Over 29 years of fanhood Posted August 31, 2017 Posted August 31, 2017 (edited) Exhibit A (A for Andrew luck) in the argument exposing the futility of the tank. Edited August 31, 2017 by Over 29 years of fanhood
HappyDays Posted August 31, 2017 Posted August 31, 2017 If Luck were on this team in our division we would still not make the playoffs. If Tyrod were on the Colts in that division they would also be the same. I don't believe either QB is good enough to put a team on their back and take them to the playoffs or a super bowl because both have proven they are not. Both need a strong supporting cast, that is a fact. Exactly. Luck is better than Tyrod but he isn't so much better that you'd take on his contract for 4 1st round picks. That would be incredibly stupid. You trade that many picks for a Brees, Rodgers, or Brady. That's it. The 'excuses' are valid for Luck and not for Taylor. I'm sorry if that doesn't seem fair to you, but that's just how it is. With a great running game, competent offensive line and a #1 WR, Luck is probably the best QB in the league and Taylor is 7-9 with some of the worst passing stats in the NFL. So actually yes, you CAN make excuses for one and not the other when the evidence clearly suggests one QB would outperform the other if their circumstances were equal. It's not that hard to understand, and at this point I can only assume the two of you are being deliberately obtuse. It would help if you understood what people were saying. The part I bolded - no one is saying that isn't true. What jasovon said, that's my position.
JM2009 Posted August 31, 2017 Posted August 31, 2017 (edited) The 'excuses' are valid for Luck and not for Taylor. I'm sorry if that doesn't seem fair to you, but that's just how it is. With a great running game, competent offensive line and a #1 WR, Luck is probably the best QB in the league and Taylor is 7-9 with some of the worst passing stats in the NFL. So actually yes, you CAN make excuses for one and not the other when the evidence clearly suggests one QB would outperform the other if their circumstances were equal. It's not that hard to understand, and at this point I can only assume the two of you are being deliberately obtuse. First it's 7-8. Second it should have been 8-8. TT played very well that Miami game. Third the running game was even that much better because of TT. He has to be accounted for. Fourth Watkins missed a lot of time in 2016 and played injured....Luck is a better QB, no doubt, but in 2015 Watkins and TT put up very good numbers. The offense and scoring has not been the main problem the last two seasons. The defense and poor game day coaching was...Both QBs need good supporting casts around them. Nothing wrong with that. Most QBs do. Edited August 31, 2017 by JM2009
Jasovon Posted August 31, 2017 Posted August 31, 2017 Exactly. Luck is better than Tyrod but he isn't so much better that you'd take on his contract for 4 1st round picks. That would be incredibly stupid. You trade that many picks for a Brees, Rodgers, or Brady. That's it. It would help if you understood what people were saying. The part I bolded - no one is saying that isn't true. What jasovon said, that's my position. To be honesy i wouldn't trade for Brees at this point, he's not great playing outside and is getting on in age. Brady or Rodgers though agreed.
JM2009 Posted August 31, 2017 Posted August 31, 2017 To be honesy i wouldn't trade for Brees at this point, he's not great playing outside and is getting on in age. Brady or Rodgers though agreed. How much time does Brady really have left, though?
GoBills808 Posted August 31, 2017 Posted August 31, 2017 Exactly. Luck is better than Tyrod but he isn't so much better that you'd take on his contract for 4 1st round picks. That would be incredibly stupid. You trade that many picks for a Brees, Rodgers, or Brady. That's it. It would help if you understood what people were saying. The part I bolded - no one is saying that isn't true. What jasovon said, that's my position. Luck has already taken a team to the playoffs on his back, three times. Only the 2014 Colts were even a halfway decent team, and that team was far less talented than the 2016 Bills.
