C.Biscuit97 Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 I never made any proclamation one way or another regarding whether Tyrod would have been given the chance to start elsewhere. I don't know for sure because he never hit the market and no GM or coach was foolish enough to risk losing a high draft pick by speaking publicly about their team's interest in a player under contract with another team. The burden to produce evidence falls on those, like JohnC, who state categorically that no other team had any interest in TT as a starter. No one can prove other teams wanted him either. But if you were his agent, would you want him to test the market where he would be the most sought after qb or have him re-sign for least money on a team that was iffy about him? It seems really strange he would re-sign with us if his market was as big as someone of you think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 No one can prove other teams wanted him either. But if you were his agent, would you want him to test the market where he would be the most sought after qb or have him re-sign for least money on a team that was iffy about him? It seems really strange he would re-sign with us if his market was as big as someone of you think. Again, it's fine to say that you doubt other teams were interested, but it's wrong to state that as an established fact. There are a lot of reasons, other than lack of interest from other teams, that Tyrod may have signed the restructured deal. Those reasons have been covered in other threads at length, not to mention the fact that other teams were not allowed to even talk to Tyrod or his agent while he was under contract. And of course, it's not his agent's decision, it's Tyrod's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 Again, it's fine to say that you doubt other teams were interested, but it's wrong to state that as an established fact. There are a lot of reasons, other than lack of interest from other teams, that Tyrod may have signed the restructured deal. Those reasons have been covered in other threads at length, not to mention the fact that other teams were not allowed to even talk to Tyrod or his agent while he was under contract. And of course, it's not his agent's decision, it's Tyrod's. Generally agree. But if you thought even one team was really interested, it would be a stupid decision to come back here instead of testing the market. He could have gotten a fat signing bonus and more security. Now, if he regresses or gets hurt, he will have really screwed himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section122 Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 Generally agree. But if you thought even one team was really interested, it would be a stupid decision to come back here instead of testing the market. He could have gotten a fat signing bonus and more security. Now, if he regresses or gets hurt, he will have really screwed himself. I went into it above but maybe he likes Buffalo? Maybe he likes Dennison from his time with him? Maybe it was Cleveland or SF or the Jets who are bottom of the barrel and offer less of a chance to win than Buffalo that wanted him? Maybe (as Shaw has opined) he believes in himself and thinks he will cash in big next year? He got his security last year and again this year. Last year he made more money than he had the rest of his career combined. He now has over 20 million dollars. His signing here originally was him betting on himself, is it that unlikely that he is doing it again? I could be right, you could be right, John could be right but none of us know. I do believe that his agent reached out to teams. I do believe they thought Buffalo was the best fit for him which is why they stayed. I also however believe that there were other teams interested and we will never know their names. Tampering behind closed doors happens all the time but for a team to go on record admitting they were tampering would be unheard of and just plain dumb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 I never made any proclamation one way or another regarding whether Tyrod would have been given the chance to start elsewhere. I don't know for sure because he never hit the market and no GM or coach was foolish enough to risk losing a high draft pick by speaking publicly about their team's interest in a player under contract with another team. The burden to produce evidence falls on those, like JohnC, who state categorically that no other team had any interest in TT as a starter. Lets agree to disagree because I have made that same claim as John has and never had someone produce a valid link. (beyond a speculative article). I even posted links to said speculation and it was ignored. No one can prove other teams wanted him either. But if you were his agent, would you want him to test the market where he would be the most sought after qb or have him re-sign for least money on a team that was iffy about him? It seems really strange he would re-sign with us if his market was as big as someone of you think. BINGO. there is the source Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 Generally agree. But if you thought even one team was really interested, it would be a stupid decision to come back here instead of testing the market. He could have gotten a fat signing bonus and more security. Now, if he regresses or gets hurt, he will have really screwed himself.What if it was a team he did not want to play for, or at least did not prefer to the Bills? And of course, one could argue that the current deal is better for Tyrod than the previous one if he has a big year in 2017. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 Generally agree. But if you thought even one team was really interested, it would be a stupid decision to come back here instead of testing the market. He could have gotten a fat signing bonus and more security. Now, if he regresses or gets hurt, he will have really screwed himself. Tyrod signing with the Bills makes perfect sense if you start with the assumption that he wants to enter free agency next year. How many teams are offering essentially a 1 year deal to a QB? Tyrod and his agent know the QB market. If he performs as well as he thinks he can he will sign a huge long-term deal and be earning around $20 million next year. Now of course this is starting with an assumption and I can't prove that assumption is right. But my assumption is no less believable than any assumption from the people saying Tyrod took a pay cut because no one wants him. In my view he took a pay cut because he wants to get a brand new deal next year after he's proven his worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 What if it was a team he did not want to play for, or at least did not prefer to the Bills? And of course, one could argue that the current deal is better for Tyrod than the previous one if he has a big year in 2017. There could be less openings next year for qbs. In the NFL, you should take the money when you can. Too many things can happen in a season. Hopefully, it works out for him and is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 There could be less openings next year for qbs. In the NFL, you should take the money when you can. Too many things can happen in a season. Hopefully, it works out for him and is. You're coming at it from the perspective of a Bills fan who doesn't think Tyrod has what it takes. If you come at it from Tyrod's perspective, as someone who believes in himself to do better, it makes a lot of sense. If Tyrod knew for a fact that he would perform at a top 10 level this year he would have been crazy NOT to accept the restructure. It puts him in a perfect position to cash in next offseason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 You're coming at it from the perspective of a Bills fan who doesn't think Tyrod has what it takes. If you come at it from Tyrod's perspective, as someone who believes in himself to do better, it makes a lot of sense. If Tyrod knew for a fact that he would perform at a top 10 level this year he would have been crazy NOT to accept the restructure. It puts him in a perfect position to cash in next offseason. And I think you're coming at from the perspective of a Bills fan who sees his td-int ratio. Next year is supposed to be a good qb draft. Teams drafted qbs this year. There is no loyalty in the NFL. If he sucks or gets hurt, the Bills or other teams aren't going to give him big money. If there was really interest in him, he should have pursued it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 And I think you're coming at from the perspective of a Bills fan who sees his td-int ratio. Next year is supposed to be a good qb draft. Teams drafted qbs this year. There is no loyalty in the NFL. If he sucks or gets hurt, the Bills or other teams aren't going to give him big money. If there was really interest in him, he should have pursued it. It doesn't matter what I think. It matters what Tyrod thinks. When Tyrod made his decision I doubt he or his agent even glanced at the draft class next year. If you think he made a mistake, fine. It doesn't mean he took a pay cut because other teams didn't want him. I'm just giving one reasonably possible scenario, among many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 And I think you're coming at from the perspective of a Bills fan who sees his td-int ratio. Next year is supposed to be a good qb draft. Teams drafted qbs this year. There is no loyalty in the NFL. If he sucks or gets hurt, the Bills or other teams aren't going to give him big money. If there was really interest in him, he should have pursued it. I will concede one thing: Tyrod is a very unconventional QB and, regardless how effective he is, that was likely a limiting factor in terms of generating interest from other teams. NFL GMs are much more likely to roll the dice with a standard issue pocket passer who might be less talented (e.g. Glennon) than someone for whom they might have to adjust their offense, like Tyrod. And there's also (imo) a reluctance to take someone who just doesn't jibe with the commonly held idea of what an NFL QB should look like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 I went into it above but maybe he likes Buffalo? Maybe he likes Dennison from his time with him? Maybe it was Cleveland or SF or the Jets who are bottom of the barrel and offer less of a chance to win than Buffalo that wanted him? Maybe (as Shaw has opined) he believes in himself and thinks he will cash in big next year? He got his security last year and again this year. Last year he made more money than he had the rest of his career combined. He now has over 20 million dollars. His signing here originally was him betting on himself, is it that unlikely that he is doing it again? I could be right, you could be right, John could be right but none of us know. I do believe that his agent reached out to teams. I do believe they thought Buffalo was the best fit for him which is why they stayed. I also however believe that there were other teams interested and we will never know their names. Tampering behind closed doors happens all the time but for a team to go on record admitting they were tampering would be unheard of and just plain dumb. Buffalo was the best fit for him because it is willing to run a truncated offense to accommodate his limitations. Make no mistake the realization of what he can and can not do as a qb were factors why the organization was willing to keep him only under a diminished contract. Those acknowledged limitations