Sammy Watkins complaining about targets again

[Deranged Rhino]

Worth at least 2-3 wins?

 

They beat both Philly and Cinci with a legit threat at WR.

[QCity]

No man, his serial defenders are too invested in him to admit that they were probably wrong. The excuse train will go on through the season into the next if need be.

 

It's always someone else's fault. First it was TT, then it was the coaches fault for not targeting him more often, then it was the injuries, then it was him being forced to play with injuries, then it was him being traded and not having enough time to learn the playbook, then it was because he's the only elite WR to be used as a decoy week in and week out, now it's because of Goff.

 

Do you see a pattern here?

 

I wonder if the Watkins fans even realize they are now in their 4th year of making excuses for the guy? Time flies when you are cherrypicking stats and pointing blame, huh?

[Boatdrinks]

Watch the games. TT nor Goff looks for him. They have the play sent in and don't survey the field of the matchups.

 

I can promise you that any competent seasoned QB would be throwing him the ball. These are basically rookies.

 

Also the #1 defenders are assigned to him as are double teams. But I guess opposing coaches don't know anything either.

 

It is sad to see.

Again I agree with this assessment after actually watching the games. Unlike the haters here who look at a box score. I've seen SW holding his hand up wide open and Goff doesn't even look there. SW is doing his job as far as I can tell. He s still the new guy there but Goff seems to lock onto targets and not go through his progressions at times.

No man, his serial defenders are too invested in him to admit that they were probably wrong. The excuse train will go on through the season into the next if need be.

It's always someone else's fault. First it was TT, then it was the coaches fault for not targeting him more often, then it was the injuries, then it was him being forced to play with injuries, then it was him being traded and not having enough time to learn the playbook, then it was because he's the only elite WR to be used as a decoy week in and week out, now it's because of Goff.

Do you see a pattern here?

Wow , it actually bothers you that there are fans of Watkins, the player? Not all of us root only for laundry. That seems to offend you. Whatever your diatribe is based on, you spend a lot of time worrying about a player you clearly don't don't like.

Goff is still in a very early stage of his development so his ability to scan the field is still rudimentary. Given time and with a young passing qb who is going to get better Watkins will be targeted more, assuming he signs there. Watkins joined the Rams late so he didn't have an opportunity to work out with the team in the offseason. Right now Goff is more comfortable throwing to Kupp. As time goes on Watkins should be more involved with the offense. Anyone who is dismissing Watkins from a talent standpoint is because of his personality is making a mistake.

 

Solid and realistic analysis. He got traded to the Rams and is playing with a QB that didn't even look ready for prime time in 2016. It's not like he was traded to the Patriots.

[oldmanfan]

Again I agree with this assessment after actually watching the games. Unlike the haters here who look at a box score. I've seen SW holding his hand up wide open and Goff doesn't even look there. SW is doing his job as far as I can tell. He s still the new guy there but Goff seems to lock onto targets and not go through his progressions at times.

 

Wow , it actually bothers you that there are fans of Watkins, the player? Not all of us root only for laundry. That seems to offend you. Whatever your diatribe is based on, you spend a lot of time worrying about a player you clearly don't don't like.

 

Solid and realistic analysis. He got traded to the Rams and is playing with a QB that didn't even look ready for prime time in 2016. It's not like he was traded to the Patriots.

Regarding the last paragraph, that was why the Bills drafted him. To give a young QB (EJ) a great receiver to rely on. Why is it a great plan for the Rams but was a terrible plan for the Bills? And before starting on the Because EJ was bad trail, EL okoked better as a rookie than did Goff.

Again I agree with this assessment after actually watching the games. Unlike the haters here who look at a box score. I've seen SW holding his hand up wide open and Goff doesn't even look there. SW is doing his job as far as I can tell. He s still the new guy there but Goff seems to lock onto targets and not go through his progressions at times.

 

Wow , it actually bothers you that there are fans of Watkins, the player? Not all of us root only for laundry. That seems to offend you. Whatever your diatribe is based on, you spend a lot of time worrying about a player you clearly don't don't like.

 

Solid and realistic analysis. He got traded to the Rams and is playing with a QB that didn't even look ready for prime time in 2016. It's not like he was traded to the Patriots.

