mjt328 Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Fool me three times.....BBFS. It's not pessimism or hating on the team, it's 17 years and the reality of history. Tonight exposed a lot of our holes and opportunities that we've been able to hide or suppress. And yes, we just got BLOWN OUT by the Jets on primetime TV. This is why we, and will continue, to not have the respect of anyone. 1 - McDermott - This loss starts with our coach. This team did not show up tonight in a variety of ways. I don't care if it's a short week or on the road. This is a divisional game that we need to be relevant in a division dominated by the Pats. The Jets are supposed to be a weaker team and equally on short rest. We had terrible starting drives in both halves, poor tackling, penalties, and stupid turnovers. Easily our worst game of the season at a time where many of us were looking for this team to prove this team was different. 2 - BBFS - I've had people ask what this is. This game was it. Battered Buffalo Fan Syndrome. It's the ongoing mental anguish of waiting for the other shoe to drop when something positive happens to the Bills. I'ts snatching defeat from the jaws of victory. It's the 2nd and 2 direct snap to McCoy that almost leads to a turnover. It's starting 5-2 on three occasions over the past 17 years and finishing 7-9 two times. As of right now, anything is possible again. Special thanks for the Bills losing before the bye week and 10 day stretch, to really rub in the pain. 3 - Penalties - One of the biggest differences this season has been the discipline shown by the team. Tonight, we saw that completely unravel. The refs even gave us a gift offensive PI call to negate a Jets TD. Shaq had an idiotic late hit. Jerry pulled a Jerry with his unsportsmanlike conduct. Nice facemask penalty where the defender just reached out with his arms towards the McCown's head expecting...god knows what. I'd complain about hte phantom offsides for the onside kick, but it doesn't matter. Penalties were just the perfect icing on the cake 4 - Offensive Line - Normally, the lyrics go here, but there's just too many things that need to be called out. Our offensive line was an absolute joke. I can't really even evaluate the running or passing game much because of it. The right side of the line was as bad as I've seen it and got absolutely blown up. How Groy is not at RG and Dawkins isn't getting snaps at RT is beyond me. After a week where they dominated the Raiders defensive line, the overall offense stood no chance because of these guys. 7 sacks...... 5 - Pass Rush - I'm getting pretty sick of our 4 man pass rush, especially after seeing what the Jets did to us with rushing 5. McCown had all day to throw while Tyrod got terrorized. It's infuriating how obvious it is to see the difference an extra rusher makes. Some may want to call out the loss of Dareus, but he was playing less than 40% of the snaps. We are going to get destroyed by Brees, Brady x2, and Alex Smith. Btw, that would be 8 losses after tonight to those guys. The Dolphins and Chargers, on the West Coast btw, could be the difference in our season. 6 - Turnovers - We knew we couldn't rely on being +3 in the turnover column every week, but who thought it would look like this? Two fumbles by the offense that were completely self inflicted, both killing scoring drives. A dropped INT that couldn't have been any easier to bring in. We weren't flying to the ball like normal, delivering the bigs hits, and overall seemed out of position a lot. 7 - Tackling - Tackling tonight was the worst I've seen since our last game against the Pats. I don't know if it's because we kept trying to knock the ball out or what, but there were broken tackles all not. As the game went on, the misses got worse. Nevermind the blown contain on McCown to start the game, but the big rushing plays to drive the dagger into our hearts were just pathetic. Nothing about this performance looked anything like our season to date. 8 - Tolbert - After two weeks of crediting the use of Tolbert and praising his effectiveness, we went right back to the maddening play call we saw in the first 5 games. Tolbert running the ball on 1st and 2nd down, without McCoy on the field. swing passes, the full rushing compliment for a guy who has no business being a runningback. Why we keep trying shove a square into a round hole is beyond me. This might be the most infuriating team. 9 - Road Games - We are now 1-3 on road games. While the first two losses were close, we looked flat in all three losses and worse each time. This is becoming an area of concern and makes me extremely anxious about the Chargers and Dolphins games, who are against two beatable teams. McDermott needs to figure this out and quickly. 