Worried About the Scout Vacancies- Big Hole!

[BringBackOrton]

 

So we brought back three of the guys we fired?

 

Exhibit A why Kirby and NoSaint were right, per usual.

[John from Riverside]

Exhibit A why Kirby and NoSaint were right, per usual.

I am not saying that they were even wrong.....but what exactly are you trying to say here?

[Heitz]

Exhibit A why Kirby and NoSaint were right, per usual.

 

Who's going to pay for my sore hands after all this wringing!?!

 

 

 

For real though, glad the plan is coming together.

[YoloinOhio]

/thread

[NoSaint]

 

So we brought back three of the guys we fired?

 

Glad they got guys they wanted. Hopefully the friend that went to Nashville, for instance, wasn't also wanted.

 

Again, not a HUGE issue but seemed pretty obvious the most effective process was not what we used.

 

(I have no opinion on these guys, just that I prefer beane choosing scouts over pegula or even McD... and there was no downside to just waiting for him to do that)

[BringBackOrton]

I am not saying that they were even wrong.....but what exactly are you trying to say here?

That they were right. I thought that obvious.

[jethro_tull]

They are making moves but so far no scouts from Carolina. It is critical that the Bills add some scouts that McD and the Beane have worked with before- that they know and can trust their judgement and whose recommendations have been solid first hand information.

[Augie]

They are making moves but so far no scouts from Carolina. It is critical that the Bills add some scouts that McD and the Beane have worked with before- that they know and can trust their judgement and whose recommendations have been solid first hand information.

 

Rex? Is that you?

 

[Kirby Jackson]

Glad they got guys they wanted. Hopefully the friend that went to Nashville, for instance, wasn't also wanted.

 

Again, not a HUGE issue but seemed pretty obvious the most effective process was not what we used.

 

(I have no opinion on these guys, just that I prefer beane choosing scouts over pegula or even McD... and there was no downside to just waiting for him to do that)

I'm just going to second the thoughts of my fellow New Orleanian. The Bills seem to be doing great. I wasn't concerned about specific people more about the process. It wasn't a huge deal but it wasn't done right either. I don't see it hurting them because the staff they've built so far is impressive. Hopefully it keeps moving forward...

[Augie]

I'm just going to second the thoughts of my fellow New Orleanian. The Bills seem to be doing great. I wasn't concerned about specific people more about the process. It wasn't a huge deal but it wasn't done right either. I don't see it hurting them because the staff they've built so far is impressive. Hopefully it keeps moving forward...

Nothing wrong with any of those previous thoughts. I was afraid we might lose some talent we might benefit by keeping. It appears we got at least most of what we really wanted. It also helps to give it a fresh new feel, even if it's some of the best old guys coming back. The end result is what counts, and I feel very good about that.

[YoloinOhio]

@dan_hatman

I keep hearing positivity about the 'All-Star teams' being assembled in the #Colts #49ers and #Bills front offices

 

I believe the way the #Bills staff is coming together may lead more owners to explore bigger May staffing changes.

 

Many went into scouting as it was 'more stable' than coaching, but that is quickly proving to no longer be the case.

 

These days, with the access to film. I keep sensing a shift from evaluators towards data collectors.

http://insidethepylon.com/nfl/front-office/2017/05/01/dan-hatmans-2017-nfl-scout-movement-tracker/

Edited May 21, 2017 by YoloinOhio

[NewEra]

They are making moves but so far no scouts from Carolina. It is critical that the Bills add some scouts that McD and the Beane have worked with before- that they know and can trust their judgement and whose recommendations have been solid first hand information.

And if we do sign some scouts that McD and Beane have worked with you'll find something else to cry about. The hires they made are being applauded around the league. They are hiring trusted NFL minds. They interviewed them and expressed what they desire then hired them. They trust their judgement or they wouldn't have been hired. This thread should be closed. There's nothing to talk about here. Beane is doing a fine job of filling the holes.

[jethro_tull]

@dan_hatman

I keep hearing positivity about the 'All-Star teams' being assembled in the #Colts #49ers and #Bills front offices

 

I believe the way the #Bills staff is coming together may lead more owners to explore bigger May staffing changes.

 

Many went into scouting as it was 'more stable' than coaching, but that is quickly proving to no longer be the case.

