Wayne Cubed Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 (edited) I read the article and it said what I said, with a direct quote from Satan about it. We are arguing semantics though. I understand what you are saying. And as Coach Tuesday remarked, there are various definitions or understandings of "scheme," especially when it comes to Satan. I just think he has a distinct scheme and looks for guys that fit it. He had Walker and then drafted Edelman to play that role and when one of them was hurt looked for Amendola to do it. He drafts or signs these offensive linemen that fits his scheme that come out of nowhere and play well. He has Gronk and Hernandez and loses Hernandez and signs Bennett and loses Bennett and signs Allen. I agree with you in the offensive side of the ball, for sure. I think that has more to do with Brady. With the defense he's much much more fluid and adaptable to the talent he has. Edited August 28, 2017 by Wayne Cubed
DDD Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 Rex has coached alot of great LB's in his time and was enamored with Ragland before the injury. Either Ryan was blowing smoke up his ass or he's not recovered from his injury. Either way, a 4th round pick is basically giving him away. I do not like this move.
vincec Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 2019 pick isn't great but honestly I'm surprised they got that for him considering that he would very likely have been cut and available for nothing in a few weeks.
CommonCents Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 Rex has coached alot of great LB's in his time and was enamored with Ragland before the injury. Either Ryan was blowing smoke up his ass or he's not recovered from his injury. Either way, a 4th round pick is basically giving him away. I do not like this move. It's Rex. Blowing smoke is what he does best.
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 (edited) All 3-4 teams also play 4-3, some of them more than half the plays depending on how many passes the other teams tend to throw. .....so why is it a staunch "either or" proposition?....I understand and agree with your concept of hybrid looks.....doesn't a kid coming out as a "4-3 only" or a "3-4 only" type severely limit his attractiveness?...isn't it incumbent on coaching to develop hybrid looks?......what did I miss?............. Edited August 28, 2017 by OldTimeAFLGuy
Kelly the Dog Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 I agree with you in the offensive side of the ball, for sure. I think that has more to do with Brady. With the defense he's much much more fluid and adaptable to the talent he has. There are a bunch of ways to do it. There are coaches that have a great scheme and find guys who play well in that scheme. There are coaches that have a flexible scheme and are great at adapting to fit the talents of their players. And both of those ways have 5x as many guys who do the same thing they do but suck at it. Satan there is no one like. No one knows or coaches both sides of the ball like he does. No one plays GM like he does. He's an anomaly.
Coach Tuesday Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 (edited) There are a bunch of ways to do it. There are coaches that have a great scheme and find guys who play well in that scheme. There are coaches that have a flexible scheme and are great at adapting to fit the talents of their players. And both of those ways have 5x as many guys who do the same thing they do but suck at it. Satan there is no one like. No one knows or coaches both sides of the ball like he does. No one plays GM like he does. He's an anomaly. I'm trying to think of another NFL example of a new and inexperienced/unproven GM/coach combo that came in, installed brand new schemes on both sides of the ball, traded away a group of young, purportedly talented players at a discount, and then made it to their second contracts. I'm at a loss but perhaps there are examples out there... anyone? Edited August 28, 2017 by Coach Tuesday
Wayne Cubed Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 There are a bunch of ways to do it. There are coaches that have a great scheme and find guys who play well in that scheme. There are coaches that have a flexible scheme and are great at adapting to fit the talents of their players. And both of those ways have 5x as many guys who do the same thing they do but suck at it. Satan there is no one like. No one knows or coaches both sides of the ball like he does. No one plays GM like he does. He's an anomaly. To my eyes, there are more guys attached to their scheme. Rex was, McD seems to be. And even if you look around the NFL I think more coaches are stuck in their ways.
Kelly the Dog Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 .....so why is it a staunch "either or" proposition?....I understand and agree with your concept of hybrid looks.....doesn't a kid coming out as a "4-3 only" or a "3-4 only" type severely limit his attractiveness?...isn't it incumbent on coaching to develop hybrid looks?......what did I miss?............. There are only so many players at certain positions that can do both well and be above average starters at both. DT, DE, and LB are positions it matters the most. Obviously certain QBs operate better in West Coast versus Pro Style offenses. WR and TE it doesn't matter as much. Surely some CBs are good at zone but not man, or man but not zone. Certain S are good in the box but not out of the box. Certain OL are better at zone blocking than power blocking, or run versus pass. Not a lot of players in the NFL are great no matter what scheme they play. Surely some are but not more than a few per team.
GoBills808 Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 Yes thats true but he's not precious to his scheme. He gets value for his players. Really good value in fact and then adjust his scheme to what he has. Sometimes he does, it's true. Other times he trades one of my favorite NFL players in Jamie Collins for a 4th round pick, and Collins>>>>>>>>>>>Ragland.
Kelly the Dog Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 I'm trying to think of another NFL example of a new and inexperienced/unproven GM/coach combo that came in, installed brand new schemes on both sides of the ball, traded away a group of young, purportedly talented players at a discount, and then made it to their second contracts. I'm at a loss but perhaps there are examples out there... anyone? Probably not. Like I said, I don't like any of the trades. Maybe Schneider and Carroll in Seattle.
Augie Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 To their credit, the guys designing and calling the offense last year seemed willing to work with the skills they had rather than force the round peg into the square hole.
YoloinOhio Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 (edited) Sometimes he does, it's true. Other times he trades one of my favorite NFL players in Jamie Collins for a 4th round pick, and Collins>>>>>>>>>>>Ragland.yep because he had some issues and was going to be a FA and he didn't want to pay him. Picked Dontae Hightower over him. Forgot he only got a 4th. Browns gave him a ton of money to sign there long term Edited August 28, 2017 by YoloinOhio
Kelly the Dog Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 To my eyes, there are more guys attached to their scheme. Rex was, McD seems to be. And even if you look around the NFL I think more coaches are stuck in their ways. Yup. And there aren't a lot of consistently good coaches. It's like QBing. There are only about 10-12 guys on the planet that do it consistently well.
GoBills808 Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 yep because he had some issues and was going to be a FA and he didn't want to pay him. Picked Dontae Hightower over him. Forgot he only got a 4th. Browns gave him a ton of money to sign there long term Different circumstances it's true, but let's not act like this is something unheard of. I'm trying to think of another NFL example of a new and inexperienced/unproven GM/coach combo that came in, installed brand new schemes on both sides of the ball, traded away a group of young, purportedly talented players at a discount, and then made it to their second contracts. I'm at a loss but perhaps there are examples out there... anyone? Those are pretty specific parameters.
Wayne Cubed Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 Different circumstances it's true, but let's not act like this is something unheard of. Those are pretty specific parameters. The traded away are the specific parameters because it rarely happens. The young coach and young gm coming in has happened, a lot in fact. And changing schemes. They just tent not to jettison young, good players. That puts a lot of presser on drafting.
BillsVet Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 It's beginning to look more like year zero of a rebuild than year 1. Cushioning the tear-down and not bottoming out is looking less likely now. At least the Bills are giving their fans plenty of other former Bills to watch this season: Gilmore, Gillislee, Watkins, Darby, Ragland, Woods, Goodwin, and others.
oldmanfan Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 Aren't we overreacting just a bit to trading a guy that was running on the third team?
Kelly the Dog Posted August 28, 2017 Posted August 28, 2017 It's beginning to look more like year zero of a rebuild than year 1. Cushioning the tear-down and not bottoming out is looking less likely now. At least the Bills are giving their fans plenty of other former Bills to watch this season: Gilmore, Gillislee, Watkins, Darby, Ragland, Woods, Goodwin, and others. Somehow that seems like a better team than we have.
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