10 - Zay Jones - As easy as it would be to go negative for all ten points, I have to give credit to Zay for his coming out game. He looked crisp in his routes, didn't drop a pass, and only his injury kept him from having a big game. Very proud of this kid and happy to see the potential from the guy we took in the 2nd round. I hope the knee issue doesn't linger and his confidence continues to grow. What a rollercoaster 5 days it's been. A blowout win against the Raiders where our offense and defense looked dominant, an amazing trade for Benjamin, and now a blowout loss to the Jets. This game was lost on effort alone. We didn't have it and I have to question why. The easiest answer? It's because we are the Bills. This is what the Bills do and none of us should be surprised. Watching all the threads about playoffs pop up reminded me of the previous 5-2 starts and I just had a feeling all day about this game. We aren't a playoff team until there's an "x" next to our name in the standings. We've proven nothing so far. No matter how it feels, we are 5-3 again with some scary opportunities. I'm starting to get worried about our inability to generate any pass rush, road game intensity, and how easily our offense can go flat. We have some good teams coming up that will exploit these issues and things could get ugly quick. I'm not saying we will finish 7-9 again, but 8-8 is a very real possibility. Go Bills Last night was (unfortunately) completely expected by most of us veteran Bills fans. Maybe it was going to happen against the Raiders. Maybe it wasn't going to hit until the Saints. But we knew it was coming. Every strong start Buffalo has managed over the last 15 years has eventually turned into this moment. Playoff hopes. National attention. Growing optimism and excitement among even the grouchiest fans. Then BAM. Total meltdown. It's not that we suffered a disappointing/close loss to a game inferior opponent. That happens to everyone. It's that virtually nobody on the roster seemed prepared to play a football game last night. It was a pathetic and embarrassing performance across the board. This game was the 2016 Week 7 tackling debacle (against Miami and Jay Ajayi), erasing our 11-point lead in the 4th Quarter and killing our 4-2 start. This game was the 2011 Week 9 @$$ kicking (by the Mark Sanchez led Jets), which spiraled into a 7-game losing streak after beginning the season 5-2. This game was the 2008 Week 8 self-destruction of Trent Edwards (against Miami), as we soon watched a 5-1 start become a 7-9 season. This game was the 2005 Week 17 unbelievable loss to Pittsburgh's backups, with the playoffs on the line. I wish I could dismiss last night's horrific performance as a "bad game." But I know better. This team has Brees next and Brady x2. It has the Chiefs in Kansas City, and a road game on the west coast against the Chargers. It has two more tough division games against the Dolphins. The only "easy" opponent on the schedule is against the Colts. And the Bills MUST finish with at least a 5-3 record in these games to have a prayer at making the playoffs.
BeginnersMind Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 (edited) Im with Bill in NYC. They are exceeding expectations by 1000. Last night was the first undisciplined game they played in 8. There is a new culture. But they wont coast to 12-4 with their talent. And the Jets are pretty good. So, Bills laid an egg and Jets played great. It happens. The Bills are not a great team. But they are trending up under new leadership. How they react to this loss will be telling. Hopefully they get back to the hard work of building. Edited November 3, 2017 by BeginnersMind
Fan in Chicago Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Fool me three times.....BBFS. It's not pessimism or hating on the team, it's 17 years and the reality of history. Tonight exposed a lot of our holes and opportunities that we've been able to hide or suppress. And yes, we just got BLOWN OUT by the Jets on primetime TV. This is why we, and will continue, to not have the respect of anyone. Go Bills Good post, as usual Virgil. So much went wrong tonight I do not think it is productive to really evaluate any of it. It is always productive to evaluate a loss, as it is to evaluate a win. You have to know what the team does best and what its weak points are. The team should not get in a funk, sure. But that is not to say they cannot learn from a very bad night Here are my thoughts on the game.... Surprisingly, I have more Positive notes than negative. Tonight was just another flukey TNF game not in favor of the Bills. Here goes... 1.) Tyrod- Guy played his heart out tonight. This loss was ZERO percent on him. He did what he had to do as a quarterback and more. Anyone putting blame on him was simply not paying attention to the game. He made the throws down the middle and sidelines. He seemed to be one of the only players to show up tonight. The guy was fighting until the end. Call it garbage time or not but he finished 29/40, 285 yards, 3 total TDs. I am not one to pin the loss on TT but he was a huge reason for the loss too. In the couple of times where the camera angle was correct, you could see a receiver or two streaking right across from him and he hesitated. Guy just doesnt trust his own eyes and thinks way too much. He has shown signs of improvement this season, but yesterday's game was a return to last year's form. The problem is that the stat line will show he had a great game but as happens way too often with him, the game's direction is clearly decided by his limitations.