Regarding the last paragraph, that was why the Bills drafted him. To give a young QB (EJ) a great receiver to rely on. Why is it a great plan for the Rams but was a terrible plan for the Bills? And before starting on the Because EJ was bad trail, EL looked better as a rookie than did Goff.

[mead107]

Not a Bill. Care less what the guy does.

[Boatdrinks]

Regarding the last paragraph, that was why the Bills drafted him. To give a young QB (EJ) a great receiver to rely on. Why is it a great plan for the Rams but was a terrible plan for the Bills? And before starting on the Because EJ was bad trail, EL looked better as a rookie than did Goff.

Who said it was a terrible plan for the Bills or a great one for the Rams? As far as the Bills drafting him, I liked the move personally. I thought the price was very high but I liked the player. I'm not sure what it has to do with EJM. EJM barely started any games with Watkins ( though he did hang him out to dry in preseason vs Shazier) Kyle Orton was the QB for most of Watkins rookie year. Goff is still finding his way as a QB, and Watkins has yet to be fully integrated into that offense. Yes, I've actually watched the Rams games.

[oldmanfan]

Who said it was a terrible plan for the Bills or a great one for the Rams? As far as the Bills drafting him, I liked the move personally. I thought the price was very high but I liked the player. I'm not sure what it has to do with EJM. EJM barely started any games with Watkins ( though he did hang him out to dry in preseason vs Shazier) Kyle Orton was the QB for most of Watkins rookie year. Goff is still finding his way as a QB, and Watkins has yet to be fully integrated into that offense. Yes, I've actually watched the Rams games.

Who said it was a terrible plan for the Bills? Have you seen posts about it for the last 5 years or so?

[Gugny]

It's a smart move by Watkins. If the Rams are trying to keep his cost down by limiting his targets or just simply not interested in making him a focal point, why not plan your exit? He didn't ask to be traded. He likely wants to be a free agent under those circumstances. The second contract is usually a players chance to get paid, while they are relatively young. All good WRs want the ball, it just comes with the territory.

 

It seems to me that Sam always has an excuse to not play through discomfort, not play his hardest for his team, or to simply not play at all.

 

This guy seriously has not earned a God damn thing.

[Boatdrinks]

It seems to me that Sam always has an excuse to not play through discomfort, not play his hardest for his team, or to simply not play at all.

 

This guy seriously has not earned a God damn thing.

 

I'm guessing that there will be NFL teams that disagree with you.

Who said it was a terrible plan for the Bills? Have you seen posts about it for the last 5 years or so?

I don't think I understand your question or point

[oldmanfan]

I'm guessing that there will be NFL teams that disagree with you.

 

I don't think I understand your question or point

You asked who said it was a terrible plan when the Bills drafted Watkins as a target for EJ. I would conservatively say there have been well over a thousand posts back on the BBMB and here blasting the Bills for doing so. And now some of the same people talk about what a smart move it was for the Rams to bring in Sammy to give a young QB a target. The hypocrisy among some folks is amusing.

 

And sorry , but I also don't think the Rams are deliberately telling Goff to not throw to Sammy so his contract demands go down. That's way over the top IMHO

[Gugny]

I'm guessing that there will be NFL teams that disagree with you.

 

 

There will be, for sure. And he'll put up great numbers on a team with a losing record. Because he's selfish.

[boyst]

I'm asking this as a serious question. Was the topic related to farming and local enterprises?

yes for all but 1.

[Boatdrinks]

You asked who said it was a terrible plan when the Bills drafted Watkins as a target for EJ. I would conservatively say there have been well over a thousand posts back on the BBMB and here blasting the Bills for doing so. And now some of the same people talk about what a smart move it was for the Rams to bring in Sammy to give a young QB a target. The hypocrisy among some folks is amusing.

And sorry , but I also don't think the Rams are deliberately telling Goff to not throw to Sammy so his contract demands go down. That's way over the top IMHO

Ok. And I'm not saying they are telling Goff to do anything specific. It's apparent he is more comfortable with the guys he practiced with since spring mini camps though. And watching the offense it seems SW is often running the clearing routes for underneath passes. That is a subtle thing but almost ensures that the ball is going elsewhere by design. It could be to just ease him into the offense with simple routes. But it's obvious they are not scheming ways to get Sammy Watkins the ball. Whether you think it's over the top or not, they know they have a contract negotiation coming up and they have other targets that they worked on offensive design with all offseason before making the Watkins trade. It was clearly a move for the future rather than 2017 and it could suit them financially if Watkins had an average year statistically. They will score points regardless.

