boyst Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 Why are people up in arms about it in 2016, when Russia's/USSR's meddling in US politics since the 1950's has caused far greater damage? cuz, Trump!
Tiberius Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 Trump hears footsteps... https://twitter.com/GlennKesslerWP/status/888205353183313920 No surprise there. He knows his supporters have his back no matter what so he is free to do as he pleases in many things
Deranged Rhino Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 Thanks for the thoughtful and well put response. I'm not surprised to see myself in agreement with you as usual. My question really was about the propaganda phenomenon in general, not necessarily the Russian contribution. It's a subject that's long fascinated me since studying the impact that it played in ancient Roman and Greek politics, not to mention Germany and other parts of Europe in the 30s. Im currently involved in reasearching how media deregulation in the 80s and the abolition of the Fairness Doctrine have contributed to the issue. Thanks again.
Tiberius Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 The real enemy isn't Russia. The real enemy is within. It's the system that educated - or failed to educate - those people who were swayed by the Russian propaganda on basic critical thinking skills. We don't teach that anymore, we teach our kids how to pass tests not how to think. Our education syste :beer:m is in tatters in part because we spend billions a year on defense instead of investing that into our people and future. You can't educate people to be smarter. I don't care how much money you spend people will still be swayed by propaganda.
Deranged Rhino Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 You can't educate people to be smarter. I don't care how much money you spend people will still be swayed by propaganda. I disagree, but leave that aside. What's the solution you would propose to this specific issue?
Tiberius Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 I disagree, but leave that aside. What's the solution you would propose to this specific issue? There is no solution to people being played on their biases. Not saying education is not important, but it won't create perfect citizens, where everyone is above average
Deranged Rhino Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 There is no solution to people being played on their biases. Not saying education is not important, but it won't create perfect citizens, where everyone is above average Asking with genuine interest, not trying to pick a fight: if that's true, are you suggesting that those who are below average should be protected from thinking for themselves?
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 Trump hears footsteps... https://twitter.com/GlennKesslerWP/status/888205353183313920 I heard about that on the ride into work. He's also digging up dirt on everyone on the council.
26CornerBlitz Posted July 21, 2017 Author Posted July 21, 2017 I heard about that on the ride into work. He's also digging up dirt on everyone on the council. Roy Cohn would be so proud.
Tiberius Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 Asking with genuine interest, not trying to pick a fight: if that's true, are you suggesting that those who are below average should be protected from thinking for themselves? No, even the dullest person can understand their own interests better than someone else in political matters
B-Man Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 It didn't take Mueller long to stack the deck. Here’s a Look at Special Counsel Robert Mueller’s 15 Attorneys: A Who’s Who of Liberal Activism by Jim Hoft Original Article
Tiberius Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 I heard about that on the ride into work. He's also digging up dirt on everyone on the council. Mueller had a Golf membership at one of Trump's resorts and the Trump team is floating the idea he left in anger It didn't take Mueller long to stack the deck. Here’s a Look at Special Counsel Robert Mueller’s 15 Attorneys: A Who’s Who of Liberal Activismby Jim Hoft Original Article This is lame. Loose threads the Trump team is grasping at
Magox Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 It didn't take Mueller long to stack the deck. Here’s a Look at Special Counsel Robert Mueller’s 15 Attorneys: A Who’s Who of Liberal Activismby Jim Hoft Original Article This was a big mistake on Mueller's part, when you have such an important investigation it is critically important that you conduct the process which includes the staffing in a way that protects the integrity of the investigation. If this had been an investigation on Obama and you had staffed a bunch of lawyers who had contributed solely to right wing politicians there is no doubt that people from the left would be up in and arms and the media without doubt would have made that the story. I am 99% convinced that would be the case. You would have thought the fact that he is friends with Comey that he would have tried to lessen the appearance that there was some sort of conflict of interest but he clearly decided that he didn't care. How hard would have it been for him to simply staff up with people who didn't financially support the last Democratic nominee or president? Would that have been so hard? From my perspective and I like to think that I try to see things from a balanced perspective that this investigation is already tainted. Because he has done it this way, it will cause not just Trump supporters but some people from the middle to believe that this investigation is largely going to be conducted as a fishing expedition.
Tiberius Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 This was a big mistake on Mueller's part, when you have such an important investigation it is critically important that you conduct the process which includes the staffing in a way that protects the integrity of the investigation. If this had been an investigation on Obama and you had staffed a bunch of lawyers who had contributed solely to right wing politicians there is no doubt that people from the left would be up in and arms and the media without doubt would have made that the story. I am 99% convinced that would be the case. You would have thought the fact that he is friends with Comey that he would have tried to lessen the appearance that there was some sort of conflict of interest but he clearly decided that he didn't care. How hard would have it been for him to simply staff up with people who didn't financially support the last Democratic nominee or president? Would that have been so hard? From my perspective and I like to think that I try to see things from a balanced perspective that this investigation is already tainted. Because he has done it this way, it will cause not just Trump supporters but some people from the middle to believe that this investigation is largely going to be conducted as a fishing expedition. You can't hire anyone in Washington who hasn't donated to someone, worked on some controversial case or represented someone some one else doesn't like. So many of those connections are pretty lame. And Mueller is supposidly a Republican, appointed by Republicans and confirmed by bi-partisan majorities in the Senate. He hired who he thought were the best people. This argument will work with THAT 1/3 of the population but that is it.
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 This was a big mistake on Mueller's part, when you have such an important investigation it is critically important that you conduct the process which includes the staffing in a way that protects the integrity of the investigation. If this had been an investigation on Obama and you had staffed a bunch of lawyers who had contributed solely to right wing politicians there is no doubt that people from the left would be up in and arms and the media without doubt would have made that the story. I am 99% convinced that would be the case. You would have thought the fact that he is friends with Comey that he would have tried to lessen the appearance that there was some sort of conflict of interest but he clearly decided that he didn't care. How hard would have it been for him to simply staff up with people who didn't financially support the last Democratic nominee or president? Would that have been so hard? From my perspective and I like to think that I try to see things from a balanced perspective that this investigation is already tainted. Because he has done it this way, it will cause not just Trump supporters but some people from the middle to believe that this investigation is largely going to be conducted as a fishing expedition. Honestly, i hope trump subverts the whole thing. They hand out convictions, he hands out pardons and a middle finger.
TH3 Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 It didn't take Mueller long to stack the deck. Here’s a Look at Special Counsel Robert Mueller’s 15 Attorneys: A Who’s Who of Liberal Activismby Jim Hoft Original Article Pardon me....but if this is a witch hunt and DT has done no wrong...then liberal flailing should not matter....correct? DT should just sit down with the Counsel, open his books/whatever and end the conversation..... Honestly, i hope trump subverts the whole thing. They hand out convictions, he hands out pardons and a middle finger. As soon as things come to light, the pardons will start and even the GOP congress will move to impeach.....and I will cash in on my bets that DT doesn't go full term....
Magox Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 You can't hire anyone in Washington who hasn't donated to someone, worked on some controversial case or represented someone some one else doesn't like. So many of those connections are pretty lame. And Mueller is supposidly a Republican, appointed by Republicans and confirmed by bi-partisan majorities in the Senate. He hired who he thought were the best people. This argument will work with THAT 1/3 of the population but that is it. Not surprising you'd say this, you're a hardcore partisan. The results of a new IBD/TIPP Poll suggest that many Americans are highly skeptical of both Mueller and the ongoing investigation into Russian meddling in last year's election. Mueller was named to be special counsel after President Trump fired FBI Director James Comey in May. Comey was investigating claims that Russia interfered in the U.S. election and that the Trump campaign may have colluded with Russian officials. Since then, Mueller himself has come under fire for hiring a number of prosecutors who donated to Hillary Clinton, which some see as a possible conflict of interest. Moreover, one of the prosecutors that Mueller added to his team, Andrew Rosenstein, previously worked for U.S. Attorney Preet Bharara, whom Trump also fired. And Mueller and Comey, his successor at the FBI, are known to be close friends. So, in the minds of many, the conflicts in the Mueller investigation are piling up, as the IBD/TIPP data clearly indicate. The IBD/TIPP Poll data were gathered June 23 to June 29. Perhaps most seriously, among the 614 polled who say they're following the Russia story closely, 49% say that Special Counsel Mueller's friendship with former FBI Director James Comey represents a "conflict of interest for Mueller's investigation." Some 47% disagreed. The results, no surprise here, skewed sharply according to party affiliation. A majority of Republicans (81%) and Independents (52%) said Mueller had a conflict of interest with his Comey friendship. Just 26% of Democrats agreed. Meanwhile, even more poll respondents — including a surprising number of Democrats — felt a conflict existed in the fact that Mueller had interviewed with the White House to replace former FBI chief Comey, who stands at the center of the investigation into Russia's alleged tampering with the 2016 vote and alleged collusion with the Trump campaign. Mueller was no stranger to the job, having held the post from 2001 to 2013, under both President Bush and President Obama. Based on that, it should be no surprise that the White House would want to interview him. But the IBD/TIPP Poll shows Americans seem bothered by this. Some 52% agreed that Mueller's job interview was a conflict of interest going forward for the investigation, while just 40% disagreed. No surprise that 70% of Republicans and 52% of Independents felt this was a problem. But 41% of Democrats also did. As for the charge that many of the lawyers hired by Mueller for his team were Hillary Clinton supporters, just 44% agreed that this was a "legitimate concern," while 52% disagreed. But again, Republicans (83%) and Independents (51%) were a majority thinking it was a concern. Just 13% of Democrats did. Strip away the listed R's and D's and your claim goes down the drain.
Tiberius Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 Mag, you are not a hard core partisan? Ok! Your poll proves nothing I love some of the other titles of polls from that site: "People like the Senate health care bill more than that realize!" "Trump's approval poised for a bounce!" IBD/TIPP Poll: Americans See Anti-Trump Media, 'Political Witch Hunt,' Pushing Russia InvestigationJune 07, 2017 Nearly half of Americans see the investigation into possible ties between the Trump campaign and Russia as a 'witch hunt,' says an IBD/TIPP Poll.
grinreaper Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 There is no solution to people being played on their biases. Not saying education is not important, but it won't create perfect citizens, where everyone is above average What's next, making everyone a 1%er? I don't know how you figure out how to put your shoes on in the morning.
Tiberius Posted July 21, 2017 Posted July 21, 2017 (edited) What's next, making everyone a 1%er? I don't know how you figure out how to put your shoes on in the morning. Yes, it is tough with a sore back to put on shoes in the morning. Thanks for making fun of my condition Edited July 21, 2017 by Tiberius
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