SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted June 6, 2017 Posted June 6, 2017 (edited) Not Swahili, must be something else. Enable Translation macro - because it deserves a negative "tone" We need a QB that "has a few bad games", more than we need a QB who" has a few great games". What? Who's saying this? My bad. I apologize. I go t my syntax backwards. Damn Translation macro!!! Edited June 6, 2017 by ShadyBillsFan
transplantbillsfan Posted June 7, 2017 Author Posted June 7, 2017 A couple tweets from Fahey yesterday in response to the Maclin pursuit: Taylor is recruiting Jeremy Maclin. 3.34% of Taylor's yards were created by receivers on off-target throws last year, 26th in league. Taylor's yards per attempt jumped 0.74 when adjusted for WR mistakes/created plays, third highest in league
Foxx Posted June 13, 2017 Posted June 13, 2017 (edited) since the Maclin thread was closed... So now we are making decisions on when it does or doesnt mean anything for pro bowl to fit narrative? It either does or it doesnt honestly, you think getting in as the third or fourth alternate is the same as being elected first or second string? come on, your better than that John. Edited June 13, 2017 by Foxx
John from Riverside Posted June 13, 2017 Posted June 13, 2017 since the Maclin thread was closed... honestly, you think getting in as the third or fourth alternate is the same as being elected first or second string? come on, your better than that John. Selection to the pro bowl is selection to the pro bowl It either means something or it does not....there is no in between by the way....when discussing the whole safety thing I am not saying that the ravens one has been a great safety...... He has Hyde....up and comer....young....versitile vs all pro safety who is getting on in years Every year is a new year......and Hyde might fit this system perfectly......while older players just continue to get older
Foxx Posted June 13, 2017 Posted June 13, 2017 (edited) Selection to the pro bowl is selection to the pro bowl It either means something or it does not....there is no in between .... so, a watered down version is the same as all the first and second stringers showing up...... gotcha. come on... John! quit barking up the wrong tree, you know your wrong here, just admit it. hell, no one is right all the time. Edited June 13, 2017 by Foxx
Shaw66 Posted June 13, 2017 Posted June 13, 2017 (edited) A couple tweets from Fahey yesterday in response to the Maclin pursuit: Taylor is recruiting Jeremy Maclin. 3.34% of Taylor's yards were created by receivers on off-target throws last year, 26th in league. Taylor's yards per attempt jumped 0.74 when adjusted for WR mistakes/created plays, third highest in league Since this thread is about Fahey and his stats, I'm going to say again that I take all this stuff with a grain of salt. Fahey is too young and uncredentialed for me to take him seriously. I mean, why in the world should I trust a stat he created that predicts what Taylor's yards per attempt would be if adjusted for wide receiver mistakes? That's a highly subjective and speculative stat, and I'm not inclined to put much stock in it until Fahey is a recognized expert. Fahey is a guy creating content for sale. He's built himself a little niche by taking deep dives into stats, and he produces interesting stuff, interesting in that people like to read it and it helps Football Outsiders and others fill their pages with content. It doesn't mean it's right or insightful or anything. Look up Bill James. He self-published his football stats for years, in virtual anonymity. He was nearly 40 before Billy Bean and Theo Epstein actually started using that data, that is, it took 15 years before people began to see that James's work had validity. And I have no doubt that James was just one of dozens of people out there concocting theories about and manipulating data to try to give greater insight into the game. I don't see any coaches or GMs quoting Fahey data to justify decisions about their QBs. If they aren't quoting him and using his stats, that means they don't think those stats are meaningful or helpful in the pursuit of quarterbacking excellence. If coaches and GMs don't think what Fahey is doing is useful, why should I? Is the recipes thread or did I make a wrong turn Wrong turn. This thread is much less interesting, but it's all we're left with for a few weeks. (Unless, in a cost cutting move, the Packers release Aaron Rodgers. THAT would make the Maclin thread look like a coffee break.) By the way, how do you like your coffee? Edited June 14, 2017 by Shaw66
BringBackOrton Posted June 13, 2017 Posted June 13, 2017 Selection to the pro bowl is selection to the pro bowl It either means something or it does not....there is no in between by the way....when discussing the whole safety thing I am not saying that the ravens one has been a great safety...... He has Hyde....up and comer....young....versitile vs all pro safety who is getting on in years Every year is a new year......and Hyde might fit this system perfectly......while older players just continue to get older John, he was a 5 time All-Pro. For your frame of reference, Mario Williams was only a 3 time All-Pro. Trying to make this about TT's ProBowls is a losing proposition at best.