There will be, for sure. And he'll put up great numbers on a team with a losing record. Because he's selfish.

I don't care if players are selfish. WRs always want the ball. If he wants the ball great, get it to him. The best looking Bills offense in recent years was when Roman made an effort to get Watkins the ball early and often.

[Gugny]

 

I don't care if players are selfish. WRs always want the ball. If he wants the ball great, get it to him. The best looking Bills offense in recent years was when Roman made an effort to get Watkins the ball early and often.

 

He'd be a better selfish player if he was on the field when he gets boo boos. The guy is a selfish, arrogant, immature, stupid punk. I was ecstatic when I got the alert that he was gone. He's no pro. No respect for the game or his teammates. Now on two different teams. That, my friend, is a pattern.

[C.Biscuit97]

Ok. And I'm not saying they are telling Goff to do anything specific. It's apparent he is more comfortable with the guys he practiced with since spring mini camps though. And watching the offense it seems SW is often running the clearing routes for underneath passes. That is a subtle thing but almost ensures that the ball is going elsewhere by design. It could be to just ease him into the offense with simple routes. But it's obvious they are not scheming ways to get Sammy Watkins the ball. Whether you think it's over the top or not, they know they have a contract negotiation coming up and they have other targets that they worked on offensive design with all offseason before making the Watkins trade. It was clearly a move for the future rather than 2017 and it could suit them financially if Watkins had an average year statistically. They will score points regardless.

 

I don't care if players are selfish. WRs always want the ball. If he wants the ball great, get it to him. The best looking Bills offense in recent years was when Roman made an effort to get Watkins the ball early and often.

WRs are annoying. But remember that game against KC where Sammy was absolutely murdering them in the first half & then for some reason, they stopped throwing him the ball?

[Boatdrinks]

He'd be a better selfish player if he was on the field when he gets boo boos. The guy is a selfish, arrogant, immature, stupid punk. I was ecstatic when I got the alert that he was gone. He's no pro. No respect for the game or his teammates. Now on two different teams. That, my friend, is a pattern.

You don't like the player. I do. I hated the trade, he was my favorite player on the Bills. So is till watch him. Why spend time worrying about players you don't like?

WRs are annoying. But remember that game against KC where Sammy was absolutely murdering them in the first half & then for some reason, they stopped throwing him the ball?

They can be, but it's part of the drama that is the NFL and makes it as compelling as it is. Yes I remember it well. I had more hope for the Bills offense after that last half of 2015 than I have in a long time. Then the injury pretty much derailed his 2016 season.

[Cynical]

Nothing justifies giving up on a route. I never claimed otherwise. But it happens... to more than just Sammy.

 

We are not talking about other WR. We are about talking Sammy Watkins. Who is in a contract year (motivation!).

Who, according to his supporters on here, was going to have a pro bowl year with 1600 yds, etc, etc

Who, prior to this game, stated he understood he was not going to get targeted like Julio Jones and others, and that he was going to be a team player

Who was called out by his QB for quitting on route.

Who is now back on twitter essentially complaining he is not being targeted enough.

 

And you still haven't answered the question of how many more weeks we will have to wait until we see his "eliteness". Come on, ball park a number.

Because the longer we wait, the value of that asset continues to drop.

 

Disagree. The only question other teams had about Watkins - and I'm basing this on what I've heard from actual people in the league - was about his ability to remain healthy. He hadn't played meaningful snaps in months and had spent the off season fending off questions about his foot. Health concerns cratered his value, justifiably so.

So what you have is a perceived value prior to the season. That is not actual value. Just because something is shiny and looks like gold, doesn't mean it's gold.

That perceived value also assumes all of Sammy Watkins production issues were related to the organization and how he was used (TT was his QB, run heavy scheme, etc)

But a funny thing happened. He got traded. He's now the 3-4 WR. The foot is no longer the issue. Where's the production?

 

I completely agree it was a risk to hold onto him. Had he been injured in the first 5 weeks, then my point is moot. But had the Bills hung onto him for the first five games, not only would they probably be sitting at 5-0, his value would be far higher than it was in early August.

Your point is still moot. You assume Sammy's value could only go up. Your entire assumption of increased value is based on a belief that somehow Sammy's production would increase if he stayed here.

