Lurker Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 Well the option to get rid of him after next year was always there. In fact, there was a line on his contract on sportrac highlighting the out after next year. Thats why it was structured like that. 2019 and beyond was never going to come into play. Yep. Contracts are meant to be ripped up the moment they're signed. The guaranteed money is all that matters. I still don't get the urgency. We're weaker for the next ten games and they could have gotten a 6th round pick just as easily in the off season. Maybe more if Dareus finishes strong and the team got a lot of national exposure...
Kelly the Dog Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 While I don't think anyone here, even Dareus apologists and haters of the trade believe that he is worth the money we are paying him right now, IMO in the middle of a season that just doesn't matter. Every year, in general terms, about a third of the players on any team outplay what they are making, a third are about you get what you pay for, and the last third are underperforming. Tre is way outplaying his contract. Humber and Milano were outplaying theirs. Nick OLeary is outplaying. Hyde and Poyer and Gaines are outplaying. Dareus is way underperforming. Zay is underperforming. Miller is underperforming. But it all adds up to the team in total. You can say sure, he's being paid way too much but you're not going to decrease that in the season (outside of trading him) just like you're not going to give Tre a huge raise.
26CornerBlitz Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 So 21, what are we paying for remainder of contract,and what is Jax paying? Sorry if posted already @spotrac The #Jaguars acquire Dareus w cap hits of $5.7M, $10.1M, $11.5M, $14.6M, & $14.65M. $7.35M of 2018 salary is GTD. http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/jacksonville-jaguars/marcell-dareus-7718/
Kirby Jackson Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 (edited) I don't think they really care. I also don't really care. He will be off the books after next year. How much would they be minimizing it for? Here was an article about this very thing posted in August: I don't see the downside of not waiting. In fact I see the upside. Dareus is now off the books after 2018. Postponing it doesn't save all that much more money and pushes the dead cap to 2019. I didnt pull up the sportrac but if memory serves me correctly it was only like $7M Im dead money after next year. Basically the savings would have been really big. Edited October 28, 2017 by Kirby Jackson
NoSaint Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 I don't think they really care. I also don't really care. He will be off the books after next year. How much would they be minimizing it for? Here was an article about this very thing posted in August: I don't see the downside of not waiting. In fact I see the upside. Dareus is now off the books after 2018. Postponing it doesn't save all that much more money and pushes the dead cap to 2019. His point was that the marginal savings in cap vs keeping him til AFTER 2018 was minimal and then the dead hit would be much lower. Essentially wed be getting the benefit of maybe he steps up without just having the downside of 90% of the same cap hit.
Kelly the Dog Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 Given that they have been trying to do this for months, it is clear this is the biggest offer they got. While that may be true, the trade deadline is a week or so away I think. Teams could get desperate and offer more. According to Beane, which I don't really believe, the offer just came up and they took it.
blogic2 Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 Not mad with the trade but would have liked to see a conditional pick that could end up being a 4th based on performance and usage.
Scott7975 Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 The message of keeping a player that is not bought in? That matters. Teams trade guys that they don't believe in. Agree
YoloinOhio Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 @mmqb It's easy to see why the Jaguars would want to acquire All-Pro DT Marcell Dareus. But the Bills benefited as well Who Won the Marcell Dareus Trade? Aggression, Pragmatism on Display From Bills and Jaguars https://t.co/idkY0IGzJ7?amp=1
disco Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 It's just shocking to me that Jacksonville took that contract on. The Bills aren't winning the Super Bowl this year, and I sure hope the FO is trying to get there vs a playoff birth. You move on from guys that aren't in your plan and pose a potential long term road block. We don't want to risk him blowing his knee out next week. He's not going suddenly care and have a monster season to raise his trade value in the off-season. It's just not very likely. Nobody is thrilled that our stud player got paid and gave up, but that's where we're at. Dead cap space... honestly it's not that big a deal. Countless teams in far worse scenarios have worked around a short term cap issues. It's massively disappointing, but a 6th was the demand, and I see very low odds the Bills were going to get more in the future.
What a Tuel Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 (edited) Thanks. So the Bills only save $5.7mil against the cap this year, $2.3mil against the cap next year, but also wipe out ~7-8mil in what would have been dead cap space if they'd kept him for two years and cut him before the 2019 season? Do I have that correct now or still mistaken? My understanding is that those cap "savings" are simply the difference between the dead cap and what we would have paid him. We are still paying $10 in 2017 and $14 in 2018 million for nobody, as opposed to paying his normal salaries in 2017 and 2018 plus the signing bonus that would've been spread over the term of his contract if we kept him. Edited October 28, 2017 by What a Tuel
Captain_Quint Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 Wait Wait Wait Are we back to tanking now? Clearly the tank is on This is a flush, not a tank.
YoloinOhio Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 Not mad with the trade but would have liked to see a conditional pick that could end up being a 4th based on performance and usage.i am sure the Bills would have liked to see that too. Alas, no team saw that value. The contract the biggest stickler imo.
BeginnersMind Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 The sky is falling! The sky is falling! We traded our star DE. Mario Williams redux.
CommonCents Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 (edited) The obvious next question is did doing stuff like sending him home from the preseason game help his valueHis value is diminished because of his play and being a repeat offender of the substance abuse policy. The same people who wanted Martavis for a 7th are complaining about the Bills moving Dareus for a 6th. This trade wasnt about getting a pick in return it was about distancing themselves from the player and his contract the best way they could. That was to accept a minimal return from a team that is willing to acquire the risk of a malcontent who is a repeated offender of the leagues substance abuse policy. Make no mistake about it only one man killed his value, that was Dareus himself, with his immaturity, stupidity, and selfishness. Edited October 28, 2017 by Commonsense
GoBills808 Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 I'm going out on a limb and saying before this season's over it comes out he's facing a 10 game suspension next season.
BeginnersMind Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 Not mad with the trade but would have liked to see a conditional pick that could end up being a 4th based on performance and usage. So you're upset that they didn't get a 4th but they did get a 5th? I'm sure Beane tried for more.
Scott7975 Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 I didnt pull up the sportrac but if memory serves me correctly it was only like $7M Im dead money after next year. Basically the savings would have been really big. Ok so you mean to keep him next year too. Sorry, I thought you meant doing something at the end of this season or post June 1st cut next season. Personally, If the guy doesn't want to play football like he can and is a detriment to the team... then I definitely don't want him for an extra season. You still aren't really saving any money. The only difference is the player is still here... which the team does not want. Dead cap this year means nothing. Dead cap next year can be absorbed and moved on from. JMO but I respect yours as well.
JohnC Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 6th rounder?!? Thats awful If it's true that we get back only a 6th rounder then it's really disappointing. I'm getting the feeling that Dareus basically shut it down demonstrating that he simply didn't care and want to be part of the team. I get the impression that the HC made it clear that's he's not going to tolerate such wayward behavior in his building.
Wayne Arnold Posted October 28, 2017 Posted October 28, 2017 (edited) @ringer Marcell Dareus bolsters an already-dominant defense and could propel the Jaguars to the Super Bowl. Edited October 28, 2017 by Wayne Arnold
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