Charlottesville

[B-Man]

ROBERT MCMANUS: Avoidable Mayhem: Why did Virginia’s political leadership order the police and National Guard to stand down?

Details remain thin. It is not clear, for example, how many alt-right demonstrators were there, though many reports indicate that they were substantially outnumbered by counter-demonstrators, largely drawn from t

he same crowd that has been rioting at the drop of Donald Trump’s name since November 9

.

 

So, obviously, this was a fraught moment. But what would have been the outcome had the police and the Virginia National Guard—both on hand in strong numbers—done their duty, enforced properly obtained demonstration permits, and preserved the right of the warring parties to make their respective points without being physically attacked, one by the other and vice versa?

It’s worth remembering that Charlottesville did everything it could to prevent the demonstrations, issuing permits only after being sued by the ACLU. And when push came to shove—literally—on Saturday, police and National Guardsmen were to be found only on the periphery of the brawling.

Indeed, the Virginia ACLU reported that police were refusing to intervene unless specifically ordered to do so.

 

“There was no police presence,” Brittany Caine-Conley, a minister-in-training at Charlottesville’s Sojourners United Church of Christ, told the New York Times. “We were watching people punch each other; people were bleeding all the while police were inside of barricades at the park, watching. It was essentially just brawling on the street and community members trying to protect each other.”

 

Almost at first contact, Charlottesville mayor Michael Signer and Virginia governor Terry McAuliffe declared a state of emergency and cancelled the demonstrators’ permits,

whereupon police began funneling the alt-right protestors away from the designated demonstration site—and, some reports have it, toward the counter-protestors. The carnage followed in short order. Whether the breakdown in police protection was purposeful—that is, intended to quash a constitutionally protected demonstration and provoke a violent confrontation—is a question unlikely to be pursued in Virginia’s present political environment.

As partisan eye-gougers go, Governor McAuliffe, a Democrat, is near the top of the list; Mayor Signer, also a Democrat, seems to be cut from the same cloth.

 

But deliberate or not, the effect was the same: when the sun went down over Charlottesville Saturday, the First Amendment was lying in the dust, and the civic ties meant to bind all Americans were just that much weaker.

 

 

 

 

I hope the Justice Department will investigate this.

[boyst]

 

Thanks for clearing that up.

If you want to ask a question on a message board, it saves time if you ask the question and indicate who it might be directed at.

 

To answer your question, the city tried to move the event to an area that would make it much easier to control.

That petition was opposed by the ACLU and the Rutherford Institute and struck down on Friday, the day before the event.

 

I am unaware of any "stand down" orders from the scores of law enforcement jurisdictions, (probably over 20), from what I saw.

 

Gross ignorance.

 

Other than walking up the Marshall Law ladder, your post demonstrates ignorance.

I've asked you a question several times. Got nothing. Jim asked several times and you told him a story about Bandcamp or something

[Chef Jim]

The killer's mother said she didn't know it was a white nationalist rally. She thought it was a rally for Trump. Well yes it was, and yes it was.

 

 

 

[sherpa]

I've asked you a question several times. Got nothing. Jim asked several times and you told him a story about Bandcamp or something

Really?

What is "Bandcamp?'

[Chef Jim]

 

 

Other than walking up the Marshall Law ladder, your post demonstrates ignorance.

 

Your city !@#$ed up big time as many have the past couple years when it come to this stuff. You continue to defend them but I'm the ignorant one. Got it.

[sherpa]

 

Your city !@#$ed up big time as many have the past couple years when it come to this stuff. You continue to defend them but I'm the ignorant one. Got it.

Clearly, you should be a consultant.

It would make it so much easier for the rest of us.

[boyst]

Really?

What is "Bandcamp?'

yes. I asked why it's out of line that they ordered a stand down like they have done many times - Dallas, Baltimore, etc

[Chef Jim]

Clearly, you should be a consultant.

It would make it so much easier for the rest of us.

 

What type of consulting would I be good at? You appear to know an awful lot about people of my ilk.

[Ralonzo]

Also, the alt-left protesters did not have a permit to demonstrate unlike the racists who did have one and even had to get a federal court to allow them to protest.

 

Ironically, the rally was initially denied because the governor and mayor did not agree with its content. It was the ACLU that brought suit to force them to allow it, if you can believe it.

 

They reacted as you saw: the mayor has the police stand down for the unsanctioned group, and the governor declared an emergency to force the dispersal of the sanctioned rally-goers, right into a gantlet of the mob (peaceable assemblers don't typically bring clubs, pepper spray and urine bombs). It was actually reminiscent of the days when state officials would turn a blind eye to the Klan disrupting Freedom rallies. Same script, except now instead of Democrats & the Klan, it's Democrats & Antifa. The more things change, eh?

 

The upshot of all of that was the Federalization of Civil Rights enforcement. That band-aid lasted as long as it took to realize that if you captured the federal enforcement apparatus you could use selective enforcement just as easily as Orval Faubus (thanks Obama).

 

That is the actual societal inflection point reflected in Charlottesville 2017 just as in Birmingham 1963: are inalienable rights absolute, or only when sanctioned by the government?

[TakeYouToTasker]

 

Ironically, the rally was initially denied because the governor and mayor did not agree with its content. It was the ACLU that brought suit to force them to allow it, if you can believe it.

 

They reacted as you saw: the mayor has the police stand down for the unsanctioned group, and the governor declared an emergency to force the dispersal of the sanctioned rally-goers, right into a gantlet of the mob (peaceable assemblers don't typically bring clubs, pepper spray and urine bombs). It was actually reminiscent of the days when state officials would turn a blind eye to the Klan disrupting Freedom rallies. Same script, except now instead of Democrats & the Klan, it's Democrats & Antifa. The more things change, eh?

 

The upshot of all of that was the Federalization of Civil Rights enforcement. That band-aid lasted as long as it took to realize that if you captured the federal enforcement apparatus you could use selective enforcement just as easily as Orval Faubus (thanks Obama).

 

That is the actual societal inflection point reflected in Charlottesville 2017 just as in Birmingham 1963: are inalienable rights absolute, or only when sanctioned by the government?

That's well articulated.

[Benjamin Franklin]

 

Folks of my ilk. !@#$ing awesome!! Please fire away and tell us all about people of my ilk? Anyway....that's a very cute story about your life. Thanks for sharing.

 

Now if you had read my whole post instead of hitting "Quote" you would have noticed that I threw stones and every layer of government out there and the city of Bezerkeley leads the way.

 

You voted for Trump

 

ergo

 

Trump ilk.

[Chef Jim]

 

You voted for Trump

 

ergo

 

Trump ilk.

 

He's new here. He has no idea who I voted for. Up until now. This ought to be fun.

[Marv's Neighbor]

 

I've said it before: the funniest thing about American Neo-Nazis is that they are invariably examples of the very sort of people the Nazis would have gassed.

Gee, they looked like such funny guys in the Blues brothers movie.

[Rob's House]

I haven't seen liberals this happy since Dylan Roof.

[ExiledInIllinois]

I haven't seen liberals this happy since Dylan Roof.

Conservatives haven't been happy since Emmett Till.

[boyst]

Conservatives haven't been happy since Emmett Till.

retards haven't been happy since Life goes on was re-signed for season 2

[TH3]

ROBERT MCMANUS: Avoidable Mayhem: Why did Virginia’s political leadership order the police and National Guard to stand down?

 

 

 

Details remain thin. It is not clear, for example, how many alt-right demonstrators were there, though many reports indicate that they were substantially outnumbered by counter-demonstrators, largely drawn from the same crowd that has been rioting at the drop of Donald Trump’s name since November 9.

 

So, obviously, this was a fraught moment. But what would have been the outcome had the police and the Virginia National Guard—both on hand in strong numbers—done their duty, enforced properly obtained demonstration permits, and preserved the right of the warring parties to make their respective points without being physically attacked, one by the other and vice versa? It’s worth remembering that Charlottesville did everything it could to prevent the demonstrations, issuing permits only after being sued by the ACLU. And when push came to shove—literally—on Saturday, police and National Guardsmen were to be found only on the periphery of the brawling. Indeed, the Virginia ACLU reported that police were refusing to intervene unless specifically ordered to do so.

 

“There was no police presence,” Brittany Caine-Conley, a minister-in-training at Charlottesville’s Sojourners United Church of Christ, told the New York Times. “We were watching people punch each other; people were bleeding all the while police were inside of barricades at the park, watching. It was essentially just brawling on the street and community members trying to protect each other.”

 

Almost at first contact, Charlottesville mayor Michael Signer and Virginia governor Terry McAuliffe declared a state of emergency and cancelled the demonstrators’ permits, whereupon police began funneling the alt-right protestors away from the designated demonstration site—and, some reports have it, toward the counter-protestors. The carnage followed in short order. Whether the breakdown in police protection was purposeful—that is, intended to quash a constitutionally protected demonstration and provoke a violent confrontation—is a question unlikely to be pursued in Virginia’s present political environment. As partisan eye-gougers go, Governor McAuliffe, a Democrat, is near the top of the list; Mayor Signer, also a Democrat, seems to be cut from the same cloth.

 

But deliberate or not, the effect was the same: when the sun went down over Charlottesville Saturday, the First Amendment was lying in the dust, and the civic ties meant to bind all Americans were just that much weaker.

 

 

 

 

I hope the Justice Department will investigate this.

 

Save you the time....White Nationalist armed neo Nazi Party goes to southern town to bait its residents....white nationalist neo nazi member inevitably kills innocent person.....

 

And you want to investigate and blame the local law enforcement...got it....

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Save you the time....White Nationalist armed neo Nazi Party goes to southern town to bait its residents....white nationalist neo nazi member inevitably kills innocent person.....

 

And you want to investigate and blame the local law enforcement...got it....

 

And you conveniently ignore armed neo-communist thugs that INCITED the violence.

[B-Man]

 

And you conveniently ignore armed neo-communist thugs that INCITED the violence.

 

You're wasting your time..............Baskin = blinders

[Tiberius]

https://mobile.twitter.com/82ndABNDiv/status/897070974830612480

 

 

82nd Air Borne is disgusted that some d-bag in the Nazi group was wearing their hat, spit