Livinginthepast Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 The Bills last night looked like my kids after they have eaten too much halloween candy. They looked sluggish, ill tempered, overly emotional and did boneheaded things. The game may prove to be a blip but as others have mentioned, we have seen this particular movie before and games like this tend to derail the train to the playoffs for the Bills, time and time again. They need to really regroup and get this out of their heads. Get Benjamin into the offense as fast as possible and forget about this embarrassment.
JohnC Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 First of all, nice work Virgil. You are doing a wonderful job and I thank you for this. The Bills were on the road, playing on a Thursday, and taking on a team with 3 straight losses. The Jets really had their backs to the wall and the loss didn't surprise me, especially (as you say) given the 17 year history. That said, the team bosses seem to have given the players a sane program, one that they are buying into. Before the season I predicted 4 wins and I was wrong. They are better than this and easier on the eyes than they have been in some time. Keep up the good work and thanks again!!! GO BILLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Virgil, Excellent analysis and summarization. Where I disagree with your keen response is your pessimistic tone. This is a rebuilding team that is ahead of schedule. If you keep that in mind then you won't be so sullen. This game was a clunker. It happens. Don't overreach with explanations. Their DL overwhelmed our OL and their OL gashed our DL. My biggest concern is that by primarily using four man DL pressure the qb has the time to pick the defense apart. Bill, You and I are in accord that this team has played beyond our expectations. This is a rebuilding team that is ahead of schedule. The coaching is better, the front office is in sync with the coaching staff and there is an organizational direction and coherency that haven't existed in a long time. One positive note to take away from this game was the play of Zay Jones (and was noted by the insightful Virgil). You can see what confidence can do for a player. Another thing it illustrates is that our three top draft selections collectively are solid and productive. That is a good sign for a team that intends to rely mostly on the draft to fill the roster. Are the Bills a playoff team? At best we are a fringe wild-card team competing farther into the season than usual. In general, I'm more upbeat than many over our not too distant future. At some point you need talent. The highest picked player on our team is Shaq Lawson (19 overall). I said it elsewhere but will guarantee that is the lowest in the league. You likely werent getting a Benjamin in the 3rd round. The odds are probably less than 5%. It is a good move. I don't see how anyone can complain about giving up a third round plus lower round pick for Benjamin who I consider to be a second round talent for a team that needs receiver help. It is a no brainer. You have exhibited a great deal of objectivity and realism by pointing out that overall the Bills lack the requisite talent level to be a very good team. What they have accomplished so far is a tribute to good coaching and earnest play by the assembled players. This is an overachieving team. I'm not saying that as an insult rather I am saying that as a compliment. In that context the Dareus trade makes a lot of sense from a team makeup sense.
BeginnersMind Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 If this team plays 4 undisciplined games like last night this season, it will be 28 less than it played in the last two years.
Al Czervik Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 First of all, nice work Virgil. You are doing a wonderful job and I thank you for this. The Bills were on the road, playing on a Thursday, and taking on a team with 3 straight losses. The Jets really had their backs to the wall and the loss didn't surprise me, especially (as you say) given the 17 year history. That said, the team bosses seem to have given the players a sane program, one that they are buying into. Before the season I predicted 4 wins and I was wrong. They are better than this and easier on the eyes than they have been in some time. Keep up the good work and thanks again!!! GO BILLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Yes thanks Virgil for continuing this time honored tradition thread (and Bill for starting it!) I look forward to reading this post game review every week...win or lose
Houston's #1 Bills Fan Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 (edited) Here are some of my thoughts: 1. OL. We've discussed it so often, I just don't know where else to go with it. Ducasse sucks, plain and simple. Glenn looked overwhelmed. Even Ritchie was not his usual self. The biggest thing I noticed watching the game was how much the Jets DL pushed out OL back on every play. It was pathetic. Tyrod had no time to throw, because some 300 pounder was in his face every play. Look, the Jet's DL aren't super human. But, our OL made them look like that. There's been a lot of talk that it may be coaching and not having Kromer anymore. Maybe. But, at the end of the day, they aren't rookies on that line and they should know how to pass protect. 2. Hughes. WTF!! I really thought he had learned from his mistakes over the years. I guess not. That penalty was at the absolute worst time, as I'm sure the spot of the ball would have been challenged and made it 4th down. But, no. Let's yell at an official repeatedly. After multiple warnings, too (thank you, NFL network!). This is on Hughes, but also coaching. Someone should have been screaming at Hughes to get off the field. 3. Tolbert. I mean, really? We passed on Gillisilee and J.Will for this guy? Even cut Banyard? I don't get it, I really don't. There is such a huge drop off between Shady and this guy, but yet they try to use him in the same manner. Someday mentioned it earlier, square peg, round hole. Waste of a roster spot. 4. Lorax. Love the guy, love the intensity, but I think it's time. Too slow and NOT making a difference in the game. Last year, he was a difference maker and opposing teams game planned around him. This year, not so much. Put Milano in. 5. Penalties. Yeah, I thought this team had gotten past the flag festival. That's on coaching again. Edited November 3, 2017 by Houston's #1 Bills Fan
oldmanfan Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 Jets aren't running for almost 200 yards if Dareus is still here was my point. I'm interested to see if that gets fixed going forward or teams run on our scrub front 7 the rest of the year in which case McBeane deserve to be heavily criticized for the trade. Depends. If he showed up and actually wanted to put forth effort and play maybe not. If he showed up and didn't give effort they might go for 300.
dave mcbride Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 Last night was (unfortunately) completely expected by most of us veteran Bills fans. Maybe it was going to happen against the Raiders. Maybe it wasn't going to hit until the Saints. But we knew it was coming. Every strong start Buffalo has managed over the last 15 years has eventually turned into this moment. Playoff hopes. National attention. Growing optimism and excitement among even the grouchiest fans. Then BAM. Total meltdown. It's not that we suffered a disappointing/close loss to a game inferior opponent. That happens to everyone. It's that virtually nobody on the roster seemed prepared to play a football game last night. It was a pathetic and embarrassing performance across the board. This game was the 2016 Week 7 tackling debacle (against Miami and Jay Ajayi), erasing our 11-point lead in the 4th Quarter and killing our 4-2 start. This game was the 2011 Week 9 @$$ kicking (by the Mark Sanchez led Jets), which spiraled into a 7-game losing streak after beginning the season 5-2. This game was the 2008 Week 8 self-destruction of Trent Edwards (against Miami), as we soon watched a 5-1 start become a 7-9 season. This game was the 2005 Week 17 unbelievable loss to Pittsburgh's backups, with the playoffs on the line. I wish I could dismiss last night's horrific performance as a "bad game." But I know better. This team has Brees next and Brady x2. It has the Chiefs in Kansas City, and a road game on the west coast against the Chargers. It has two more tough division games against the Dolphins. The only "easy" opponent on the schedule is against the Colts. And the Bills MUST finish with at least a 5-3 record in these games to have a prayer at making the playoffs. Excellent post.
BeginnersMind Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 Jets aren't running for almost 200 yards if Dareus is still here was my point. Looking at the body of evidence he turned in last season, I disagree.
Steve O Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 From the Bills opening drive I had one thought. It reminded me of the September 25, 2006 game of New Orleans against Atlanta. This was a Monday nite game, the first game back in the super dome after Katrina. NO blew out Atlanta. They never had a chance. My one thought is you don't want to be the first home opponents after a natural disaster or terrorist attack.
Big Turk Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 OLine seems to be having big issues on the road..last 2 games Bills have allowed Taylor to be sacked 12 times and pressured and hurried on a whole lot more... I'm not sure what the issue is...communication...energy...etc but it needs to be fixed...there should not be THAT huge of a disparity nbetween home and road play on the OLine
DrDawkinstein Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 So much went wrong tonight I do not think it is productive to really evaluate any of it. I am willing to call it an aberration, throw it in the garbage can, and move forward. Our next game and a strong rebound is going to be very important. This is where I'm at. This, and as the Mike&Mike guys pointed out, the parity in the NFL is so strong this year that while this outcome was "surprising" it really wasnt surprising at all. ANY team can beat ANY team, there are no "gimmes" or "should wins". That all said, we did look extra putrid. It wasnt even a fight. But oh well. We're on to New Orleans.
