A Century of Communism

[DC Tom]

1 minute ago, TakeYouToTasker said:

I'd say it doesn't matter much to the dead.

 

By that logic, the US is equivalent to Communism.  

[TakeYouToTasker]

1 minute ago, DC Tom said:

 

By that logic, the US is equivalent to Communism.  

 

We aren't discussing this in a vacuum.  We're discussing it in a thread about 100 years of Communism, as related to a Presidential decree declaring "Victims of Communism Day as a memorial", comparing the evils of Communism and Nazism.

 

Or it's also possible that my sarcasm detector is on the fritz. 

[DC Tom]

1 minute ago, TakeYouToTasker said:

 

We aren't discussing this in a vacuum.  We're discussing it in a thread about 100 years of Communism, as related to a Presidential decree declaring "Victims of Communism Day as a memorial", comparing the evils of Communism and Nazism.

 

Or it's also possible that my sarcasm detector is on the fritz. 

 

No, it's possible you don't understand that we're not discussing this in a vacuum.  Which is what you reduce it to with an overly-simplistic "people died" measurement.  

 

Communism is a miserable system.  In the hundred years of its existence it also defeated Naziism, which as an even more miserable system.  That is a net positive.

[K-9]

45 minutes ago, Deranged Rhino said:

But, but, but...I've got my entire treatise dusted off and ready for posting. Highly edifying if I don't say so myself. What's it worth to ya to keep it under wraps?

[Deranged Rhino]

Just now, K-9 said:

But, but, but...I've got my entire treatise dusted off and ready for posting. Highly edifying if I don't say so myself. What's it worth to ya to keep it under wraps?

It's worth sharing with the board, always. 

 

I was more referencing to engaging in Tibs' vortext of trolling.

[TakeYouToTasker]

4 minutes ago, DC Tom said:

 

No, it's possible you don't understand that we're not discussing this in a vacuum.  Which is what you reduce it to with an overly-simplistic "people died" measurement.  

 

Communism is a miserable system.  In the hundred years of its existence it also defeated Naziism, which as an even more miserable system.  That is a net positive.

I don't know that Nazism was inherently worse than Communism.

[Tiberius]

11 minutes ago, Deranged Rhino said:

It's worth sharing with the board, always. 

 

I was more referencing to engaging in Tibs' vortext of trolling.

Yes, but don't forget that you don't understand the topic. You call it trolling when you just don't have a clue on how thing can be ambiguous and manipulated. 

[K-9]

9 minutes ago, Deranged Rhino said:

It's worth sharing with the board, always. 

 

I was more referencing to engaging in Tibs' vortext of trolling.

Ah, the dreaded Vortex of Trolling. I can relate. Here's a pick of me the last time I got sucked in. At first it was pleasurable, then it became a nightmare. 

 

[Deranged Rhino]

Just now, K-9 said:

Ah, the dreaded Vortex of Trolling. I can relate. Here's a pick of me the last time I got sucked in. At first it was pleasurable, then it became a nightmare. 

 

 

[DC Tom]

29 minutes ago, TakeYouToTasker said:

I don't know that Nazism was inherently worse than Communism.

 

Naziism (note that I'm specifically not saying the more general "fascism") was inherently nihilistic and imperialistic on racial lines, encompassed ridiculous proto-Teutonic and social Darwinist concepts, and had an explicit goal of killing "untermenschen."  

 

I'd say that was inherently worse. Communism at least oppressed everyone equally, and didn't think entire peoples' sole purpose was to die.

[TakeYouToTasker]

2 minutes ago, DC Tom said:

 

Naziism (note that I'm specifically not saying the more general "fascism") was inherently nihilistic and imperialistic on racial lines, encompassed ridiculous proto-Teutonic and social Darwinist concepts, and had an explicit goal of killing "untermenschen."  

 

I'd say that was inherently worse. Communism at least oppressed everyone equally, and didn't think entire peoples' sole purpose was to die.

I'm fully aware of the evils of Nazism, I just think the evils of Communism are drastically understated in this particular argument. 

[snafu]

20 hours ago, DC Tom said:

Communism destroyed the Nazis.  On that measure alone, against everything else (no, I'm not forgetting the Khmer Rouge, the PRC, Stalin's purges, Holodomor, etc.) I'd say it's net positive.

 

Communism didn't destroy the Nazis.

Anti-Nazis destroyed the Nazis.  Strange bedfellows.  People who didn't buy into their B.S. and didn't want to be steamrollered by them beat them back and defeated them.  What happened with the fascist Commies both before after that makes them suck pretty bad.

 

[B-Man]

THE PEOPLE’S FLAG IS DEEPEST RED: It is the Centenary of the October Revolution today. Here’s David Satter in the Wall Street Journal:

Quote

 

The Bolshevik coup had two consequences. In countries where communism came to hold sway, it hollowed out society’s moral core, degrading the individual and turning him into a cog in the machinery of the state. Communists committed murder on such a scale as to all but eliminate the value of life and to destroy the individual conscience in survivors.

 

But the Bolsheviks’ influence was not limited to these countries. In the West, communism inverted society’s understanding of the source of its values, creating political confusion that persists to this day.

 

 

 

RTWT. It is probably because of the lasting effect of that second consequence that we see that more Millennials would prefer to live in a socialist country than a capitalist one. As the Victims of Communism Memorial Foundation notes,

 

Quote

It seems that the majority of America’s largest generation would prefer to live in a socialist or communism society than in a free enterprise system that respects the rule of law, private property, and limited government. This is even more disconcerting when coupled with the fact that, despite Millennials’ enthusiasm for socialism and communism, they do not, in fact, know what those terms mean.

 

 

As proved (repeatedly) here.

 

.

[GG]

4 hours ago, DC Tom said:

 

No, it's possible you don't understand that we're not discussing this in a vacuum.  Which is what you reduce it to with an overly-simplistic "people died" measurement.  

 

Communism is a miserable system.  In the hundred years of its existence it also defeated Naziism, which as an even more miserable system.  That is a net positive.

Chicken and egg.  If there was no communism, Nazism wouldn't get beyond a bunch of cross dressing thugs in Bavaria.  

 

PS I don't know why you're claiming that communism defeated Nazism.  Communism enlisted and conscripted  millions into the battlefield of attrition.  But even they would have been wiped out if not for food and munitions from evil capitalists. 

Edited November 8, 2017 by GG

[DC Tom]

4 hours ago, TakeYouToTasker said:

I'm fully aware of the evils of Nazism, I just think the evils of Communism are drastically understated in this particular argument. 

 

And I specifically said I was not understating the evils of Communisim, and listed four concrete examples, in my original post.  

47 minutes ago, GG said:

Chicken and egg.  If there was no communism, Nazism wouldn't get beyond a bunch of cross dressing thugs in Bavaria.  

 

PS I don't know why you're claiming that communism defeated Nazism.  Communism enlisted and conscripted  millions into the battlefield of attrition.  But even they would have been wiped out if not for food and munitions from evil capitalists. 

 

Because they did roughly 80% of the fighting.  

[GG]

20 minutes ago, DC Tom said:

 

And I specifically said I was not understating the evils of Communisim, and listed four concrete examples, in my original post.  

 

Because they did roughly 80% of the fighting.  

 

How do you define fighting.  They probably accounted for 80% of the casualties, because all they knew was to throw people into the fire (not limited to war time either)

[TakeYouToTasker]

6 hours ago, DC Tom said:

 

And I specifically said I was not understating the evils of Communisim, and listed four concrete examples, in my original post. 

I assume it must have occurred to you that someone who found your argument unconvincing might feel you've understated the evils of Communism? 

 

Communism has been a much more enduring blight, and is still the cause of some of the worst cases of actual real systemic oppression even today.  In addition to it's "concentrated" immediate damage, it's long term seep has penetrated the mainstream of our political and economic discussion in ways Richard Spencer can only write erotic fan fiction about. 

 

Nazism, as bad as it was, was doomed to fail because it was inherently an "us vs. them" philosophy with a very small us, and a very large them.  Conversely Communism is inherently enduring because it seeks to pit 95% of the world against the other 5%.

Edited November 9, 2017 by TakeYouToTasker

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

On 11/7/2017 at 6:30 PM, DC Tom said:

Communism destroyed the Nazis.  On that measure alone, against everything else (no, I'm not forgetting the Khmer Rouge, the PRC, Stalin's purges, Holodomor, etc.) I'd say it's net positive.

 

nnnnnnh...not so sure on that one.

 

lend-lease destroyed the nazis. AMERICA, !@#$ YEAH

[Dante]

On 11/7/2017 at 3:30 PM, DC Tom said:

Communism destroyed the Nazis.  On that measure alone, against everything else (no, I'm not forgetting the Khmer Rouge, the PRC, Stalin's purges, Holodomor, etc.) I'd say it's net positive.

1

Wrong. Super whacked out strategy defeated the Nazi's. Commies couldn't create a good joke on their own. They have to steal everything.  Soviets benefited from multiple fronts and diluted German resources.

Edited November 10, 2017 by Dante

[DC Tom]

15 hours ago, Dante said:

Wrong. Super whacked out strategy defeated the Nazi's. Commies couldn't create a good joke on their own. They have to steal everything.  Soviets benefited from multiple fronts and diluted German resources.

 

This is too ridiculously ignorant to refute.  Get a basic knowledge of the subject (Bellamy is a good start), then come talk to me.