JM2009 Posted August 31, 2017 Posted August 31, 2017 (edited) Luck has already taken a team to the playoffs on his back, three times. Only the 2014 Colts were even a halfway decent team, and that team was far less talented than the 2016 Bills. And again, if the Bills were in that division they could have won it-esp in 2015. The 2016 Bills were an average team. that's it.And very poorly coached.The Bills with TT went 3-0 against that division in 2015, including a W against Luck and the Colts. Edited August 31, 2017 by JM2009
Alphadawg7 Posted August 31, 2017 Posted August 31, 2017 Alphadawg didn't say Luck and Tyrod suffer from the same deficiencies. He said, correctly, that people make the same excuses for their losses. Look in this thread. People saying Luck has a bad offensive line, bad coaching, bad defense, subpar offensive talent... Where have I seen this before? And people like you say these excuses don't count for Tyrod. Now of course these excuses are stronger for Luck - his offensive line is worse than Tyrod's, his defense is worse than Tyrod's, I'd say the offensive talent is about a wash but Tyrod has the far better running game. Coaching is a wash and Luck has had the easier schedule. Clearly there is a relationship between teams and QB performance but certain posters only apply that relationship when talking about QBs that don't play for the Bills. It's just funny to see the excuses pile up for Luck. Of course they are valid excuses, anyone can see Luck is good enough to take a good team to the Super Bowl. But there are valid excuses for Tyrod too. And saying you'd trade 4 1st round picks for a QB who has not shown he is elite at any point, who has abysmal stats in the 1st quarter, who throws too many picks, is ridiculous. It's much more ridiculous than anything Alphadawg has said and it tells me you don't really know how to build a team. Well Said
Alphadawg7 Posted August 31, 2017 Posted August 31, 2017 Luck made the playoffs more in his first 5 years than Rodgers did. Playing in what was seen as one of the worst divisions in football during those 3 playoff appearances. You can't compare the situation equally...How about you look at Rodgers first 3 postseasons, and see what QB performed better when it mattered most? Hint: Not even close. Tebow has a better postseason resume than Luck lmao
JM2009 Posted August 31, 2017 Posted August 31, 2017 Playing in what was seen as one of the worst divisions in football during those 3 playoff appearances. You can't compare the situation equally...How about you look at Rodgers first 3 postseasons, and see what QB performed better when it mattered most? Hint: Not even close. Tebow has a better postseason resume than Luck lmao Like I said, the Bills could have won Luck's division in 2015. TT and the Bills were 3-0 against the division.
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted August 31, 2017 Posted August 31, 2017 I'm hoping they put Luck on ice for the year...that way, there'll be a team picking ahead of us who doesn't need a QB.
GoBills808 Posted August 31, 2017 Posted August 31, 2017 We deserve Tyrod Taylor. You guys have convinced me.
BringBackOrton Posted August 31, 2017 Posted August 31, 2017 (edited) Playing in what was seen as one of the worst divisions in football during those 3 playoff appearances. You can't compare the situation equally...How about you look at Rodgers first 3 postseasons, and see what QB performed better when it mattered most? Hint: Not even close. Tebow has a better postseason resume than Luck lmao Luck had to beat Denver to go to the AFCCG. That Denver team won the SB the year after. #resume Luck was so good he didn't sit on the bench for 3 seasons. You guys hold that against him. LMAO. Edited August 31, 2017 by jmc12290
HappyDays Posted August 31, 2017 Posted August 31, 2017 Luck has already taken a team to the playoffs on his back, three times. Only the 2014 Colts were even a halfway decent team, and that team was far less talented than the 2016 Bills. In 2014, by DVOA, the Colts had the 7th easiest schedule. They beat up on the Titans, Texans, and Jaguars. They lost games against the good teams they went against. Now where have I heard people saying a certain team led by a certain QB have only beaten bad teams? And their defense that year was ranked 13th, again by DVOA. That's better than "halfway decent." Their offense that year was only 17th! Their pass rank was 13th. And that was 3 years ago. Maybe Luck's tendencies have been figured out a bit? His stats have gotten woese. He is one of the worst 1st quarter QBs in the game. He puts his team in holes and sometimes he's able to make it up. Which part of this is so impressive that any team would give up 4 1st round picks? Give up that much for Luck on a rookie contract, maybe. On his current contract that's a laughable position to hold. You're better off using those picks on 2 top 1st round QBs in conjunction with some 2nds and 3rds. You can say Luck is better than Tyrod without being ridiculous.
JM2009 Posted August 31, 2017 Posted August 31, 2017 We deserve Tyrod Taylor. You guys have convinced me. No one who supports him as ever said he is the long term answer.
GoBills808 Posted August 31, 2017 Posted August 31, 2017 In 2014, by DVOA, the Colts had the 7th easiest schedule. They beat up on the Titans, Texans, and Jaguars. They lost games against the good teams they went against. Now where have I heard people saying a certain team led by a certain QB have only beaten bad teams? And their defense that year was ranked 13th, again by DVOA. That's better than "halfway decent." Their offense that year was only 17th! Their pass rank was 13th. And that was 3 years ago. Maybe Luck's tendencies have been figured out a bit? His stats have gotten woese. He is one of the worst 1st quarter QBs in the game. He puts his team in holes and sometimes he's able to make it up. Which part of this is so impressive that any team would give up 4 1st round picks? Give up that much for Luck on a rookie contract, maybe. On his current contract that's a laughable position to hold. You're better off using those picks on 2 top 1st round QBs in conjunction with some 2nds and 3rds. You can say Luck is better than Tyrod without being ridiculous. No. All I want is for Tyrod Taylor to play quarterback for the Bills in perpetuity.
JM2009 Posted August 31, 2017 Posted August 31, 2017 Luck had to beat Denver to go to the AFCCG. That Denver team won the SB the year after. #resume Luck was so good he didn't sit on the bench for 3 seasons. You guys hold that against him. LMAO. The Bills could have won that division in 2015. No. All I want is for Tyrod Taylor to play quarterback for the Bills in perpetuity. This is the type of answer folks, when one cannot argue successfully and has been proven wrong. No TT supporter has said he is the long term answer. None.
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