Who else is all in on this new way of doing things?

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

We will always have someone to blame.

 

Less likely we hail anyone soon.

.....Rockpile Beerman is a convenient whipping post......

[JohnC]

 

This entire off-season is on McDermott.

I agree with you that this offseason is on McDermott and his crew. But it isn't clear if he was the person responsible for handling the Gillislee tender.

[jeffismagic]

I agree with you that this offseason is on McDermott and his crew. But it isn't clear if he was the person responsible for handling the Gillislee tender.

 

It is to me. He's been running the show since he was hired.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Everyone was complaining about Gilmore not tackling last year. Hope that keeps going next year.

 

Ha! It won't. First missed tackle, Belichick* will grab him by the nape of the neck and show him the tub of entrails labeled "DBs who fail to tackle" and he'll be All In on the tackling thing

I agree with you that this offseason is on McDermott and his crew. But it isn't clear if he was the person responsible for handling the Gillislee tender.

 

Considering apparently Whaley knew for some time he was out, and McWrestler has been loud and clear that he had input into every aspect of the show, I gotta tag McWrestler

[JohnC]

 

Ha! It won't. First missed tackle, Belichick* will grab him by the nape of the neck and show him the tub of entrails labeled "DBs who fail to tackle" and he'll be All In on the tackling thing

 

Considering apparently Whaley knew for some time he was out, and McWrestler has been loud and clear that he had input into every aspect of the show, I gotta tag McWrestler

With respect to the highlighted area I'm not saying you are wrong. I just don't know for sure if new HC was involved with the tendering offer or if it went through Oberdorf who handled the contracts. I've stated in many posts that I wish we would have kept Gillislee and handled the tendering offer more smartly.

[SoTier]

2010 NFL Season Preview:

 

Veteran Additions:

OT Cornell Green, DE/DT Dwan Edwards, ILB Andra Davis, ILB Reggie Torbor.

Draft Picks:

RB C.J. Spiller, NT Torell Troup, DE/DT Alex Carrington, WR Marcus Easley, OT Ed Wang, DE/OLB Arthur Moats, DE/OLB Danny Batten, QB Levi Brown, OT Kyle Calloway.

Offseason Losses:

WR Terrell Owens, WR Josh Reed, TE Derek Fine, OT Jonathan Scott, G Richie Incognito, DE Aaron Schobel, DE Ryan Denney, SS John Wendling.

Read more at http://walterfootball.com/offseason2010buf.php#sTEJWLy3I2pJGIgL.99

 

The veteran players the Bills added were pretty much trash, but the players they lost were also about the same level at that time. Except for Owens and Incognito, none of the others were ever regular starters for other teams after they left the Bills. The draft didn't yield much but Spiller, Carrington, and Moats were modest successes. Spiller might have been much better in a different situation. IIRC, Moats played in 2016 for the Steelers.

 

As for the others:

• Terrell Owens was at the end of his career and had only one good season, 2010, after he left the Bills. He had 72 receptions for 983 yards and 9 TDs in 2010 ... with Carson Palmer throwing him the ball. With Ryan Fitzpatrick pitching behind the Bills unreasonable facsimile of an OL, do you really think he'd have done as well?
• Josh Reed signed with the San Diego Chargers but was released before the start of the 2010 season.
• The highlight of Derek Fine's career was catching a TD pass from Trent Edwards in 2008. He went on IR in September, 2009. He was waived by the Bills, by St Louis, and by Houston all before the beginning of the 2010 regular season.
• Jonathan Scott bounced around the NFL -- Detroit, Buffalo, Pittsburgh, Chicago, Atlanta -- as a backup OT, and not a particularly good one.
• Richie Incognito was a good one who got away but apparently something he did/said offended somebody at OBD because he was another one of those players that the Bills FO wanted gone no matter the cost.
• Aaron Schobel retired after he was released by the Bills and no other NFL team offered him a contract.
• Ryan Denney signed with Houston in 2010 but was waived by them during the 2010 season.
• John Wendling was a good ST player who went on to make a Pro Bowl as a ST player. However, that was the best he was.

