SoTier Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 (edited) If it becomes apparent that the Pegulas aren't dedicated to winning. I know this is an unpopular opinion, but I thought Ralph Wilson sucked as an owner. He recognized that he had a fanbase in a region that had nothing else. He took advantage and did nothing to make the investments necessary to take the team over the top. Especially after the Super Bowl years. From then, until his death, it was just year after year of big splash signings that generated season ticket sales; knowing damn well that winning wasn't the goal - money was. The first year of the Pegula era was much of the same; forcing a proven failure of a head coach, but a big name, down the throats of the front office and the fans. After, in spite of an elderly, disengaged owner, the front office managed to build a top 5 defense and was just a quarterback away from being a powerhouse. They chose limelight over wins. But it seems that they learned their lesson with the Beane/McDermott hires, and they're doing what owners should do - stay out of the day to day and keep the checkbook open and available. If the Pegulas revert to their fame/money over wins philosophy, I'll walk. It wasn't fun for two years and it won't be fun if they do it again. If they move, I'll stay with them if they are the Bills. If they move with a name change, then I'll just become a football fan. But if they stay in Buffalo and just make moves for season ticket and merch sales? I'm out. I agree with many of your sentiments, including your view of Ralph Wilson. I differ with you on your view of the Pegulas ... I think that after their brief fling with Ryan, they've surrendered to the "money ball" philosophy that has permeated the Bills organization since Russ Brandon, current President of both the Bills and the Sabres, joined the organization more than a decade ago, so I'm not sure that they're dedicated to winning any more than Ralph was. I keep hoping that they got burned with Ryan and turned to Brandon because of it. I keep hoping they wise up and can Brandon and his minions because otherwise the last 17 years of rearranging of the deck chairs on Titanic are going to continue. IMO, Beane and McDermott aren't all that different than Levy and Jauron. I don't know how long my Bills fandom will last. It's seriously declined, and especially this season, I can feel myself detaching. I gave up my seasons after the 2008 season when they rehired Jauron (probably the Bills HC I hated the most), but I would go to a couple of games a year. This year, I haven't attended one, primarily because I felt that the FO was doing the same thing it's always done: shedding talented players to save $$$ and trying to pawn off JAGs and ST refugees as "just as good". Well, they aren't ... as the performance of so many ex-Bills playing well for good teams like the Patriots, Eagles, and Chiefs proves. I watch Bills games sporadically, usually channel hopping to other games. I feel like I'm seriously contemplating divorce, this time from a team rather than from a spouse. Like a divorce, even after the marriage ends, you don't stop caring, you just stop subjecting yourself to all the anger and heartache. Edited October 19, 2017 by SoTier
ddaryl Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 if they leave the city that's when I stop being a fan of the bills and the NFL
BigPappy Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 If the head coach and many front office figures covered up the actions of a serial pedophile assistant coach who was raping children inside the facilities then I would certainly be done with the team. Of course, many here aren't done with Ped State and they still somehow convince recruits to go there and they pack the stadium every Saturday so I'm sure the franchise would recover because human beings can rationalize anything if it's in their own self-interest. But I would be done, personally. WOW! my mind never even thought of going there.....but I would have to add that to my relocation to another city. To think of someone cover up such an act is disgusting. Never watched Pen State or any college football for that matter so it made it easy for me to say I would never watch or root for them after that fiasco.
kickedface Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 death or relocation whichever happens first.
teef Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 (edited) I agree with many of your sentiments, including your view of Ralph Wilson. I differ with you on your view of the Pegulas ... I think that after their brief fling with Ryan, they've surrendered to the "money ball" philosophy that has permeated the Bills organization since Russ Brandon, current President of both the Bills and the Sabres, joined the organization more than a decade ago, so I'm not sure that they're dedicated to winning any more than Ralph was. I keep hoping that they got burned with Ryan and turned to Brandon because of it. I keep hoping they wise up and can Brandon and his minions because otherwise the last 17 years of rearranging of the deck chairs on Titanic are going to continue. IMO, Beane and McDermott aren't all that different than Levy and Jauron. I don't know how long my Bills fandom will last. It's seriously declined, and especially this season, I can feel myself detaching. I gave up my seasons after the 2008 season when they rehired Jauron (probably the Bills HC I hated the most), but I would go to a couple of games a year. This year, I haven't attended one, primarily because I felt that the FO was doing the same thing it's always done: shedding talented players to save $$$ and trying to pawn off JAGs and ST refugees as "just as good". Well, they aren't ... as the performance of so many ex-Bills playing well for good teams like the Patriots, Eagles, and Chiefs proves. I watch Bills games sporadically, usually channel hopping to other games. I feel like I'm seriously contemplating divorce, this time from a team rather than from a spouse. Like a divorce, even after the marriage ends, you don't stop caring, you just stop subjecting yourself to all the anger and heartache. with all of the evidence otherwise, you actually feel this way? my god. if anything, the pegulas have shown that they're very willing to spend money. Edited October 19, 2017 by teef
Kirby Jackson Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 (edited) I know where this thread could go so be polite. If someone says something you disagree with and you feel so steadfast to make this another Kaepernick/political thread, I'll shut this stojan down. Let them say their peace because it's their opinion not yours. So what would it take? What would it take for you to honestly and wholy quit the Bills? Relocation? Kaepernick? Signing a certain other player? Another trade? Moving uptown and limiting tailgating? I think relocation is the only thing that would have made me quit this team out right? Moving to Toronto, Las Vegas, Grand Rapids, Michigan... Anything outside of Western New York. I think it's relocation for me too Boyst. If they ceased to be in WNY I don't know what I would do. My guess is that I'd probably start distancing myself and try to cozy up to the Saints (or just abandon the NFL). Other than that it would have to be something extreme. Edited October 19, 2017 by Kirby Jackson