weren't going to expand the market for him. Whether TT was under contract or not has little to do with what his actual market value was. Agents, sometimes through their surrogates, know the value of their clients. The agent for Cousins in Washington knows what his general value is even while he is under contract. One of the most important responsibilities an agent has is knowing his client's worth. We can go in circles on this issue and come to no resolution. But my central point is that TT is a respectable bridge qb, and nothing more. If he was more than what I am stating then the market would have more positively responded to him. It didn't. When you are coerced into a pay cut with a lesser term and you accede to those demands then that is an obvious indication of what your status and value are as a player. I'm very glad we have TT as a bridge qb. He is a better qb than what we have had in a long time. But that isn't saying much. If our aspirations are higher than being average then we need to do better. That's my basic point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 No one can prove other teams wanted him either. But if you were his agent, would you want him to test the market where he would be the most sought after qb or have him re-sign for least money on a team that was iffy about him? It seems really strange he would re-sign with us if his market was as big as someone of you think. Exactly. I can tell you the teams, but to what end? So you can see them and ask for more proof of some other kind? It's a pointless request. Buffalo was the best fit for him because it is willing to run a truncated offense to accommodate his limitations. Make no mistake the realization of what he can and can not do as a qb were factors why the organization was willing to keep him only under a diminished contract. Those acknowledged limitations weren't going to expand the market for him. Whether TT was under contract or not has little to do with what his actual market value was. Agents, sometimes through their surrogates, know the value of their clients. The agent for Cousins in Washington knows what his general value is even while he is under contract. One of the most important responsibilities an agent has is knowing his client's worth. We can go in circles on this issue and come to no resolution. But my central point is that TT is a respectable bridge qb, and nothing more. If he was more than what I am stating then the market would have more positively responded to him. It didn't. When you are coerced into a pay cut with a lesser term and you accede to those demands then that is an obvious indication of what your status and value are as a player. I'm very glad we have TT as a bridge qb. He is a better qb than what we have had in a long time. But that isn't saying much. If our aspirations are higher than being average then we need to do better. That's my basic point. Buffalo was the best fit for him because they brought in an OC he is familiar with that is also familiar with him, and they have some quality (when healthy) skill position players that he is already familiar with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM2009 Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 Exactly. I can tell you the teams, but to what end? So you can see them and ask for more proof of some other kind? It's a pointless request. Buffalo was the best fit for him because they brought in an OC he is familiar with that is also familiar with him, and they have some quality (when healthy) skill position players that he is already familiar with. Most of us realize that the defense was the main problem in 2016, not the offense.Don't know what else to say to those who continue to say that the QB was the main problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 Most of us realize that the defense was the main problem in 2016, not the offense.Don't know what else to say to those who continue to say that the QB was the main problem. That's not what I'm talking about. Relax, it's okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM2009 Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 That's not what I'm talking about. Relax, it's okay. My point is it doesn't matter what stats, or arguments or anything else that disproves what the few are saying, they will never change their opinion that TT is terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 Exactly. I can tell you the teams, but to what end? So you can see them and ask for more proof of some other kind? It's a pointless request. Buffalo was the best fit for him because they brought in an OC he is familiar with that is also familiar with him, and they have some quality (when healthy) skill position players that he is already familiar with. As I repeatedly stated I believe that TT is a credible bridge qb. I firmly believe that he is not going to be our long term franchise qb. If you think otherwise that is fine. We'll just respectfully disagree. With respect to the highlighted area go ahead and name those teams. I promise you that I won't ask for proof. I have no doubt that some teams had an interest in him. However, their lack of actual response is a statement in itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 That's not what I'm talking about. Relax, it's okay. I'm telling ya, the ignore list makes posting pleasant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM2009 Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 My point is it doesn't matter what stats, or arguments or anything else that disproves what the few are saying, they will never change their opinion that TT is terrible. We're on the same side with this. And I have Shady on my ignore list because the agenda people are too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts