PFF: Tyrod Taylor #2 starting QB in AFCE

[GoBills808]

The second two have nothing to do with Tyrod. And yes, I suppose if a quarterback scores more touchdowns, his team will win more games. That's not exactly rocket science. But it's not very relevant either. The question is: when the year is over and you're evaluating your strengths and weaknesses as a team, do you try and improve your top ten offense or your bottom ten defense first? Which will have more of an impact?

Exactly how was the defense bottom ten?

[BillsFan17]

The apologist for McDermott are out already.

 

The tender must've been Whaley/Overdorf because it was a bad decision. Right.

We haven't made it through the off season and already the man needs "apologist?" In what capacity?

 

This is a bit of a stretch, no?

[BillsFan4]

How does Whaley getting released just hours after the draft not tell you McDermotts been making the moves the day he was hired???

I have to believe the tenders are on him. Not Whaley.

There is absolutely no proof that it was McDermott. I have not even heard anyone speculate that it was him, besides you.

He had been hired less than 2 months before Gillislee was tendered. You seem to be assuming that he was running everything inside OBD from the day he was hired, but I don't think that was the case at all. All the reports have said that his power has Slowly grown inside OBD. Plus, if you look at past RFA tenders, it fits Whaley and Overdorf's MO.

There's honestly no point in discussing this RFA tender any further though, I am clearly not going to change your mind and you are not going to change my mind unless you have some actual proof and not just your assumption that since Whaley was fired McDermott must have been making every decision...

 

 

And as far as the free agents, there's plenty of proof that was Whaley and Overdorf, as I mentioned in my last post, and you completely ignored and just went on with this RFA tender thing.

No idea.

Why say the tender wasn't McDermotts when it clearly was?

If it clearly was, you should have some proof then, right? Please post a link or any type of proof besides just your opinion.

Edited May 8, 2017 by BillsFan4

[Crusher]

If your offense averages 24 points and your defense averages 23 points (which everyone seems to forget) and you're STILL 7-9, then maybe you DO have to look at your quarterback. You know, for those close games and all. Not like he's the most important player on the team or anything.

Another thing they seem to forget is that alot of those points came in decisive wins. Wins where the defense was stellar. 14 PPG in the team's seven wins.

 

The defense struggled against some of the better offenses, no doubt. They still made plays in nearly every one of those games to give the offense a chance, only to have Taylor come up short.

[John from Riverside]

Another thing they seem to forget is that alot of those points came in decisive wins. Wins where the defense was stellar. 14 PPG in the team's seven wins.

 

The defense struggled against some of the better offenses, no doubt. They still made plays in nearly every one of those games to give the offense a chance, only to have Taylor come up short.

Crusade

Crusade

Crusade

 

So miami had a great offense huh?.....the jets?

 

ok

[NewMexBills]

TyGoD TyGoD !! Time we get behind him, he knows its his make or break year. If relatively healthy & Boy-Toy-Mcoy reproducing similar upper 90% of last year or 115% better<17''...Then watch out 11-5 Team vs Brudy Bunch injury riddled team.

[transplantbillsfan]

Warned?

 

Sorry...I have received absolutely no warnings for anything here. You must have me mistaken for the posters that can't control themselves when discussing certain topics with me...JM2009 has been warned here for his conduct, though.

 

You chastised me for giving someone back the treatment they gave me...funny how that goes. It's ok because that poster agrees with you on Taylor.

 

It's fine to disagree and have discussion. I've always maintained a level of respect here until someone decides to respond inappropriately.

 

These posters that hate me and have an issue with my take on Taylor have demonstrated time and time again that they are the ones that can't behave and have discussion. Again...I have not received, nor do I deserve any type of warnings here.

 

My take has simply been that Taylor is not good enough. I have been fine with him as the stopgap for this season, as the pickings were slim, and McDermott didn't want to have this team starting from square one. My issue was the money he was due, and the fact that his play didn't warrant that previous deal. He also doesn't deserve the job security. The Bills agreed with me and took both away from him. Now it's do or die for Taylor as a Bill, and I'm fine with sorting that out in a throw away year for this staff.

 

I'm certainly not always negative. There are a number of things I'm positive about with this team. Taylor, however is not one of them.

 

Carry on with whatever it is you like to do here, but please don't portray me as a deviant here on this board. It's actually completely untrue, and it's stuff like that that gets posters in trouble.

 

Consider this a friendly reminder, friend.

 

Get off your high horse Crusher, no one has demonstrated more excitement to absolutely thrash the opposing side of the Taylor argument than you.

 

Sometimes it's downright scary.

 

I'm all about civil and rational disagreement. Sometimes you're able to do that. But then Mr. Hyde comes out of you and you get all giddy at just the prospect of being able to bash other posters in the future.

 

Stop pretending you're a martyr. You're not. You're part of the problem, not the solution.

The apologist for McDermott are out already.

 

The tender must've been Whaley/Overdorf because it was a bad decision. Right.

 

Good GAWD this is just ridiculous!!!

 

People gotta hate...