And that somehow, the Bills would be 5-0.

Mind you, this is with Taylor still being his QB, and Taylor is supposedly one of the reasons why Sammy's numbers suck to begin with. Feel free to explain how that works.

 

What if the Bills already concluded Sammy's production was not going to go up, because the biggest issue with Sammy is Sammy himself.

That it wasn't the QB, or the scheme, or the injury.

So if you are the Bills, what are your choices?

Keep him and play him, hoping a contract year would somehow put Sammys head on straight? (Well we already know the answer to that one)

Keep him and play him, revealing to the rest of the league the problem really might be Sammy himself? (kinda beginning to look that way)

Or capitalize on that perceived value and trade him.

 

Remember that old axiom: If a deal sounds to good to be true, it probably isn't. Well, if a team is willing to take peanuts for an "elite" WR ...

[Boatdrinks]

We are not talking about other WR. We are about talking Sammy Watkins. Who is in a contract year (motivation!).

Who, according to his supporters on here, was going to have a pro bowl year with 1600 yds, etc, etc

Who, prior to this game, stated he understood he was not going to get targeted like Julio Jones and others, and that he was going to be a team player

Who was called out by his QB for quitting on route.

Who is now back on twitter essentially complaining he is not being targeted enough.

 

And you still haven't answered the question of how many more weeks we will have to wait until we see his "eliteness". Come on, ball park a number.

Because the longer we wait, the value of that asset continues to drop.

 

 

So what you have is a perceived value prior to the season. That is not actual value. Just because something is shiny and looks like gold, doesn't mean it's gold.

That perceived value also assumes all of Sammy Watkins production issues were related to the organization and how he was used (TT was his QB, run heavy scheme, etc)

But a funny thing happened. He got traded. He's now the 3-4 WR. The foot is no longer the issue. Where's the production?

 

 

Your point is still moot. You assume Sammy's value could only go up. Your entire assumption of increased value is based on a belief that somehow Sammy's production would increase if he stayed here.

And that somehow, the Bills would be 5-0.

Mind you, this is with Taylor still being his QB, and Taylor is supposedly one of the reasons why Sammy's numbers suck to begin with. Feel free to explain how that works.

 

What if the Bills already concluded Sammy's production was not going to go up, because the biggest issue with Sammy is Sammy himself.

That it wasn't the QB, or the scheme, or the injury.

So if you are the Bills, what are your choices?

Keep him and play him, hoping a contract year would somehow put Sammys head on straight? (Well we already know the answer to that one)

Keep him and play him, revealing to the rest of the league the problem really might be Sammy himself? (kinda beginning to look that way)

Or capitalize on that perceived value and trade him.

 

Remember that old axiom: If a deal sounds to good to be true, it probably isn't. Well, if a team is willing to take peanuts for an "elite" WR ...

 

Pssst... you can calm down, Watkins isn't on the Bills anymore.

Seriously why the worry by so many who don't like Sammy Watkins? Why bother following a guy you don't like. Personally I find it rather hilarious, it doesn't bother me . I find it curious though. Watkins was my favorite player on the Bills. I watch Rams games because I like the player . I hate the Patriots, so I don't watch their games save for a couple involving the Bills or the odd team that I think might beat them. I don't follow players I don't like. It seems very odd. Just my opinion.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

Some of you guys crack me up. Sammy is elite. Whether you like his personality or not is irrelevant. He was way underutilized in Buffalo because of the ground n pound philosophy along with a mediocre risk adverse qb. Now the Rams braintrust are making the same mistakes. Mark my words Sammy will land somewhere where he's featured.

Already has

 

https://www.sammywatkinsnfl.com/

What's Kyle Williams website?

[bobobonators]

No man, his serial defenders are too invested in him to admit that they were probably wrong. The excuse train will go on through the season into the next if need be.

 

It's always someone else's fault. First it was TT, then it was the coaches fault for not targeting him more often, then it was the injuries, then it was him being forced to play with injuries, then it was him being traded and not having enough time to learn the playbook, then it was because he's the only elite WR to be used as a decoy week in and week out, now it's because of Goff.

 

Do you see a pattern here?

From what i read here, the only thing TT needed to become an elite WR was a "real qb". Now he has a fancy 1st overall pick at QB and hes producing less than he did here.