint Republicans as child molesters, and Republicans clearly understand this, and are seeking a resolution in which the problem simply goes away because it's the most politically expedient thing for them to do. That's all this is. Nope. I'm right and you're wrong on this one. It's pretty clear. You're doing some pretty advanced logical acrobatics to try to get out of your own way, but to no avail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Cugalabanza said: Nope. I'm right and you're wrong on this one. It's pretty clear. You're doing some pretty advanced logical acrobatics to try to get out of your own way, but to no avail. You don't believe that the political left would find an advantage in painting their opponents as child molesters, and that the political right would find political advantage in not being associated with child molesters? OK... I mean, not in any way convincing as an argument, but OK... For clarification, I don't have a dog in this fight. As a libertarian I find his moralizing-as-public policy to be completely unpalatable. Edited November 10, 2017 by TakeYouToTasker More to add. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cugalabanza Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 (edited) 5 minutes ago, TakeYouToTasker said: You don't believe that the political left would find an advantage in painting their opponents as child molesters, and that the political right would find political advantage in not being associated with child molesters? OK... I mean, not in any way convincing as an argument, but OK... I do believe those things, but once again the point I'm making is to refute this idea that you are pushing that just one side is in a hurry to forego presumed innocence. The GOP in this case is not so much distancing themselves from a child molester--they're USING this swell of accusations to do what they already wanted to do anyway: Get Roy Moore out of the way. sheesh. It may seem like a subtle distinction to you, but please try to pay attention. Edited November 10, 2017 by Cugalabanza Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 11 minutes ago, Cugalabanza said: Nope. I'm right and you're wrong on this one. It's pretty clear. You're doing some pretty advanced logical acrobatics to try to get out of your own way, but to no avail. Lol, that's Tasker! He thinks paper money is unconstitutional 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 2 minutes ago, Cugalabanza said: I do believe those things, but once again the point I'm making is to refute this idea that you are pushing that just one side is in a hurry to forego presumed innocence. The GOP in this case is not so much distancing themselves from a child molester--they're USING this swell of accusations to do what they already wanted to do anyway: Get Roy Moore out of the way. sheesh. It may seem like a subtle distinction to you, but please try to pay attention. One side is in a hurry to forego presumed innocence, the other is not unhappy with the exuberance of the other so long as the taint doesn't rub off on them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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