There is absolutely no proof that it was McDermott. I have not even heard anyone speculate that it was him, besides you.

He had been hired less than 2 months before Gillislee was tendered. You seem to be assuming that he was running everything inside OBD from the day he was hired, but I don't think that was the case at all. All the reports have said that his power has Slowly grown inside OBD. Plus, if you look at past RFA tenders, it fits Whaley and Overdorf's MO.

There's honestly no point in discussing this RFA tender any further though, I am clearly not going to change your mind and you are not going to change my mind unless you have some actual proof and not just your assumption that since Whaley was fired McDermott must have been making every decision...

 

 

And as far as the free agents, there's plenty of proof that was Whaley and Overdorf, as I mentioned in my last post, and you completely ignored and just went on with this RFA tender thing.

 

If it clearly was, you should have some proof then, right? Please post a link or any type of proof besides just your opinion.

 

Here's an article on all of this.

https://theringer.com/nfl-buffalo-bills-gm-doug-whaley-fired-sean-mcdermott-d87e027bae86-d87e027bae86

There's no absolute proof of anything, but it's a very flimsy argument based on everything that happened to assume that Whaley was running the show.

 

It seems pretty clear this has been McDermott's show since he took over, even if there's no absolute proof.

[Crusher]

 

Get off your high horse Crusher, no one has demonstrated more excitement to absolutely thrash the opposing side of the Taylor argument than you.

 

Sometimes it's downright scary.

 

I'm all about civil and rational disagreement. Sometimes you're able to do that. But then Mr. Hyde comes out of you and you get all giddy at just the prospect of being able to bash other posters in the future.

 

Stop pretending you're a martyr. You're not. You're part of the problem, not the solution.

 

 

Good GAWD this is just ridiculous!!!

 

People gotta hate...

So it's ok to be the over the top Tyrod worshipper, but someone who thinks the opposite is downright scary?

 

Ridiculous is right. So is the fact that you seem to place yourself above the fray when you are as guilty of being on a high horse and insulting posters as anyone. Matter of fact...you had the nerve to tell me to stop posting.

 

Every time you post about me, I feel like the exact same can be said for yourself. If it wasn't for you and these silly Tyrod is good threads, this place would be much more sane.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

i cant freaking believe anyone would pin anything from that game on taylor. what the hell more do you want from the guy there? he plays out of his mind in that game as whole. drives down for the go ahead score with less than a minute left. then put together a good drive in OT before an absurd reverse to bush ruins it and then the kicker misses the kick......... and somehow you find something to b*tch about there. YIKES.

 

btw. i agree taylor left plays on the table all season long and it may have cost us..... but on the season as whole one unit did their jobs way better than the other.

 

 

i just cant believe anyone would try and use that 2nd miami game as an argument against him. thats absurd to me.

Are you and jm2009 related?

 

How many opportunities did the Bills offense have to end that game?

At least 2. The truth of it = they only needed ONE and that was a TD on the opening drive. You can't blame the defense if the O gets the ball to start OT.

[John from Riverside]

Are you and jm2009 related?

 

How many opportunities did the Bills offense have to end that game?

At least 2. The truth of it = they only needed ONE and that was a TD on the opening drive. You can't blame the defense if the O gets the ball to start OT.

Uh.....they did end it....a few times

 

Our defense kept opening the door back up.

 

You cant blame the offense when they score THAT MANY points in a game.....and the defense just lets them come right back....at some point you HAVE to put the blame where it is really due.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

The second two have nothing to do with Tyrod. And yes, I suppose if a quarterback scores more touchdowns, his team will win more games. That's not exactly rocket science. But it's not very relevant either. The question is: when the year is over and you're evaluating your strengths and weaknesses as a team, do you try and improve your top ten offense or your bottom ten defense first? Which will have more of an impact?

Bottom 10 Defense? I should stop right there. See prior post WRT the "bad defense" that had nothign to do with the opening drive in OT.

 

Taylor runs the offense. I only ask for this QB to Close Out the Game with a TD drive.

[PromoTheRobot]

Are you and jm2009 related?

 

How many opportunities did the Bills offense have to end that game?

At least 2. The truth of it = they only needed ONE and that was a TD on the opening drive. You can't blame the defense if the O gets the ball to start OT.

 

That's situational. That's like saying a defense gives up a TD every drive. Your offense answers every time. The game is tied then in overtime your offense fails to score, and your defense let's the opponent score again. While it's true the offense could have ended the game, the fact your defense didn't stop the opponent once doesn't shift blame off them.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

Uh.....they did end it....a few times

 

Our defense kept opening the door back up.

 

You cant blame the offense when they score THAT MANY points in a game.....and the defense just lets them come right back....at some point you HAVE to put the blame where it is really due.

In OT. Yes JfH I can. It really is that simple.

 

That's situational. That's like saying a defense gives up a TD every drive. Your offense answers every time. The game is tied then in overtime your offense fails to score, and your defense let's the opponent score again. While it's true the offense could have ended the game, the fact your defense didn't stop the opponent once doesn't shift blame off them.

