PolishDave Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) Yes, THE RAVENS were 6-2 in playoff games. Not Joe Flacco. The Ravens. And that's bull **** that that job was not up for the taking. Every job in the NFL is up for the taking. Every one. If you play better than the other guy, consistently, you'll get a shot. Teams love to light fires under asses in this way. But there simply was never a controversy there because Flacco played better. Really? How come the GOAT Brady needed an injury to force his playing time. They had the GOAT on the bench. Surely he should have been starting over Drew. Plenty of excellent quarterbacks have had to ride the pine for years before getting their shot. No way in hell, Taylor was getting a shot in Baltimore unless something catastrophic happened to Flacco. As was pointed out - no coach is going to sit a proven Franchise QB that was just signed to a $100 + million deal like Flacco was. It just ain't gonna happen unless there is an injury or the guy goes Kuoandjio. In that same span the Ravens were 6-2 in playoff games. And the Super Bowl year was Tyrod's 2nd year. They gave Flacco a 6 year $120M deal after the Super Bowl. You can think whatever you want, but that job was not up for the taking. You are exactly right. Edited August 16, 2017 by PolishDave
Thurman#1 Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 Thank you. I should have included the $120M deal in the list, but was flustered over the sheer inanity of this whole debate ........ I basically agree that it's inane. The verdict's pretty much in. He's very unlikely to become a franchise guy, though it's possible. Beane is doing what he's doing because that's what he thinks too. But if this inanity so flusters you, there are a ton of other threads that are a lot more sensible. May I respectfully suggest they may suit your needs better? If you'd rather be here, hey, understand what this thread is.
Mat68 Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 Alot goes into yac. Last year the main routes used were outs, go's, and hitch's. In todays NFL unless the defender falls down you are going to be tackled at the point of catch. With a traditional west coast offense im looking forward to see how taylor looks. Crossing routes and deep ins favor his skill set imo. More moving pockets and rollouts plays into the teams strengths.
Thurman#1 Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) Really? How come the GOAT Brady needed an injury to force his playing time. They had the GOAT on the bench. Surely he should have been starting over Drew. You are exactly right. Plenty of excellent quarterbacks have had to ride the pine for years before getting their shot. No way in hell, Taylor was getting a shot in Baltimore unless something catastrophic happened to Flacco. As was pointed out - no coach is going to sit a proven Franchise QB that was just signed to a $100 + million deal like Flacco was. It just ain't gonna happen unless there is an injury or the guy goes Kuoandjio. Dude, try to make your questions easier. It was Brady's second year, dude. And by all accounts he hadn't outplayed him in training camp that second year. It was after he was put in the games that Belichick started seeing that Brady's style suited Belichick's game plans more than Bledsoe's. If there'd been no injury, still think Brady would never have beaten out Bledsoe? Please. And yeah, "plenty of excellent QBs have had to ride the pine for years before getting their shot." They weren't ready yet, or hadn't consistently outplayed the guy above them. Brady's a great example. There'd been no calls for Brady to start during training camp. He hadn't showed he was ready. But as he developed and showed he was indeed better and not as a flash in the pan but consistently, guess what, Bledsoe is gone. But hey, if you want to believe that a coach would endanger his job by never giving a chance to a guy who is consistently playing significantly better, that's your lookout. But we'll never know in that particular case because Tyrod simply wasn't playing better than Flacco. He never made the Ravens braintrust look at him in that way. Edited August 16, 2017 by Thurman#1
PolishDave Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 Dude, try to make your questions easier. It was Brady's second year, dude. And by all accounts he hadn't outplayed him in training camp that second year. It was after he was put in the games that Belichick started seeing that Brady's style suited Belichick's game plans more than Bledsoe's. If there'd been no injury, still think Brady would never have beaten out Bledsoe? Please. But hey, if you want to believe that a coach would endanger his job by not giving a chance to a guy who is consistently playing better, that's your lookout. But we'll never know in that case because Tyrod simply wasn't playing better than Flacco. I bet that if Bledsoe never gets injured, Brady ends up going to a different team. What happens then? Anybody's guess. Does he still become a starter and have a great career? I say high probability yes. Does he become the GOAT? Doubtful. Circumstances had to align for him to become what he has become and to achieve the success he has achieved. Same can be said for Belichick. I highly doubt he is still a head coach in the NFL if it wasn't for Brady. Perfect situation. Perfect timing. And they made the most of it.
billsfan60 Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 Any definition of a franchise quarterback contains the stipulation of long term success. A one read and run type guy like taylor will be lucky to ever play out a full 16 game season without injury. He isn't Young, or Montana, or Flacco or even A Smith. No GM is going to predicate their long term employment on a one trick pony. Like the kid but he's just a bridge. Great backup, poor starter. Would he flip flop with a rookie, doubt it. Need to trade him when we can. The opportunity will present itself. The on;y thing worse than a tank is going 6-10.
HappyDays Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 And that's bull **** that that job was not up for the taking. Every job in the NFL is up for the taking. Every one. If you play better than the other guy, consistently, you'll get a shot. Teams love to light fires under asses in this way. But there simply was never a controversy there because Flacco played better. If Flacco's job was for the taking, why did Baltimore not bother to draft a single QB in between drafting Tyrod in 2011 and Keith Wenning in the 6th round in 2014? They weren't looking to replace him. And they were obviously comfortable with their backup position so Tyrod must have shown something in their offseasons.
BringBackOrton Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 If Flacco's job was for the taking, why did Baltimore not bother to draft a single QB in between drafting Tyrod in 2011 and Keith Wenning in the 6th round in 2014? They weren't looking to replace him. And they were obviously comfortable with their backup position so Tyrod must have shown something in their offseasons. I don't think he's saying they were actively looking to replace him. I think he's saying if TT consistently was outperforming Flacco on the practice field, he would've gotten the nod.
row_33 Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 Every time he takes off it could be the fatal one of him getting so righteously clocked that he won't wake up for a week. Came close in the preseason game. Almost all of his chaotic runs are due to his inability to stand in the pocket an extra second and look for something more than his primary receiver standing there waving his arms 100% wide open... Shula called a naked bootleg for Marino once, Marino made sure that was the final time that ever happened.
HappyDays Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 I don't think he's saying they were actively looking to replace him. I think he's saying if TT consistently was outperforming Flacco on the practice field, he would've gotten the nod. Tyrod would have had to really separate himself from Flacco, in an offense not designed for him, playing with 2nd stringers. Let's be realistic, Tyrod had next to zero chance of supplanting Flacco. When's the last time an established starter was replaced by a QB who had a good training camp? It doesn't happen, not lately.
Runninrams Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 Really? How come the GOAT Brady needed an injury to force his playing time. They had the GOAT on the bench. Surely he should have been starting over Drew. Plenty of excellent quarterbacks have had to ride the pine for years before getting their shot. No way in hell, Taylor was getting a shot in Baltimore unless something catastrophic happened to Flacco. As was pointed out - no coach is going to sit a proven Franchise QB that was just signed to a $100 + million deal like Flacco was. It just ain't gonna happen unless there is an injury or the guy goes Kuoandjio. You are exactly right. 100% false. Bledsoe's injury only accelerated the timetable on Brady. The plan was already in place to have Brady as the starter and would've most likely been put in place for 2002.
row_33 Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 is Flacco elite though? Meh.... missing your target in a 20 yard underthrow that turns into a TD in the SB, which was praised as a great thing????? makes me silently wonder. He's darn good though... 100% false. Bledsoe's injury only accelerated the timetable on Brady. The plan was already in place to have Brady as the starter and would've most likely been put in place for 2002. Dunno about that one.... and Bledsoe did great work against the Steelers in the playoffs when Brady was out with injury....
Bills757 Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 100% false. Bledsoe's injury only accelerated the timetable on Brady. The plan was already in place to have Brady as the starter and would've most likely been put in place for 2002. Yea, okay. It was the master plan to have a 6th round draft pick who was slower than slow and didn't even perform great in college take over the offense. Hindsight is always 20/20.
grb Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) Dude, try to make your questions easier. It was Brady's second year, dude. And by all accounts he hadn't outplayed him in training camp that second year. It was after he was put in the games that Belichick started seeing that Brady's style suited Belichick's game plans more than Bledsoe's. When the argument is as insipid as yours, you need to be pretty elastic defending it, huh Thurm? Let's see : (1) Brady didn't outperform Bledsoe in camp, but only shined when he got his chance after Bledsoe's injury (2) Taylor (presumably) didn't outperform Flacco in camp, and Flacco never got injured. Ergo, Taylor can't play QB. Quit while you're behind, willya? Edited August 16, 2017 by grb
transplantbillsfan Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 Yeah, it's strange that Young didn't start but three games in his fifth year ... behind Joe Montana in his prime. Hard to figure that out. That is one sad and pathetic argument you've got there. Young was playing at a franchise level from his fifth year on, in camp, in the preseason and when he got his chance. The Niners were thrilled to see they had successfully found Montana's successor and would be able to let Montana go before his game went downhill. Oh, and the criticism you took for pro-rating Tyrod's stats in 2015 from 14 to 16 games is because he was injured and that's the reason he missed those games. Injury is a concern with smaller running QBs. And you were pro-rating quantitative stats (and therefore adding imaginary yards and TDs to his stats) so they got better by adding those two extra games that he never played in. Whereas I was using qualitative stats (passer rating and YPA), which didn't change. Young actually got those stats. Tyrod actually did NOT get the stats you were daydreaming about due to his injury. The last bit of your post maybe rescues it. Yup, Tyrod'll have to improve a great deal. And it would be far better for the Bills if he does improve a whole ton and becomes a franchise QB. It would be great to see, It's just very unlikely. WTF??? There's that Alzheimer's kicking in, Thurm. Direct quote from you, not me: "In Young's fifth year he only played three games" What's up with you lately? You're all over the map.
Runninrams Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 Yea, okay. It was the master plan to have a 6th round draft pick who was slower than slow and didn't even perform great in college take over the offense. Hindsight is always 20/20. Uh yeah, it was. Once he was with the team for a year and Belichick knew he had a good QB in Brady, the plan absolutely was Brady over Bledsoe even without the injury. Brady was outplaying him in practice and was a 7.5 mill savings in cap. The change was happening and has been reported on and proven in the years after. It's the same thing Bill did in Cleveland when he got rid of Kosar.
transplantbillsfan Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 Just click this link https://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/comebacks_active.htm (2) 4th quarter comebacks in his career ... he and Yates have something in common ... think this says it all ... I was rooting for Tyrod ... but this stat shows why its time to move on. In these situations a QB needs to lead the team down the field and make chicken salad out of chicken #*%&. Check out all the other QB's ahead of him .. with our record the last few years .. there should be more than 2. And this was with the much heralded Sammy W (when he was on the field). Taylor has only 30 NFL starts. 6.7% of those were 4th Quarter comebacks. Aaron Rodgers has come back in the 4th quarter in 7.4% of his career starts. Go count my posts in this thread. Then count Transplants. Check that, I'll do it. Went back and counted through the last 200 posts of this thread, including this one. 31 posts by Transplant.18 by me. Almost double. He's accounted for more than 15% of the last 200 comments. Without him, this thread would've been dead weeks ago. Yeah, but your posts are much more long-winded than mine Plus, my yard stick is longer
reddogblitz Posted August 16, 2017 Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) I saw an interesting quote from Charles Clay after practice yesterday which runs contrary to what we frequently hear from the QB experts on TBD. “He’s (Hotrod) been doing a good job, you know, positioning the ball. He’s very accurate in placing the ball where he wants it to be. And like I said he’s been doing a good job, but it’s up to us to make those plays.” http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/Top-3-things-to-know-from-Day-14-at-Bills-Camp/7cce62c2-5156-4540-bf23-97f4f80a8ac9 Clay knows best. Edited August 16, 2017 by reddogblitz
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