 

These days, with the access to film. I keep sensing a shift from evaluators towards data collectors.

http://insidethepylon.com/nfl/front-office/2017/05/01/dan-hatmans-2017-nfl-scout-movement-tracker/

Thanks for the link- it's good that scouting is coming under more scrutiny because it is the information that builds the foundation of a franchise. It's almost as if scouts should be rated with their own set of statistics and metrics- if it isn't already.

I don't disagree that it might be trending towards data collecting vs. gut level evaluation but where did you get that info?

And if we do sign some scouts that McD and Beane have worked with you'll find something else to cry about. The hires they made are being applauded around the league. They are hiring trusted NFL minds. They interviewed them and expressed what they desire then hired them. They trust their judgement or they wouldn't have been hired. This thread should be closed. There's nothing to talk about here. Beane is doing a fine job of filling the holes.

There isn't any "crying" going on here, just constructive observations. I want the team to turn the corner and become a season to season contender as quickly as possible.

If the Bills management does not have anyone in the scouting department that they have worked with in the past, that they can trust unconditionally, then there will be a learning curve between management and new scouts. Learning curves take time to overcome as the relationships build. It sets the team back a little bit.

Acquiring some scouts that they have worked with in the past is an important step IMHO.

Edited May 21, 2017 by jethro_tull

[YoloinOhio]

Thanks for the link- it's good that scouting is coming under more scrutiny because it is the information that builds the foundation of a franchise. It's almost as if scouts should be rated with their own set of statistics and metrics- if it isn't already.

I don't disagree that it might be trending towards data collecting vs. gut level evaluation but where did you get that info?

 

There isn't any "crying" going on here, just constructive observations. I want the team to turn the corner and become a season to season contender as quickly as possible.

If the Bills management does not have anyone in the scouting department that they have worked with in the past, that they can trust unconditionally, then there will be a learning curve between management and new scouts. Learning curves take time to overcome as the relationships build. It sets the team back a little bit.

Acquiring some scouts that they have worked with in the past is an important step IMHO.

Beane worked with Joe Schoen for 6 years and Marvin Allen for 7 years in Carolina

[jethro_tull]

Beane worked with Joe Schoen for 6 years and Marvin Allen for 7 years in Carolina

great, thanks for the info.

thread closed!

[John from Riverside]

That they were right. I thought that obvious.

OK but Kirby was raising serious concerns over losing scouts.....that we would have difficulty replacing with quality personnel because they were under contract.

 

This does not appear to be the case. Now we dont know what the results of this will be....but so far how were they right....they obviously had a plan.

[BringBackOrton]

OK but Kirby was raising serious concerns over losing scouts.....that we would have difficulty replacing with quality personnel because they were under contract.

 

This does not appear to be the case. Now we dont know what the results of this will be....but so far how were they right....they obviously had a plan.

I was referring to their other point.

 

Like they both said, you can arrive at a good result with a poor process. Why terminate contracts and risk losing guys before your new GM could decide he wants them back? It was a risk that had no reward. Whether or not it worked out was immaterial.

Edited May 21, 2017 by jmc12290

[Malazan]

OK but Kirby was raising serious concerns over losing scouts.....that we would have difficulty replacing with quality personnel because they were under contract.

 

This does not appear to be the case. Now we dont know what the results of this will be....but so far how were they right....they obviously had a plan.

 

Welcome to the new world where being wrong is somehow being right

[John from Riverside]

I'm just going to second the thoughts of my fellow New Orleanian. The Bills seem to be doing great. I wasn't concerned about specific people more about the process. It wasn't a huge deal but it wasn't done right either. I don't see it hurting them because the staff they've built so far is impressive. Hopefully it keeps moving forward...

Kirby,

 

Thanks! I was waiting for you to chime in on the stuff happening over the last week.

I was referring to their other point.

 

Like they both said, you can arrive at a good result with a poor process. Why terminate contracts and risk losing guys before your new GM could decide he wants them back? It was a risk that had no reward. Whether or not it worked out was immaterial.

Thank you for the clarification

 

It obviously could have gone very badly. I remember thinking to myself last weekend "they would not do this unless they had a plan"

 

That sounds too much like the past front offices would do.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

....cleaning house prior to Beane took care of the dirty work for him......at least he's not the "new sheriff/bad guy" riding into town.....and he was free to re-hire any of the 17 let go which I believe he has done with 3 so far...so what's the beef?.....