I understand the Logic Promo, that doesn't mean you blame the defense for the lack of production of the offense.

And with that I'll move on.

[PromoTheRobot]

In OT. Yes JfH I can. It really is that simple.

I understand the Logic Promo, that doesn't mean you blame the defense for the lack of production of the offense.

And with that I'll move on.

 

I don't think you do. If your offense produces at an above average clip they are doing their job. If a defense can't put 11 players on the field in critical situations, they are not.

Edited May 8, 2017 by PromoTheRobot

[section122]

Exactly how was the defense bottom ten?

 

They finished 26th in DVOA which is an entire snapshot of the defensive performance and a great indicator of true success.

 

They had the 29th ranked run defense by yards

 

If you take out the game against the Brissett led Patriots their ppg moves to bottom 10

 

They gave up more than 24 points in 9 of 16 games

 

Are we really going to pretend that the Rex and Rob Ryan defense wasn't bad? It led to their firing even. I am surprised it is debatable and I would imagine if I went through a lot of the anti-TT group they would bemoan the defensive performance during the season.

 

I was going to respond to crusher but then I remembered not to feed the trolls...

Edited May 8, 2017 by section122

[Kirby Jackson]

In OT. Yes JfH I can. It really is that simple.

 

I understand the Logic Promo, that doesn't mean you blame the defense for the lack of production of the offense.

Why not worry about the last 1:20 of regulation? That was clearly where the blame lies (besides for the 10 guys in overtime). You gave up a big return and 6 plays to march into FG range. That's not on the offense. When you kickoff to a team with 1:20 to go, and they have no timeouts, you should win that game right there.

 

They finished 26th in DVOA which is an entire snapshot of the defensive performance and a great indicator of true success.

 

They had the 29th ranked run defense by yards

 

If you take out the game against the Brissett led Patriots their ppg moves to bottom 10

 

They gave up more than 24 points in 9 of 16 games

 

Are we really going to pretend that the Rex and Rob Ryan defense wasn't bad? It led to their firing even. I am surprised it is debatable and I would imagine if I went through a lot of the anti-TT group they would bemoan the defensive performance during the season.

 

 

I was going to respond to crusher but then I remembered not to feed the trolls...

Actually 28th in DVOA defense http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamdef

 

To take it a step further the Bills lost 6 games when they scored at least 24 points!! The rest of the AFC playoff teams combined lost 4 such games. That's the defense people.

Edited May 8, 2017 by Kirby Jackson

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

Kirby, - It seems that you missed my last comment

 

And with that I'll move on.

 

I'd rather not get into the back and forth with numerous people and go on a "crusade" (seems to be the new meme in threads).

 

I've seen Buffalo's Defense shredded a couple of times before and the Team still came out with a W.

 

Add in an effective passing game and then we'll discuss this further. Peace Out

[GoBills808]

 

They finished 26th in DVOA which is an entire snapshot of the defensive performance and a great indicator of true success.

 

They had the 29th ranked run defense by yards

 

If you take out the game against the Brissett led Patriots their ppg moves to bottom 10

 

They gave up more than 24 points in 9 of 16 games

 

Why DVOA? Because it's the one stat that happens to fit your argument? Can you tell me exactly how it's calculated (answer is no, because it's proprietary and wholly reliant on subjective analysis)?

 

Why look at run defense by yards? I though total yards was a bad way of evaluating a unit?

 

Why take out games? That seems...well, dumb.

 

Why qualify their PPG average, which was 23.something and good for 16th. Bang on average.

[John from Riverside]

Kirby, - It seems that you missed my last comment

 

And with that I'll move on.

 

I'd rather not get into the back and forth with numerous people and go on a "crusade" (seems to be the new meme in threads).

 

I've seen Buffalo's Defense shredded a couple of times before and the Team still came out with a W.

 

Add in an effective passing game and then we'll discuss this further. Peace Out

It just seems like you dont want to blame the defense and the offense should be able to overcome it.

 

Thats not how it works....(and with that ill leave it alone to)

Why DVOA? Because it's the one stat that happens to fit your argument? Can you tell me exactly how it's calculated (answer is no, because it's proprietary and wholly reliant on subjective analysis)?

 

Why look at run defense by yards? I though total yards was a bad way of evaluating a unit?

 

Why take out games? That seems...well, dumb.

 

Why qualify their PPG average, which was 23.something and good for 16th. Bang on average.

because WE HAD A TOP FIVE DEFENSE

[Kirby Jackson]

Kirby, - It seems that you missed my last comment

 

And with that I'll move on.

 

I'd rather not get into the back and forth with numerous people and go on a "crusade" (seems to be the new meme in threads).

 

I've seen Buffalo's Defense shredded a couple of times before and the Team still came out with a W.

 

Add in an effective passing game and then we'll discuss this further. Peace Out

I guess I don't (and will) not understand forgiving the defense (who was cleary worse) while holding the offense accountable? If the AFC playoff teams combined to lose 4 games while scoring 24 points and the Bills lost 6 such games, logic would say that is cleary the defense's fault. When teams exceed 24 points they almost always win, except the Bills.