5-22: Whaley Will Speak on SiriusXM NFL

[BillsFan4]

I just don't see any lessons learned by the Pegulas.

 

The falling love with Lafontaine after meeting him out. Lafontaine hires Ted Nolan and Tim Murray (probably the best Pegula hire, not hired by them directly!) Lafontaine quits and leaves and they hire no guy to manage the Lafontaine role so that Murray can be the head of scouting and bring in players. Then they fire Murray because they wanted him to do more than what he was hired for!

 

The falling in love with Rex Ryan when they listen to the money man Brandon and disregard the football GM's advice. Ryan plummets the team and Whaley is fired!

 

The falling in love with Sean before ever meeting him. His name "jumps out at them" and he is on the yacht hanging out before the football guys ask him a single question.

 

Pegulas are the problem.

Except that Tim Murray still had Craig Patrick, the guy LaFontaine brought in to help him learn how to run a team. Murray could have chose to use him as a resource. But from all accounts he didn't use him at all. I even heard (on the instagators) that Patrick eventually stopped even bothering to come in anymore because he wasn't being used at all.

It's sure not Pegula's fault that Tim Murray had those resources and chose not to use them...

 

 

There was also a lot of stuff written after Lafontaine left about how a big reason why was because PL didn't like that Murray was reporting directly to the Pegula's and was also making moves/trades lafontaine didn't agree with.

I've even heard Tim Murray say that he took this job (and was hired) to be a GM and make those types of decisions. So I'm not sure he felt that being a GM was more than he was hired for.

 

Having someone over Tim Murray's head seemed to be a problem (or at least it was with Lafontaine and Patrick (who just wasn't used)). So Pegula could have forced someone else onto him, but what type of working relationship would that have resulted in? Murray had a pretty damn strong personality (and a bit of an ego).

Or I guess he could have just fired Murray after being on the job for all of 2 months.

Or he could let Tim Murray be the GM, give him some time and evaluate him on it. It appears Pegula chose the latter.

[BillsFan4]

A recent event that has puzzled me is the Jason Botterill hire by the Sabres and the Pegulas. It does not seem to match the Lafontaine, Ryan, and McDermott hires. On the surface it looks like a smart hire where they interviewed the top candidates and came out with a good hire. The only theory that I have is that the Bills chaos allowed the Sabres to not get the same "attention" the Bills were getting.

I actually think it matches the McDermott hire. Both are well educated/smart, driven and detailed. Both work their ass off. Both are well spoken and don't brag. Both had a great reputation around their respective leagues and came highly recommended by the NHL/NFL. Both seem to believe very much in character in their players and coaches. Botterill just said in his most recent interview that he will put a major focus on finding character players in the draft, even if it means sacrificing a little talent, and he said how it's about finding the right players for the Sabres. When I heard that all I could think of was "he sounds just like McDermott, did he steal these lines from him?"

 

and even the Lafontaine hire I see similarities in just fact that both were ex NHL players and both played for the Sabres.

 

Why don't you think it matches those hires?

 

To me, Rex doesn't really match the Lafontaine and mcdermott hires. He's the total opposite of both those guys. The only thing I can see in common between the Ladontaine and Rex hires is that they were both well known names, but that's about it...

 

I definitely see a lot of similarities between the McDermott hire and the Botterill hire though.

[GG]

I don't think Pegula watched a single NFL game before buying the Bills.

 

 

That would be an impressive feat for someone who's owned Bills' season tickets in the past. Must have never made it past the tailgates.

 

The arm chair quarterbacking from the fry cooks on this site is amazing.

[BillsFan17]

Well he must not have been paying attention, because any casual NFL fan could see Rex Ryan and the Jets were a tire fire his last year there.... And his Buffalo Bills kicked the crap out of them twice before hiring him a few months later.

 

Maybe he just didn't watch those games....

BB record with the Browns before he was hired by the Jets, then Patriots?

 

A lot was going on behind the scenes between the front office and rex. Not an excuse but there were stories about the FO drafting players that Rex never wanted for example. Most notably Stephon Hill. Sound familiar?

 

While Rex may not have been the best hire, there were few with his playoff resume on the market.

 

Fans were tired of the Jauroun/Gailey types. Fans didnt want another college greenhorn. Fans wanted a splash and fans got a splash then were pissed they got wet.

[BillsFan17]

Fans wanted to win.

 

Hiring the loudmouth moron and removing the one good thing you had going in Schwartz defense was idiotic.

 

It's the fans fault Pegula hired Rex?

Not saying it's the fans fault, but I have learned very quickly how this fan base works. The first ones to call a player a bust to then being the first ones to champion that same player the very next day.

 

Meaning the same ones that loved the Rex hire are the first ones to bash it.

 

I'm not a rex apologist by any stretch, there were a lot of issues here, and they went well beyond Rex.

 

We didn't lose because rex was a load mouth. We didn't lose because Schwarzt was not retained. What were they supposed to do, make Jim the HC? Once Marrone left that all but sealed his fate.

 

I mean, listen if you want to pin the last two years solely on Rex, by all means I don't give a rats ass. It's just ignorant.

[GG]

Well he must not have been paying attention, because any casual NFL fan could see Rex Ryan and the Jets were a tire fire his last year there.... And his Buffalo Bills kicked the crap out of them twice before hiring him a few months later.

 

Maybe he just didn't watch those games....

 

Hindsight is great, isn't it?

 

At the time, Ryan was the top available candidate. How many teams can win with deficient talent and Geno Smith & Michael Vick as QBs.

 

Everyone now piles on Pegulas immediate love affair with Ryan, but it's not hard to believe why they wouldn't fall for a coach who's gone to two AFC championships, has beaten Belichick and now had something to prove to a division rival.

 

Now I'll await you telling me that you knew all along that Rex was selling them a bill of goods, when his real plan was to retire and hand over the reigns to his imbecile brother Fredo.

[jeffismagic]

 

Hindsight is great, isn't it?

 

At the time, Ryan was the top available candidate. How many teams can win with deficient talent and Geno Smith & Michael Vick as QBs.

 

Everyone now piles on Pegulas immediate love affair with Ryan, but it's not hard to believe why they wouldn't fall for a coach who's gone to two AFC championships, has beaten Belichick and now had something to prove to a division rival.

 

Now I'll await you telling me that you knew all along that Rex was selling them a bill of goods, when his real plan was to retire and hand over the reigns to his imbecile brother Fredo.

 

The football guys including the GM told the Pegulas not to hire Rex. It's on them for listening to Russ Brandon over Doug Whaley. But of course Whaley got fired and Brandon remains.

[GG]

 

The football guys including the GM told the Pegulas not to hire Rex. It's on them for listening to Russ Brandon over Doug Whaley. But of course Whaley got fired and Brandon remains.

 

The football guys, being ....?

[jeffismagic]

 

The football guys, being ....?

 

Doug Whaley told them to hire a Hue Jackson or a Kyle Shanahan and keep Jim Schwartz defense in place. Russ Brandon wanted Rex for non-football reasons. Brandon's view won out.

[GG]

 

Doug Whaley told them to hire a Hue Jackson or a Kyle Shanahan and keep Jim Schwartz defense in place. Russ Brandon wanted Rex for non-football reasons. Brandon's view won out.

 

Jackson was the leading candidate until they met Rex. It's clear that they preferred a veteran coach, which is why the other guys didn't warrant serious consideration. The last thing Pegulas wanted in their first year was a green coach and a green GM (who didn't have glowing reviews from their NFL gurus)

 

Why are you singling out Shanahan, when they also interviewed other coaches who've looked good so far? Could it be that you're pushing a hindsight agenda?

[jeffismagic]

 

Jackson was the leading candidate until they met Rex. It's clear that they preferred a veteran coach, which is why the other guys didn't warrant serious consideration. The last thing Pegulas wanted in their first year was a green coach and a green GM (who didn't have glowing reviews from their NFL gurus)

 

Why are you singling out Shanahan, when they also interviewed other coaches who've looked good so far? Could it be that you're pushing a hindsight agenda?

 

Speaking of hindsight! Sure, after Rex is hired Pegula says that.

[eball]

Class act. Best of luck in your future endeavors, Doug.

[Buffalo86]

This is all big speculation.

 

How do you know Whaley thought/would have thought any of those things?

 

Whaley deserves his fair share of blame for the current state of the franchise.

 

However, I agree that Pegula was the one that hired Rex when he had no business making any football decisions(By that I mean he doesn't have a !@#$ing clue about football, obviously he's the owner he can do whatever he wants.)

 

I don't think Pegula watched a single NFL game before buying the Bills.

 

And despite the constant praise of the McDermott/Beane hires on here. Both have proven nothing in this league.... Pegula essentially gave a rookie head coach the keys to every football move. He doesn't know what he's doing, hopefully he got lucky with the recent hirings.

 

I thought it was pretty clear that it was all speculation, but thanks for clarifying that for anyone who didn't get it.

 

The football guys including the GM told the Pegulas not to hire Rex. It's on them for listening to Russ Brandon over Doug Whaley. But of course Whaley got fired and Brandon remains.

This, on the other hand, is speculation presented as fact. Where are you now, ScottLaw?

[GG]

 

Speaking of hindsight! Sure, after Rex is hired Pegula says that.

 

It's not hindsight. If it wasn't going to be Rex, it was going to be Jackson. What do they have in common that the other candidates didn't?

[JM2009]

 

Doug Whaley told them to hire a Hue Jackson or a Kyle Shanahan and keep Jim Schwartz defense in place. Russ Brandon wanted Rex for non-football reasons. Brandon's view won out.

Let's see a link with Whaley stating that.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

Let's see a link with Whaley stating that.

 

....LMAO....you'll have great, great, great grandkids before you see that.....besides what HC of any caliber would let a GM dictate WHO he will have on his staff (Schwartz)?.....credibility down the drain as usual....unfounded speculation...........

[GunnerBill]

Let's see a link with Whaley stating that.

 

Whaley definitely wanted Hue. I know that for a fact... I know someone who was in Jackson's "camp" if that is the right word and Doug had pretty much told that Hue was the guy to the extent that Hue and Schwartz had spoken and believed they could come to an agreement to keep JS on. Michael Silver reported that Jackson went to bed that Friday night believing he was going to be the Bills next Head Coach and then Jackson himself corroborated much of that later that year.

 

I'm less sure Brandon wanted Rex. I don't believe that has ever been reported by any creditable source. What has been reported is that Russ told Terry "don't let him out of the room" but people use that quote out of its context so often. The advice Russ actually gave is "when you have your guy don't let him out of the room." Terry and Kim thought they'd found their guy before Russ uttered those immortal words. Can I believe Russ gave Rex advice on how to charm the Pegulas? Sure. But I don't believe Russ Brandon was in that room banging the table for Rex Ryan... not when his good buddy Doug wanted Jackson.

 

Ultimately it will be the moment of regret Whaley lives with if he never gets another shot as a GM. He played the company line he thought he could work with Rex and he should have put his foot down and just said "NO".

[jeffismagic]

 

Whaley definitely wanted Hue. I know that for a fact... I know someone who was in Jackson's "camp" if that is the right word and Doug had pretty much told that Hue was the guy to the extent that Hue and Schwartz had spoken and believed they could come to an agreement to keep JS on. Michael Silver reported that Jackson went to bed that Friday night believing he was going to be the Bills next Head Coach and then Jackson himself corroborated much of that later that year.

 

I'm less sure Brandon wanted Rex. I don't believe that has ever been reported by any creditable source. What has been reported is that Russ told Terry "don't let him out of the room" but people use that quote out of its context so often. The advice Russ actually gave is "when you have your guy don't let him out of the room." Terry and Kim thought they'd found their guy before Russ uttered those immortal words. Can I believe Russ gave Rex advice on how to charm the Pegulas? Sure. But I don't believe Russ Brandon was in that room banging the table for Rex Ryan... not when his good buddy Doug wanted Jackson.

 

Ultimately it will be the moment of regret Whaley lives with if he never gets another shot as a GM. He played the company line he thought he could work with Rex and he should have put his foot down and just said "NO".

 

Absolutely. And from what I heard, Whaley and Brandon's relationship was never the same after Rex was hired. Whaley was brought in by Brandon and they thought they could make Whaley do their bidding. But Whaley thought he could convince people to get better and he never realized what the game actually was. Once Rex was hired Whaley was a dead man walking.

[JM2009]

 

Absolutely. And from what I heard, Whaley and Brandon's relationship was never the same after Rex was hired. Whaley was brought in by Brandon and they thought they could make Whaley do their bidding. But Whaley thought he could convince people to get better and he never realized what the game actually was. Once Rex was hired Whaley was a dead man walking.

Keep making Whaley the victim. Players and winning, though, that's the key.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

 

Whaley definitely wanted Hue. I know that for a fact... I know someone who was in Jackson's "camp" if that is the right word and Doug had pretty much told that Hue was the guy to the extent that Hue and Schwartz had spoken and believed they could come to an agreement to keep JS on. Michael Silver reported that Jackson went to bed that Friday night believing he was going to be the Bills next Head Coach and then Jackson himself corroborated much of that later that year.

 

I'm less sure Brandon wanted Rex. I don't believe that has ever been reported by any creditable source. What has been reported is that Russ told Terry "don't let him out of the room" but people use that quote out of its context so often. The advice Russ actually gave is "when you have your guy don't let him out of the room." Terry and Kim thought they'd found their guy before Russ uttered those immortal words. Can I believe Russ gave Rex advice on how to charm the Pegulas? Sure. But I don't believe Russ Brandon was in that room banging the table for Rex Ryan... not when his good buddy Doug wanted Jackson.

 

Ultimately it will be the moment of regret Whaley lives with if he never gets another shot as a GM. He played the company line he thought he could work with Rex and he should have put his foot down and just said "NO".

...I can certainly buy Whaley wanting/recommending Hue.....he got a raw deal in Oakland when Reggie canned him.....and sure Hue may have talked to Schwartz about staying on.....when the talk of Polian coming on as czar/czarina/Russian bride (Terry wanted someone to groom Kim for the presidency; he referred to the Bills in inner circles as "her baby" ) came up unexpectedly, Schwartz said he would resign if that happened, stating, "I have plenty to live on (Lions owed him $13 mil).....Brandon's involvement is up for debate which will never be answered.....I do know he contacted someone that we are mutually close to and was pretty proud of the hire...the quote was, "so what do you think"?.....my bud said good hire and I puked....