Fans burning their NFL apparel on social media...

[mannc]

sure, I'd be glad to offer my perspective, understanding that yours might be different. here's what I wrote that should answer your question:

 

I'm all for the right to protest and agree with the historical perspective offered... Where we probably disagree is the time/place and venue for the protest.

 

 

As for admirable protesting, no, I don't think it's particularly admirable for professional athletes to protest at work, or for that matter, I don't expect the Walmart greeter to hand me fliers in the aisle, nor my dentist to talk to me about the needs for whitey to band together when I'm getting my choppers cleaned. To be blunt--I think it's an insult to Ghandi, Rosa Parks, Jackie Robinson and MLK to compare the two. Take all this stuff outside, I feel (mostly) different.

 

One step further. I differentiate between protestors. I feel it's my right as an American. I'm perfectly comfortable thinking CK is an insufferable jacka$$ for cops are pigs, and tossing on mighty t shirts you buy at a retro clothing shop of famous revolutionaries and el presidentes who likely would ask him "Hey, dude, ain't you worth like $20 m, wtf are you doing here?". That's just me though.

The bolded part is not what I took issue with in your previous post, and the rest of what you've said here is pretty reasonable, although I disagree with a lot of it. What I believe is particularly misguided in your original post is the notion that these athletes should just shut up and be grateful because they have a lot of money. You didn't really address that point.

[HardyBoy]

Does the endowing a piece of cloth with personified values and bowing before it remind anyone else of the false idols Moses smashed and caused people to wander in a desert for 40 years until all the guilty grew old and died?

 

Also, standing at attention for 2 minutes while a song plays and a flag waves once a week does not absolve any sins or remove the fact that a person acted in an un-American way (stepping on other's inalienable rights, by somehow thinking theirs are more important than any other American's, for example).

 

I love this country, my family escaped the soviet union in the 60s and 70s, having lost basically everyone in WWII. My grandfather served 9 years in a siberian labor camp for saying communism couldn't work because of human nature, to the wrong person. As they dreamed of a place to see their children raise their grandchildren in freedom, they did not dream of a flag. They dreamed of ideals. That is America, ideals of the highest order. Not a piece of cloth that we endow as an idol.

 

I understand everyone might not share my opinion, and the flag might be how they express those ideals, but to those people I challenge that American ideals are so much larger than even a flag that covers an entire football field. I just ask that you take some time to reflect that potentially you may be limited in your ability to honor those ideals with a symbol incapable of holding all of them.

Edited September 27, 2017 by HardyBoy

[Malazan]

LMAO

 

People are sop blinded by faux patriotism...

 

Hey, don't be talkin' sh*t bout my faux patriotism. I'll be as faux patriotic as I damn well please. You just try to come and take my faux patriotism. Me n Old Betsy will teach you a thing or too if'n you try to step one foot on me ole faux patriotism. This nation was founded on faux patriotism so if you don't like faux patriotism then leave..your house and get some ice cream!

[KollegeStudnet]

Still think that the majority of these videos I've watched fly a conferderate flag in front of their houses. Just saying. 🤷‍♀️

Edited September 27, 2017 by KollegeStudnet

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

The bolded part is not what I took issue with in your previous post, and the rest of what you've said here is pretty reasonable, although I disagree with a lot of it. What I believe is particularly misguided in your original post is the notion that these athletes should just shut up and be grateful because they have a lot of money. You didn't really address that point.

 

Well, it seems to me you asked for clarification, I offered it and then you followed up asking me to address a point I never made. Let me try it this way:

 

I agree with you that people have the right to protest, but I think they should not protest in NFL Stadiums or in conjunction with their employment. I don't think comparing athletes in a football stadium to civil rights advocates marching on Selma is a valid comparison.

[Fan in San Diego]

 

Well, it seems to me you asked for clarification, I offered it and then you followed up asking me to address a point I never made. Let me try it this way:

 

I agree with you that people have the right to protest, but I think they should not protest in NFL Stadiums or in conjunction with their employment. I don't think comparing athletes in a football stadium to civil rights advocates marching on Selma is a valid comparison.