Canadian Bills Fan Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 Relocation for me Even if they moved to Canada? CBF Yes especially that. I HATED the Bills in TO series more than anyone. Toronto doesn't deserve our Bills and I'm so glad that nightmare is over CBF
familykwi Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 I'm a transplant now living in San Diego having stayed after a tour in the Navy, but I'm still a fan of the Bills. I have the perspective of being in a city that has had their hearts ripped out by a buffoon of an owner that had no care of the fan base, only the dollars they could throw his way. Believe me, if the Bills were to leave Buffalo, it would hurt badly and would be unforgivable. Furthermore, if the NFL owners allowed that to happen, I'd be done with the NFL as well. I'm already disgusted with this ownership group who only make decisions based on maximum financial profit. Fan loyalty is not rewarded nor reciprocated. If fans demonstrate peacefully that they are dissatisfied with ownership by not paying for the product until the product is improved, owners do not apologize for their mismanagement and make changes to make the fan base happy. They cry to their other ownership brethren and say they need to chase dollars in another city that they can hold hostage for maximum profit. I'm OK with a business owner trying to make money. Businesses make money, but they do not put faces to their products and build personal relationships with their cities the way pro sports teams do. Those relationships become a part of the identity of the fans that support their teams. If the team chooses to turn their back on that relationship, then yes, I would have to let them go. Pegula was awarded the Bills on the premise that this team stay where it is. The fan support in Buffalo is still strong, so if they were to leave, then anything said before was a lie. It would be another billionaire owner being let into the club to help the others make more money for themselves. If it ever turns out that way I am out.
CodeMonkey Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 I'm already not a tackle football fan. Haven't been for a few seasons now, I only watch the Bills. So if the Bills relocate outside the WNY area I'm done with them, and tackle football completely.
dpberr Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 Outside of relocation, I'd leave the Bills if they sold the naming rights of a new stadium to a non-Buffalo area corporation. For some reason, that'd really annoy me.
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 I want to make 1 amendment .... Donald Trump purchasing the Bills may have made me dump the team I love
Wayne Arnold Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 I want to make 1 amendment .... Donald Trump purchasing the Bills may have made me dump the team I love Snowflake!!
SaviorPeterman Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 I've pondered walking away from this team for several years now but always seemed to get sucked back in. But if McD/Beane are not successful and this drought hits 20+ years then I probably have to walk away for good. Because this type of ineptitude is not good for any casual, or hardcore fans health and well being quite frankly.
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 Snowflake!! that would make me unique no? Maybe if he did he would have never run for office. a lose lose situation
dwight in philly Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 Had they moved, yes. Signing kap, would make me think about giving up season tickets. you saved me from reading thru .. signing Kap was my initial thought.. relocation is seemingly a non-issue , but that would do it.
SoTier Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 (edited) with all of the evidence otherwise, you actually feel this way? my god. if anything, the pegulas have shown that they're very willing to spend money. What exactly is all this "evidence otherwise"? I agree that the Pegulas are willing to spend money, but after they got conned by Ryan they seem to have stepped back and turned the running of the team over to "the football people" which would be a good move if Brandon and his "football people" were actually "football people" who knew something about football rather than bean counters dedicated to increasing profitabillity. Beane has no player personnel expertise, so basically, the only "football guy" is their rookie HC, Sean McDermott, who certainly has a much more modest resume than Dick Jauron, Chan Gailey or Doug Marrone, since all of them had head coaching experience in college or the NFL. How is letting Gilmore, Goodwin, and Woods in FA and then using 2017 first and second round draft picks on a DB and WR to replace them any different than all the other times over the last 20 years that the Bills have shed their best DBs and WRs and used draft picks on their replacements? Trading Watkins had nothing to do with his attitude but with the fact that the Bills were never going to offer him market value, even before he made his comments about WRs being paid more in general. If the Bills had been interested in signing him at all, they would have picked up his option; they just waitied until he demonstrated he was healthy to pull the trigger on the trade. I expect that the Watkins trade may very well join the other two great trades the Bills pulled off under Brandon's watch: All Pro LT Jason Peters to Philadelphia and All Pro RB Marshawn Lynch to Seattle. Basically, the team is doing exactly the same manure under the new ownership that it did under the old ownership. The names and faces of the lower echelon people -- where "the football people" are -- have changed but higher up the food chain -- the guys who make the real decisions -- haven't changed at all. Edited October 19, 2017 by SoTier
Kirby Jackson Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 I've pondered walking away from this team for several years now but always seemed to get sucked back in. But if McD/Beane are not successful and this drought hits 20+ years then I probably have to walk away for good. Because this type of ineptitude is not good for any casual, or hardcore fans health and well being quite frankly. I was under the impression that you already walked away?
SaviorPeterman Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 I was under the impression that you already walked away? I was extremely close this year because I did believe the Bills were going to be terrible entering year one of the latest rebuilding venture, but I bought into the 'you never know' idea and at least so far this team has been better than expected. Still not sure they will sustain it but I'm along for the ride at least one more season anyway.....
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