IIRC, the 2010 draft was the last one with Tom Modrake's participation. I believe he was fired in 2010, and that's when new scouting and evaluation staff were added. Was he the sole reason the Bills' draft sucked? Unlikely, but he was probably part of the problem.

 

One of my big problems with the new regime is that some of the sins of the previous regimes seem to have continued which would indicate that they originate higher up the corporate food chain than GM/HC.

• As others have noted that the Bills have what amounts to a tradition of shedding their best DBs rather than paying them and then using first round picks to replace them. Even going back to pre-salary cap days, the Bills had a penchant for drafting DBs in the first round.
• The Bills also seem to conveniently have "leaks" about players being on the trading block or being difficult or "not wanting to be here" -- often in out of town media -- in preparation for sending that player packing, either through trade or release. Negative rumors or even actual articles surfaced in regards to McGahee, Losman, Schobel, Evans, Lynch, Peters, and numerous others. It's why I found the supposed "rumor" of Watkins being available for trade to have some credibility: the Bills have been there before. Maybe I'm just paranoid, but I worked for almost a decade for an outfit where nobody paid any attention to formal announcements but tuned into every rumor on the wind because those always contained far more truth than anything coming from the FO.
• Drafting for need is a blueprint for disaster. It's totally short-term thinking, something that the Bills have excelled at for nearly 20 years, going back to the disastrous 2000 draft when they took Erik Flowers. Passing on better talent just to take a body at a position of need gave the Bills Donte Whitner, John McCargo, Leodis McKelvin, Aaron Maybin,and EJ Manuel. If the talent is about equal, then going for need is fine (ie, Marcell Dareus rather than AJ Green), but passing on Brian Orapko for Aaron Maybin is beyond stupid. Hopefully, the Bills didn't screw themselves over in the 2017 draft but that remains to be seen.

Edited June 3, 2017 by SoTier

[Call_Of_Ktulu]

I like the new staff and everything that has gone down. Things are looking up but it's going to take a few years and some growing pains.

[Augie]

I like the new staff and everything that has gone down. Things are looking up but it's going to take a few years and some growing pains.

That was succinct enough for me to actually read, and I agree! I don't like EVERYTHING, But it's more good than bad, and more good than it used to be.

[Bill from NYC]

 

Pesky things, facts.

 

None of these players were on the Bills for most of 2010:

 

• Marshawn Lynch was traded to Seattle on October 5, 2010.
• Jason Peters was traded to Philly before the 2009 season.
• Aaron Schobel's last season was 2009.

As for the others, the reality is that they weren't all that great.

• Fred Jackson, however much he was beloved in Buffalo, was, in fact, a journeyman RB. That he was the Bills starting RB in 2010 just underscored how talentless the Bills roster was.
• Lee Evans was an okay WR but never a top one. As the thirteenth player take in his draft year, he was a disappointment. On most teams, he wouldn't have been the #1 WR.
• Jairus Byrd was a genuine talent, but he was one player out of 53.

 

Who else did the Bills have in 2010?

• Spiller was a rookie.
• Wood was a sophomore slowly coming back from a broken leg.
• Others who were good/decent players included Kyle Williams, Whitner, Stevie Johnson, Posluszny, Kelsay, and Fitzpatrick.

Most of the players on the Bills roster that Nix and Gailey inherited weren't NFL caliber players except possibly on special teams.

 

The 2010 off season was hardly "one of the worst" in team history. Fitzpatrick wasn't extended in the 2010 off season but during the 2011 season when the Bills were in a big hurry to lock him into a contract in case his price went up ... just like they agreed to extend Jauron in 2008 after they beat San Diego. Both were likely done at Ralph Wilson's insistence.

 

2009 was much worse as the Bills extended Jauron despite the disaster of the 2nd half of 2008, drafted Aaron Maybin, traded Jason Peters (and getting fleeced royally by Andy Reid), and lost OT Langston Walker because he refused to play LT. Do you consider signing Terrell Owens and selling 55+K season tickets as balancing all the negatives ... or even coming close?

 

 

 

Somebody asked me a question about GM/HC combos, and I answered. Thinking that NIx/Gailey were the best of a poor lot doesn't mean that they were any good. They at least helped the Bills get a better talent foundation going forward rather than further depleting it or just treading water.

Listen, you are making total sense and I agree with you but it appears that in this and other posts on this thread, you are giving Marv Levy a pass.

 

The truth is that Levy hand picked Jauron. They both shared the opinion that the secondary is the most important part of a football team. Levy admitted that he turned down multiple trade offers for the #8 pick in 2006 so he could draft Whitner. The 2006 draft destroyed this team for many years and it was Levy's baby, his first draft as GM.

 

It is easy to understand why Levy gets so much room here and has for many years. As a coach, Marv was great at keeping the huge egos in check, something that must have been hard to do. But he was a horrible GM, maybe even worse than Whaley. That bad.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

With respect to the highlighted area I'm not saying you are wrong. I just don't know for sure if new HC was involved with the tendering offer or if it went through Oberdorf who handled the contracts. I've stated in many posts that I wish we would have kept Gillislee and handled the tendering offer more smartly.

 

I don't know for sure either. I'm sure it went through Overdorf, and it's possible McWrestler was not involved. Where I'm coming from is, because McWrestler has been so vocal about being involved in all facets, having a voice or being "in the room" for decisions, IMO I'm going to "tag" him with responsibility whether or not he was actually involved.

[SoTier]

Listen, you are making total sense and I agree with you but it appears that in this and other posts on this thread, you are giving Marv Levy a pass.

 

The truth is that Levy hand picked Jauron. They both shared the opinion that the secondary is the most important part of a football team. Levy admitted that he turned down multiple trade offers for the #8 pick in 2006 so he could draft Whitner. The 2006 draft destroyed this team for many years and it was Levy's baby, his first draft as GM.

 

It is easy to understand why Levy gets so much room here and has for many years. As a coach, Marv was great at keeping the huge egos in check, something that must have been hard to do. But he was a horrible GM, maybe even worse than Whaley. That bad.

 

I'll admit that I may be prejudiced since I like Marv and absolutely detest Jauron as easily one of three worst HCs the Bills have had (Ringo and Bullough being the other two turds). Levy was part of the "GM By Committee" where the Bills really didn't have a GM, but he seemed to be largely a figurehead for the group, which included Brandon, Modrak, and Jauron. My gut feeling is that Levy didn't exert much influence on who the Bills drafted or signed as FA, and that Jauron dominated any discussions.

 

Whaley was definitely better than Levy and that rest of his group. So were Nix and Donahoe. The sad state of the Bills' talent (or, truthfully, lack of talent) at the end of the 2009 season makes that easy to see.

[8-8 Forever?]

I see lots of threads griping about this or that and I am curious who, along with me, loves what the Bills are doing? I love the new approach, I have wanted this for well over a decade.

 

Clean house and bring in a fresh new HC with a background of working with successful HC's on his way up and in successful programs. A GM who shares his vision. Cleaning out the old way of scouting and whatnot and bringing in new, experienced, talent to pretty much scrap what we have done for dozens of years now.

 

HC, GM etc doing an honest, 3rd party per say, evaluation of the talent on this team with NO Ties what so ever. They have clear systems, they know the types of overall football players they want AND who will fit their system. They aren't going to sit here and wait years on "potential" either you can and will perform or you are gone. That is how it should be.

 

I love everything that is going on at OBD these days and the direction they are going and don't care who they cut, trade or whatever to get their team that they want. This is very long past due.

 

For the first time as long as I can remember, I finally have some legit hope this team will finally turn around. Anyone else with me in this?

sure. why not. still start the year 0-2 in the division/conference, but, whatever, they will compete, win 7 or 8 games and go from there...

[ganesh]

I share hope and here is why.

What they were doing the last 17 years with many different attempts have not worked. So this is a clean sweep. Give this group enough time to: set a standard, set a foundation. Develop a true team first chemistry and see what we have.

It is Dawn and Another Day in the Bills Neighborhood. Every time a new regime comes in, our hopes are high, expectations are set in how things will be different and why they will win. We accept that and follow the team. It will be no different this time. I hope Sean and his men can conquer the last frontier!