Maybe I missed it, but did anyone make that comparison?

[eball]

So, we can make fun of these people displaying their rights

 

Yes. I thought that was pretty clear from my post.

So...what's the big deal? I burned my Rob Johnson jersey...

 

It would've been weirder if you didn't.

Edited September 27, 2017 by eball

[GG]

Maybe I missed it, but did anyone make that comparison?

 

Up the thread

[boyst]

 

Yes. I thought that was pretty clear from my post.

 

 

It would've been weirder if you didn't.

k, good. Can we make fun of the ones kneeling?

[mannc]

Well, it seems to me you asked for clarification, I offered it and then you followed up asking me to address a point I never made. Let me try it this way:

 

I agree with you that people have the right to protest, but I think they should not protest in NFL Stadiums or in conjunction with their employment. I don't think comparing athletes in a football stadium to civil rights advocates marching on Selma is a valid comparison.

This is the part of your original post that I took issue with, the part where you suggest that the players' protest is not legitimate because they have lots of money and that they should just shut up and be grateful that we have allowed them their good fortune:

 

"Ghandi did not pull up in his $108,000 Mercedes to his private parking spot outside a billion dollar stadium, walk into his tastefully appointed locker room to put on the uniform left in his locker by an attendant, stroll out into a stadium filled with paying customers and take a knee on fake grass infused with shredded tennis balls and crested to account for proper drainage with a team of highly paid physicians nearby to tend to his every need as needed."

 

Feel free to explain that part of your post.

[dubs]

They see it as an attack on their values because they are told to see it that way by their favorite media outlets.

 

I find it curious that those who complain about values the loudest seem to care the least about those same values of life and liberty being denied to certain groups of people.

Please explain how groups of people are being denied life and liberty. Some statistics would help. I think that would help the discussion instead of just referencing a political position that can just as easily be dismissed with a political position on the other side of the coin.

[JohnC]

This is the part of your original post that I took issue with, the part where you suggest that the players' protest is not legitimate because they have lots of money and that they should just shut up and be grateful that we have allowed them their good fortune:

 

The claim that players should be happy with the privilege of playing makes no sense. They earned the right to play through years of hard work and dedication. Nothing was given to them. They have accepted the injury and health risks and know that they will probably not leave the game unscathed. They earned the right to make it in a profession where the odds are miniscule to get to that level because they worked so hard. Nothing was given to them.

 

I don't want to get political here but the same people who are upset with someone demonstrating their beliefs by kneeling, which is their right to do so, are less offended when the leader of the country doesn't unequivocally condemn neo-nazis and klansmen spouting anti-semtic slogans.

 

If

[CountDorkula]

Athletes are nothing more than entertainers. They can protest all they want. Kneeling/sitting/stretching during the National Anthem is of huge disrespect. The display on Sunday was nothing more than privileged millionaires throwing a tantrum because a privileged billionaire said some mean things. I don't even think anyone remembers what the original protest was.

 

As for being a mouth breather, I am college educated, live in one of the most liberal/progressive cities in the nation, vote straight libertarian and am practically an anarchist in my philosophies on how government should operate, and I turned off the TV and removed my Bills gear at home and at work. I've put up with 3-13 seasons of Rob Johnson and never felt so apathetic as I did on Sunday.

 

The product is unwatchable, the league has been mired in scandal for years, the health effects (and coverups) of CTE are now fully out in the open. My sons will never play football, and I will probably never watch the Bills or any other NFL team again. The death spiral was already there, this was the final push to irrelevance. No I will not be posting again. Yes, I realize no one cares. Good day.

 

 

You could have summed up your post with "Dance monkey dance" and the same point would have been made.

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

This is the part of your original post that I took issue with, the part where you suggest that the players' protest is not legitimate because they have lots of money and that they should just shut up and be grateful that we have allowed them their good fortune:

 

"Ghandi did not pull up in his $108,000 Mercedes to his private parking spot outside a billion dollar stadium, walk into his tastefully appointed locker room to put on the uniform left in his locker by an attendant, stroll out into a stadium filled with paying customers and take a knee on fake grass infused with shredded tennis balls and crested to account for proper drainage with a team of highly paid physicians nearby to tend to his every need as needed."