Coach Tuesday Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 (edited) Eh this game was about what I expected. Good for the Jets - they're scrappy and tough and they came out ready to play, gotta hand it to them. The o-line lacks tough guys. Even Ritchie gets his a$$ whooped a few times a year, usually on the road. I think he still has Fletcher Cox's taste in his mouth from a couple of years ago in Philly. The Bills need to invest in their guard positions this offseason - it's time. Tyrod looked good to me, I don't understand Romo's issues with him - he was going through reads and making pinpoint throws despite the pocket being crumpled like an aluminum can. Zay's lack of body control scares me - he runs recklessly and it kind of led to him getting hurt. That said, his double move to get open on the TD was incredible, and afterwards the coaches were showing him video clips of it on the sideline to pump him up. You know who was missed last night? Karlos Williams. The Bills need a fast long-strider to complement what Shady brings to the table. Tolbert isn't getting it done. Rico will be fired in the offseason if we see too many more gameplans like that one. And on the other side of the ball - welp we need linebackers, but we knew that. Dareus was missed. And I'm worried that Leslie Frazer might be better suited to be an assistant DC/secondary coach. He knows how to coach up the back end of the defense and the zones, but seems over his head with respect to the front four. Oh, and Jordan Matthews kind of sucks. Finally: Jerome Boger is a clown. He is one of several idiotic officials we have to contend with every year, because the NFL just doesn't care about officiating. Among many other issues I had with last night's calls, O'Leary clearly had given himself up and the play should've been declared dead at that point... Edited November 3, 2017 by Coach Tuesday
oldmanfan Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 Sometimes you just get your butt kicked. Yesterday was one of those times.
Virgil Posted November 3, 2017 Author Posted November 3, 2017 Virgil, Excellent analysis and summarization. Where I disagree with your keen response is your pessimistic tone. This is a rebuilding team that is ahead of schedule. If you keep that in mind then you won't be so sullen. This game was a clunker. It happens. Don't overreach with explanations. Their DL overwhelmed our OL and their OL gashed our DL. My biggest concern is that by primarily using four man DL pressure the qb has the time to pick the defense apart. Bill, You and I are in accord that this team has played beyond our expectations. This is a rebuilding team that is ahead of schedule. The coaching is better, the front office is in sync with the coaching staff and there is an organizational direction and coherency that haven't existed in a long time. One positive note to take away from this game was the play of Zay Jones (and was noted by the insightful Virgil). You can see what confidence can do for a player. Another thing it illustrates is that our three top draft selections collectively are solid and productive. That is a good sign for a team that intends to rely mostly on the draft to fill the roster. Are the Bills a playoff team? At best we are a fringe wild-card team competing farther into the season than usual. In general, I'm more upbeat than many over our not too distant future. I don't see how anyone can complain about giving up a third round plus lower round pick for Benjamin who I consider to be a second round talent for a team that needs receiver help. It is a no brainer. You have exhibited a great deal of objectivity and realism by pointing out that overall the Bills lack the requisite talent level to be a very good team. What they have accomplished so far is a tribute to good coaching and earnest play by the assembled players. This is an overachieving team. I'm not saying that as an insult rather I am saying that as a compliment. In that context the Dareus trade makes a lot of sense from a team makeup sense. I tell you man, keeping a cautiously optimistic attitude while writing these things can be exhausting sometimes. I try to give myself some time to cool down and be more levelheaded, but the predictable 5-2 collapse was just too much again. I agree that we are exceeding expectations this year, but that doesnt make you want it any less when its right there for the taking. Plus, to see the same crap right side of the line march out there, when everyone can see its crap, drives me nuts. How McDermott keeps sending those guys out there and only rushes 4 is getting maddening as we are wasting a great opportunity. Good news is, with our upcoming schedule plus last nights performance, my expectations are right back to where they should be...as a Bills fan
Fixxxer Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 Still pissed from the game last night. Pissed at the veterans of the team, pissed at the leaders of this team. You can hate Dennison's gameplan but it was the OL that couldn't hold their ground or open holes in the run game. Pissed at TT for not stepping up and tell the OL to snap the !@#$ out of the funk and put some points on the board when the team was simply going through the motions of losing a key game for their proffesional aspirations. Could we use more talent? sure, but tonight was not a case of lacking talent, it was pure desire and it wasn't there at least not on our side. Let's see how they react to this awful loss.
dayman Posted November 3, 2017 Posted November 3, 2017 Still pissed from the game last night. Pissed at the veterans of the team, pissed at the leaders of this team. You can hate Dennison's gameplan but it was the OL that couldn't hold their ground or open holes in the run game. Pissed at TT for not stepping up and tell the OL to snap the !@#$ out of the funk and put some points on the board when the team was simply going through the motions of losing a key game for their proffesional aspirations. Could we use more talent? sure, but tonight was not a case of lacking talent, it was pure desire and it wasn't there at least not on our side. Let's see how they react to this awful loss. I agree that this one sits right at the feet of our leaders and our vets. No Oline play, no pass rush.
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