Kelly the Dog Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 You can act immature and like you want to use words or put them in my mouth and you would be wrong. You have no clue the sacrifices I have made for that flag and this country. Dont push it. You are correct. That changes nothing. Actually I was very curious and very serious. I asked a simple question of you. Then another one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill_with_it Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 If they were fighting for the flag, they didn't understand their oath very well, did they? That wasnt the question Tom. No one here is saying that we arent protecting the constitution, I was asked what the flag means to mean. My response is words cant do it justices, similarly I share the same view on my requirements to support and defend the constitution, along with bearing true faith and ALLEGIENCE to the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numark3 Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 This is absolutely not true. I have pals that have died for the flag. You and Bill Hicks know nothing about what the flag is or isnt to the military. Why can't you understand that the flag means different things to different people. And if it means XYZ to you, and someone doesn't stand up for the flag, that doesn't mean anything about XYZ to them. That is literally projecting your beliefs on to someone else, and then taking it a step further, saying they disrespect your beliefs. The flag means very little to me, oh well. Guess what, the flag and national anthem mean something different to black people. Go look up what Jackie Robinson once said about the flag and anthem. Coming directly from slaves will do that to someone. So you need to understand different people see different things in the flag and anthem. Doesn't make them right or wrong. Just respect their right to protest and don't project stuff on anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill_with_it Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 Actually I was very curious and very serious. I asked a simple question of you. Then another one.No you didnt. After you recieved a response of Words cant do it justice, you responded immature and stated so nothing. Its clear your intentions are to troll. Thats fine. You can troll away but Im not going to be apart of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 That wasnt the question Tom. No one here is saying that we arent protecting the constitution, I was asked what the flag means to mean. My response is words cant do it justices, similarly I share the same view on my requirements to support and defend the constitution, along with bearing true faith and ALLEGIENCE to the same. You said they died for the flag. They did not. They died for the Constitution, which specifies a system of government that by specific design allows the people to assemble, petition for grievances, and protest that government. That includes not just kneeling for the National Anthem, but burning the American flag (side note: I can't wait for an NFL player to try that on the field during the anthem.) And yes, I understand what the flag "means." Nobody raised a copy of the Constitution on Iwo Jima. But I think the real question here is: why are you disrespecting your buddies' memories by arguing against the exercise of the rights that they took an oath to preserve, and died for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 ALLEGIANCE to the same. The Bill of Rights are the first ten amendments to the Constitution. Wouldn't that make allegiance to the First Amendment something to defend? Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof, or abridging the freedom of speech or of the press, or the right of the people peaceably to assemble and to petition the government for a redress of grievances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wakingfane Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 (edited) You said they died for the flag. They did not. They died for the Constitution, which specifies a system of government that by specific design allows the people to assemble, petition for grievances, and protest that government. That includes not just kneeling for the National Anthem, but burning the American flag (side note: I can't wait for an NFL player to try that on the field during the anthem.) And yes, I understand what the flag "means." Nobody raised a copy of the Constitution on Iwo Jima. But I think the real question here is: why are you disrespecting your buddies' memories by arguing against the exercise of the rights that they took an oath to preserve, and died for? Hallelujah!! A few thoughts: 1. I don't agree with Kaepernick's thesis but fully support his right to express his opinion and his right to protest, as I respect the right for anyone to protest whether it be fellow NFL players or Jim Kelly or Shady or skin head Neo-Nazis. I don't have to agree with your view or how you do it (I don't like what Shady did) but I'd hate even more being in a society where you can't protest at all. 2. The flag to me represents not just the military but our country and its values. And the key value is the freedom and rights we have guaranteed under the Constitution. If the flag stands for anything it stands for those rights. I have read enough pro and con comments from ex-military to know there is no universal belief by the military. So I think the idea that the military is being specifically disrespected is not well informed, as has been pointed out by the players taking the action. 3. I will always stand, take my hat off, and put my hand in my chest when the anthem is played. But I'm hypocritical because I don't do that in private. And if I see a veteran I will always thank him for serving. Because his or her service lets me enjoy the freedoms I and others have. Including the freedom to stand for the anthem or not. 4. I respect having the courage to take a stand at personal cost. I think Kaepernick is way off base but he has the courage of his convictions. I applaud the courage of Villenueva not only for his service but for being the only Steeler to step out for the anthem yesterday. 5. Our rights do not come with a dollar sign; they are guaranteed by the constitution. Football players have as much right to protest as did Rosa Parks. So spare me the stuff about why millionaire football players should just shut up and play. 6. Owners need to decide what they want their employees to do. The vast majority apparently think the players should express their views through this form of peaceful protest. I'd rather the owners restrict these protests by keeping teams in the locker room during the anthem, and by making sure some of their profits are used to help their regions deal with issues being debated (and some profits are). And if owners decide they want their players to stand during the anthem since that would be a job related function, then players should comply or look for other employment. Such are the perks of ownership 6. The president? He simply does not understand our constitution and what freedoms are within, nor does he understand the role of the president. I want to see some of his proposals on infrastructure, tax policy and trade enacted. But I don't need a guy who has mistreated women, veterans, minorities, gay and lesbian