 

Feel free to explain that part of your post.

 

You kids and your fidget spinners.

 

I started with:

 

I'm all for the right to protest and agree with the historical perspective offered. Where we probably disagree is the time/place and venue for the protest

 

Then I offered the comparison between Ghandi's venue and a typical NFL protestors venue. I changed the font to bold in your latest email.

 

Then when you were still confused, I said:

 

Well, it seems to me you asked for clarification, I offered it and then you followed up asking me to address a point I never made.

 

Now, I've explained it twice and you still come back to players shutting up because they have money, and the only person who actually typed those words is you. So what I'm saying is, either you have innocently missed that point on consecutive occasions, or you are a rabble rouser. Either way is fine with me.

[Kelly the Dog]

The claim that players should be happy with the privilege of playing makes no sense. They earned the right to play through years of hard work and dedication. Nothing was given to them. They have accepted the injury and health risks and know that they will probably not leave the game unscathed. They earned the right to make it in a profession where the odds are miniscule to get to that level because they worked so hard. Nothing was given to them.

 

Thank you. That line of reasoning always burns me. Those guys literally kill themselves "to play a kid's game." I doubt more than a few out of every hundred fans that say crap like that could take one hit from a charging linebacker.

[eball]

k, good. Can we make fun of the ones kneeling?

 

If a player was kneeling during the anthem but then lost his balance and toppled over, that would be funny.

 

Otherwise -- umm, no.

[JohnC]

Thank you. That line of reasoning always burns me. Those guys literally kill themselves "to play a kid's game." I doubt more than a few out of every hundred fans that say crap like that could take one hit from a charging linebacker.

I understand why people get upset over the kneeling and display during the anthem. But the insincere patriots are not so outraged when people who are expressing their views in certain venues are getting their faces punched in because their views differ from theirs. The same people who are less offended with neo-nazis and white surpremacis demonstrating and chanting anti-Semitic slogans are outraged with players who are peacefully demonstrating for their beliefs.

 

Make no mistake for the president and many of his followers this isn't about expressing one's views as it is about exploiting the racial divide in this country. This call to patriotism was done at the podium of a white Dixie crowd in Alabama where the underpinning of their politics is race.

[dubs]

I understand why people get upset over the kneeling and display during the anthem. But the insincere patriots are not so outraged when people who are expressing their views in certain venues are getting their faces punched in because their views differ from theirs. The same people who are less offended with neo-nazis and white surpremacis demonstrating and chanting anti-Semitic slogans are outraged with players who are peacefully demonstrating for their beliefs.

 

Make no mistake for the president and many of his followers this isn't about expressing one's views as it is about exploiting the racial divide in this country. This call to patriotism was done at the podium of a white Dixie crowd in Alabama where the underpinning of their politics is race.

What on earth are you talking about?

 

Do you have some special knowledge that can tell you what's in people's hearts and minds?

 

Neo-Nazis? A despicable group of people who want total government control. Yes. Not too different than Antifa and these other radical groups who essentially want to same form of government just implemented in a slightly different way.

 

No post would be complete without a underhanded insult to the south. Trifecta!

[Fan in San Diego]

I understand why people get upset over the kneeling and display during the anthem. But the insincere patriots are not so outraged when people who are expressing their views in certain venues are getting their faces punched in because their views differ from theirs. The same people who are less offended with neo-nazis and white surpremacis demonstrating and chanting anti-Semitic slogans are outraged with players who are peacefully demonstrating for their beliefs.

 

Make no mistake for the president and many of his followers this isn't about expressing one's views as it is about exploiting the racial divide in this country. This call to patriotism was done at the podium of a white Dixie crowd in Alabama where the underpinning of their politics is race.

Are you saying Trump should put on a white pointy hat? And call himself the grand wizard?

[dwight in philly]

Jesus. doesnt this sh-t ever stop