OldTimeAFLGuy Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 Your going to be labeled a troll for this but I agree for the most part. If we lose against the Raiders like most expect, 4-2 can easily become 4-4 in the span of 5 days. And even if we win against some equal to worse teams record wise, not sure where the wins are coming from against the Dolphins x 2, Pats x 2, Saints, Chiefs, Chargers, etc. Bills won't be favored in any of those games. Realistically though I think Beane and McD know this isn't a playoff team this year but they are doing what they can to stay competitive while looking ahead to the future. And while stockpiling draft picks is nice, it won't matter if we don't hit on them and/or trade most of them away to move up for a QB or player like we did with Watkins and that guy don't pan out. ....and EXACTLY who the hell knows IF they will hit on draft picks?....since when is it an exact science?.....then again if this gang misses on ONE, the reign of TBD terror shall be unleashed and it's pretty easy to forecast which "expert (COUGH)" pundits will be at the forefront.....NEVER will understand why NFL clubs don't find this place as THE fertile mecca for GM's to guide their clubs to the "promised land".....
BillsFan4 Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 (edited) You are correct this is wrong as spotrak wipes out old info as soon as trade happens. I will past the correct in here in a min. Sorry! Correction is below credit to Bumbles247 100% Originally Posted by Bumbles247 http://www.!@#$.com/showthread.php?p=3464931#post3464931 You can't look at Spotrac's number for Jax and apply them to Buffalo's. First of all, Buffalo's cap hit for 2017 if they kept him was $16.4 mil. That included $9.75 million in salary, $250,000 in workout bonus, and $6.4 mil in prorated signing bonus. The $5.735 mil "hit" you're showing is how much of the base salary Jax now has to pay Dareus. $9,750,000 / 17 weeks = $573,529 per week X 10 remaining weeks = $5,735, 290. That's how much Jax would be hit with if they cut Dareus now (along with $7.35 mil of guaranteed 2018 salary). That's also the amount Buffalo "saves" this year because they no longer have to pay that portion of his salary. So our original cap hit for 2017 went from - --$9.75 mil salary ---- .25 mil workout+ 6.40 mil prorated ... --$16.4 mil to - ---$4.0155 mil salary ----- .25 mil workout-- +6.40 mil prorated ... ---$10.665 mil Our 2017 cap hit went from $16.4 mil down to $10.665 mil, meaning we saved $5.735 in cap space in 2017. For 2018 you show a hit of $10.175 mil. Again, that's Jax's hit, not what ours would have been if we kept him. Jax's numbers come from MD's $9,925,000 salary + $250,000 workout bonus. If Buffalo had kept him it would have included those numbers plus another $6.4 in prorated signing bonus, totaling $16.575 mil. The cap hit we get by accelerating his remaining prorated bonus is now $14.2 mil. That means we save $2.375 mil in cap space in 2018. Moving on to 2019, again, you're looking at Jax's numbers. They can cut MD after 2018 with no more cap hits because they don't have any prorated bonus amounts charged against them. That stays with us. The $14.2 mil charge against us in 2018 comes from prorated charges of- 2018 - $6.4 mil 2019 - $6.4 mil 2020 - $1.4 mil These charges don't apply to Jax. But if the Bills kept Dareus through 2018 then released him they would still have the 2019 and 2020 charges accelerated. Meaning they would still get hit with $7.8 mil in dead cap in 2019. Now let's review- Keeping Dareus for 2017 and 2018 would cost the Bills (in cap charges) - 2017 - $16.400 mil 2018 - $16.575 mil 2019 - $ 7.800 mil By trading him the cap hits are now - 2017 - $10.665 mil ($5.735 mil less) 2018 - $14.200 mil ($2.375 mil less) 2019 - $00.000 mil ($7.8 mil less) Yes there is dead cap space. And there are plenty of arguments about whether the amount we are saving is worth losing the player. But we are not losing any cap space by this trade. We are gaining. Thanks for posting the detailed correction. It's helpful. Hard to find info on his Bills contract, as like you said spotrac and over the cap updated immediately after the trade. Edited October 28, 2017 by BillsFan4
Roundybout Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 ....and EXACTLY who the hell knows IF they will hit on draft picks?....since when is it an exact science?.....then again if this gang misses on ONE, the reign of TBD terror shall be unleashed and it's pretty easy to forecast which "expert (COUGH)" pundits will be at the forefront.....NEVER will understand why NFL clubs don't find this place as THE fertile mecca for GM's to guide their clubs to the "promised land"..... Judging by this year's haul, I think it's safe to say they will hit more often than not. White- potential DROY Dawkins - good backup, could really be a great lineman in the future. Did you see that epic block he threw when Cog went out? Milano - already showed he can contribute when he picked Winston. Peterman - looks like a solid backup at worst Left out Zay because of his mental block and the other guy whose name honestly escapes me now
SaviorPeterman Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 ....and EXACTLY who the hell knows IF they will hit on draft picks?....since when is it an exact science?.....then again if this gang misses on ONE, the reign of TBD terror shall be unleashed and it's pretty easy to forecast which "expert (COUGH)" pundits will be at the forefront.....NEVER will understand why NFL clubs don't find this place as THE fertile mecca for GM's to guide their clubs to the "promised land"..... With all the draft picks this team currently has there is no excuse to not go out right out and make a move to help the team this season unless Beane and McD truly believe we aren't getting to the playoffs. But still not sure how you could come to that judgement at 4-2 even though the schedule does get much harder on paper. But yes nothing is guaranteed and it's pretty clear that regardless of the final outcome of this season, what Beane does next year with all these draft picks will define this franchise and whether or not we do make it back to the playoffs (assuming we don't this year) or the drought hits 20+ years.
DaBillsFanSince1973 Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 (edited) Your going to be labeled a troll for this but I agree for the most part. If we lose against the Raiders like most expect, 4-2 can easily become 4-4 in the span of 5 days. And even if we win against some equal to worse teams record wise, not sure where the wins are coming from against the Dolphins x 2, Pats x 2, Saints, Chiefs, Chargers, etc. Bills won't be favored in any of those games. Realistically though I think Beane and McD know this isn't a playoff team this year but they are doing what they can to stay competitive while looking ahead to the future. And while stockpiling draft picks is nice, it won't matter if we don't hit on them and/or trade most of them away to move up for a QB or player like we did with Watkins and that guy don't pan out. you and the OP go hand in hand. instead of looking at the bright side and thinking they may hit on some of the picks why not just go ahead and say a stupid comment like "it won't matter if we don't hit on them and/or trade most of them away to move up for a QB or player like we did with Watkins and that guy don't pan out." that's always the spirit. spirit, did I say spirit? does that coincide with savior? savior, spirit. perfect synonyms to go along with the negative poster known as savior the scout peterman. smfh Edited October 28, 2017 by DaBillsFanSince1973
SaviorPeterman Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 you and the OP go hand in hand. instead of looking at the bright side and thinking they may hit on some of the picks why not just go ahead and say a stupid comment like "it won't matter if we don't hit on them and/or trade most of them away to move up for a QB or player like we did with Watkins and that guy don't pan out." that's always the spirit. spirit, did I say spirit? does that coincide with savior? savior, spirit. perfect synonyms to go along with the negative poster known as the savior the scout peterman. smfh I'm not going to fully judge Beane until after next year, specifically what he does with all the draft picks. But let's not kid ourselves here, this guy has no proven track record as an NFL GM. People can rave about him being an 'up and comer' but everybody said the same thing about Whaley who was supposed to be the next big thing because he came from the Steelers (who have a much better franchise and legacy than the Panthers). But all Beane has really done so far in Buffalo is distance himself from Whaley and previous regimes and while I have no problem with the Dareus trade, it could still come back to haunt this team if they do have serious intentions of making the playoffs this year because the injuries have been hitting fast and furious on the defense lately.
DaBillsFanSince1973 Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 I'm not going to fully judge Beane until after next year, specifically what he does with all the draft picks. But let's not kid ourselves here, this guy has no proven track record as an NFL GM. People can rave about him being an 'up and comer' but everybody said the same thing about Whaley who was supposed to be the next big thing because he came from the Steelers (who have a much better franchise and legacy than the Panthers). But all Beane has really done so far in Buffalo is distance himself from Whaley and previous regimes and while I have no problem with the Dareus trade, it could still come back to haunt this team if they do have serious intentions of making the playoffs this year because the injuries have been hitting fast and furious on the defense lately. you look at the dark side, I try to look at the bright side. some like to wallow in negativity, I try to avoid it. you want to call it realism. I'm going to call it reality wont become reality until the end result. this staff has their chance to succeed and if you and any other want to see failure before the it's said and done, go wallow in it then.
Overdue Bill Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 Hasn't made a single right decision his tenure here. Keeps trading away the only talented players on our roster and for what? Has anyone taken a look at our DT depth, its horrible. He just handed out a pro bowl DT in the prime of his career for pennies. NONE of his trades/signings have made any sense. complete shambles. People think this is a good trade just bc we are 4-2. Wait until November rolls around and the real Buffalo Bills show up just like the last 17 years folks. This fan base is legit the most delusional in the NFL. no joke. If anyone is responsible for the success of our team right now its DOUG WHALEY Wow...maybe you are in a parallel universe...are we talking about the same team? Our DT depth may be horrible, but Darius was not the answer especially with the size of his contract. We could get a number of hungry players for much less and they would be more motivated than Darius was after he received his payday.
Formerly Allan in MD Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 The initiator of this thread has the old expression "If it isn't broken, don't fix it" all screwed up. He/she thinks it goes "If it's broken, don't attempt to fix it." Perhaps we should wait a bit longer before determining how competent our GM is. And BTW, perhaps the reason for the Bills current success is the absence of the bobsy twins.
billsfan89 Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 The Bills were 4-2 last year, so I don't put that much stock into the hot start. But winning cures everything. Dareus was given away for a low round pick. Most times when the Bills would dump a player for pennies on the dollar we would have real reason to think that the team was just giving away talent for some stupid reason. But McD and Beane have proven that they want to build a culture and have everyone on the same page. Dareus must have been a really big issue in the locker room for them to just dump him for a fairly low return. It's a bold strategy for sure but fortune favors the bold. How the Bills team plays will determine how successful these trades are. If the team fades down the stretch into a 7-8 win team then we know that sometimes the process needs more talent or the team just didn't have the depth to win. But if they go 10-6 and make the playoffs without all of these talented players then they will have justified their approach and have a ton of cap space and picks to build up the roster into a real contender.
BmarvB Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 Why so negative so soon? It's way too early to rush to judgement. Give the man time to show us the method behind his madness
Steve Billieve Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 Guy hasn't even performed his primary function yet . . . maybe we should be discussing top three worst posters . . .
Buffalo Barbarian Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 The only trade I wasn't crazy about was Watkins. We would be better with him and now that we dumped Dareus, which they planned all along we could have afforded him. He isn't hurt finally so that's the part that sucked these last few years. TT would be so much better with Watkins. Wonder why they waited this long to trade him?
DisplacedBillsFan Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 Hasn't made a single right decision his tenure here. Keeps trading away the only talented players on our roster and for what? Has anyone taken a look at our DT depth, its horrible. He just handed out a pro bowl DT in the prime of his career for pennies. NONE of his trades/signings have made any sense. complete shambles. People think this is a good trade just bc we are 4-2. Wait until November rolls around and the real Buffalo Bills show up just like the last 17 years folks. This fan base is legit the most delusional in the NFL. no joke. If anyone is responsible for the success of our team right now its DOUG WHALEY This is quite possibly the dumbest post I've ever read on this site.
JMF2006 Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 Guy hasn't even performed his primary function yet . . . maybe we should be discussing top three worst posters . . . .No need to discuss we all know who they are Wonder why they waited this long to trade him? He was so out of shape it took to week 6 to get him fit enough to play 65% of the snaps to showcase him.
Bills Pimpin' Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 Hasn't made a single right decision his tenure here. Keeps trading away the only talented players on our roster and for what? Has anyone taken a look at our DT depth, its horrible. He just handed out a pro bowl DT in the prime of his career for pennies. NONE of his trades/signings have made any sense. complete shambles. People think this is a good trade just bc we are 4-2. Wait until November rolls around and the real Buffalo Bills show up just like the last 17 years folks. This fan base is legit the most delusional in the NFL. no joke. If anyone is responsible for the success of our team right now its DOUG WHALEY Beane has made a bunch of great moves over the past 6 months but without a doubt this is the best. It's a great time to be a Bills fan.
Rico Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 Hasn't made a single right decision his tenure here. Keeps trading away the only talented players on our roster and for what? Has anyone taken a look at our DT depth, its horrible. He just handed out a pro bowl DT in the prime of his career for pennies. NONE of his trades/signings have made any sense. complete shambles. People think this is a good trade just bc we are 4-2. Wait until November rolls around and the real Buffalo Bills show up just like the last 17 years folks. This fan base is legit the most delusional in the NFL. no joke. If anyone is responsible for the success of our team right now its DOUG WHALEY Your going to be labeled a troll for this but I agree for the most part.
Mountain Man Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 How? He has already shown he is a piss poor decision maker with the roster moves he has made so far. Who the hell would trust this guy with what could be the most important draft in the last 20 years for this team. We managed to get a 2nd round pick, and a starting CB for a WR who is just about clinging on to be the Rams 3rd WR
Zona Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 The Bills were 4-2 last year, so I don't put that much stock into the hot start. But winning cures everything. Dareus was given away for a low round pick. Most times when the Bills would dump a player for pennies on the dollar we would have real reason to think that the team was just giving away talent for some stupid reason. But McD and Beane have proven that they want to build a culture and have everyone on the same page. Dareus must have been a really big issue in the locker room for them to just dump him for a fairly low return. It's a bold strategy for sure but fortune favors the bold. How the Bills team plays will determine how successful these trades are. If the team fades down the stretch into a 7-8 win team then we know that sometimes the process needs more talent or the team just didn't have the depth to win. But if they go 10-6 and make the playoffs without all of these talented players then they will have justified their approach and have a ton of cap space and picks to build up the roster into a real contender. this is my feeling as well. i think this duo of mcd and beane are trying to change the culture. Get away from me first, and go to team first. Period. Full stop. No lets see how it plays out before we condemn....
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