individuals, and anyone he happens not to like in the moment lecturing me or anyone on values. He forfeited any credibility on values or morality years ago. Absolutely! I suppose I could have foregone my rant and just quoted oldman Edited September 25, 2017 by wakingfane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Putin Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 A revolt? Is that what you conservative snowflakes think this is? Good Lord.Here we go !!!! ( you conservetives snowflakes ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 No you didnt. After you recieved a response of Words cant do it justice, you responded immature and stated so nothing. Its clear your intentions are to troll. Thats fine. You can troll away but Im not going to be apart of it. I will admit my answer was overly snarky for no good reason and I apologize and retract it. I was very serious, however, with my two questions. I was also a huge fan of Bill Hicks, who was a brilliant guy and brilliantly funny, who often made people uncomfortable with his provocative musings and performance. Here we go !!!! ( you conservetives snowflakes ) Please leave our board and go back to running our country, Putin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChevyVanMiller Posted September 25, 2017 Share Posted September 25, 2017 Former Bill Mike Lodish had this to say on the subject on FB: What a disgrace to all that have served our country. To see the NFL players boycott the National Anthem because of THEIR OWN ISSUES WITH racism. I have news for you you protesting punks, there have been men and women of all types of color and race that have lost their lives because they chose to defend your way of life. You have not only **** on those hero's but you have disrespected our constitution, rights and various freedoms. I was fortunate to have been given the opport...unity to play in the NFL and have been fortunate to have played in the biggest show of them all, The Super Bowl, six times and let me tell you this, there isn't a day that has gone by where I wouldn't stand for our anthem, to show those families of all colors mind you, that have been associated with the military in some way, the gratitude and thanks for what they and their families have done for the USA. May god watch over all of you and God bless America! Goodnight! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 Former Bill Mike Lodish had this to say on the subject on FB: What a disgrace to all that have served our country. To see the NFL players boycott the National Anthem because of THEIR OWN ISSUES WITH racism. I have news for you you protesting punks, there have been men and women of all types of color and race that have lost their lives because they chose to defend your way of life. You have not only **** on those hero's but you have disrespected our constitution, rights and various freedoms. I was fortunate to have been given the opport...unity to play in the NFL and have been fortunate to have played in the biggest show of them all, The Super Bowl, six times and let me tell you this, there isn't a day that has gone by where I wouldn't stand for our anthem, to show those families of all colors mind you, that have been associated with the military in some way, the gratitude and thanks for what they and their families have done for the USA. May god watch over all of you and God bless America! Goodnight! He doesn't understand the Constitution at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 Well that's what makes America great. People can agree and disagree on any subject/topic they want. Unless you think BLM is full of ****. You're not allowed to think that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincec Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 I agree with Kelly. McCoy was ove the top. He went beyond protesting was basically saying that he can do whatever he wants during the anthem, whether it’s stretching, talking to some friends or taking a dump. Whatever. It certainly stood out. I had two friends specifically call his behavior out at the start of the game and in today’s press conference McDermott was hit with questions specifically about Shady as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domdab99 Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 Guys, the players aren't protesting the flag. Or the Anthem. Rosa Parks wasn't protesting against the damn bus. While on a hunger strike, Gandhi wasn't protesting food. It's the injustice they are protesting. Duh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Things Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 USA! USA! USA! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincec Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 (edited) Guys, the players aren't protesting the flag. Or the Anthem. Rosa Parks wasn't protesting against the damn bus. While on a hunger strike, Gandhi wasn't protesting food. It's the injustice they are protesting. Duh. Everyone gets this. But why did they chose this way to protest? Because they know that it is offensive and will piss off (and therefore get the attention of) a lot of people. So, yes, it is offensive by specific intent. I dont think youd be seeing whats going on today if they wrote letters to their congressmen or something mundane like that. Like when the draft and war protesters burned American flags in the 60s. Edited September 26, 2017 by vincec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elite Poster Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 Equating this protest to something against the military is like saying Rosa Parks sat down to reform public transportation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domdab99 Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 Everyone gets this. But why did they chose this way to protest? Because they know that it is offensive and will piss off (and therefore get the attention of) a lot of people. So, yes, it is offensive by specific intent. I don’t think you’d be seeing what’s going on today if they wrote letters to their congressmen or something mundane like that. I don't think they do all get it. They have chosen this way to protest because it is visible, peaceful, and effective. Writing their respective Congressmen does not get their point across to the masses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincec Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 I don't think they do all get it. They have chosen this way to protest because it is visible, peaceful, and effective. Writing their respective Congressmen does not get their point across to the masses. And offensive. You keep leaving that out... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Things Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 Everyone gets this. But why did they chose this way to protest? Because they know that it is offensive and will piss off (and therefore get the attention of) a lot of people. So, yes, it is offensive by specific intent. I dont think youd be seeing whats going on today if they wrote letters to their congressmen or something mundane like that. Like when the draft and war protesters burned American flags in the 60s. Yesterdays protest was directly towards idiot Trump to STFU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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