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 ...does TT possess the required gray matter to process/read the entire field in the scant 5 seconds allowed or not, to make this club's passing game a viable and dependable threat?...yes...or...no..?..
John from Riverside Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 so, a watered down version is the same as all the first and second stringers showing up...... gotcha. come on... John! quit barking up the wrong tree, you know your wrong here, just admit it. hell, no one is right all the time. I have stopped talking about the Pro Bowl as a thing since there are some that feel it is not a thing if it fits their narrative. Now the all pro selections? Thats a thing I fully admit that..... John, he was a 5 time All-Pro. For your frame of reference, Mario Williams was only a 3 time All-Pro. Trying to make this about TT's ProBowls is a losing proposition at best. I am actually not.....I am trying to stay away from the pro bowl talk all together.... For that matter.....I wasnt even talking about TT....someone else started that....it was comparing safeties with the ravens but of course...everything gets turned to a Tyrod Taylor discussion for christ sake a MOD CLOSED THE THREAD.....and fox decided to throw it into another thread in a attempt to keep a TT discussion going
Shaw66 Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 ...does TT possess the required gray matter to process/read the entire field in the scant 5 seconds allowed or not, to make this club's passing game a viable and dependable threat?...yes...or...no..?.. I think he does, but that of course is one of the important questions for Taylor and about 20 other starting quarterbacks in the league. QBs like Flacco, Eli, Carson Wentz, Carson Palmer, Andy Dalton, Marcus Mariota, etc.
Foxx Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 I have stopped talking about the Pro Bowl as a thing since there are some that feel it is not a thing if it fits their narrative. Now the all pro selections? Thats a thing I fully admit that..... I am actually not.....I am trying to stay away from the pro bowl talk all together.... For that matter.....I wasnt even talking about TT....someone else started that....it was comparing safeties with the ravens but of course...everything gets turned to a Tyrod Taylor discussion for christ sake a MOD CLOSED THE THREAD.....and fox decided to throw it into another thread in a attempt to keep a TT discussion going and now there is a moment of silence for that thread. ....
Crusher Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 Since this thread is about Fahey and his stats, I'm going to say again that I take all this stuff with a grain of salt. Fahey is too young and uncredentialed for me to take him seriously. I mean, why in the world should I trust a stat he created that predicts what Taylor's yards per attempt would be if adjusted for wide receiver mistakes? That's a highly subjective and speculative stat, and I'm not inclined to put much stock in it until Fahey is a recognized expert. Fahey is a guy creating content for sale. He's built himself a little niche by taking deep dives into stats, and he produces interesting stuff, interesting in that people like to read it and it helps Football Outsiders and others fill their pages with content. It doesn't mean it's right or insightful or anything. Look up Bill James. He self-published his football stats for years, in virtual anonymity. He was nearly 40 before Billy Bean and Theo Epstein actually started using that data, that is, it took 15 years before people began to see that James's work had validity. And I have no doubt that James was just one of dozens of people out there concocting theories about and manipulating data to try to give greater insight into the game. I don't see any coaches or GMs quoting Fahey data to justify decisions about their QBs. If they aren't quoting him and using his stats, that means they don't think those stats are meaningful or helpful in the pursuit of quarterbacking excellence. If coaches and GMs don't think what Fahey is doing is useful, why should I? Wrong turn. This thread is much less interesting, but it's all we're left with for a few weeks. (Unless, in a cost cutting move, the Packers release Aaron Rodgers. THAT would make the Maclin thread look like a coffee break.) By the way, how do you like your coffee? The OP wouldn't even mention this guy if he didn't have it hard for TT...FACT. ...does TT possess the required gray matter to process/read the entire field in the scant 5 seconds allowed or not, to make this club's passing game a viable and dependable threat?...yes...or...no..?.. All indications say he doesn't have it...he's a physical talent, haven't seen much or heard much that speaks to his football IQ and feel for the position. I have no issues with those who still hold out hope, but that's all it is, and it's based on blind faith.
transplantbillsfan Posted June 14, 2017 Author Posted June 14, 2017 since the Maclin thread was closed... honestly, you think getting in as the third or fourth alternate is the same as being elected first or second string? come on, your better than that John. Since the Maclin thread was closed... what exactly...? The fact that you're rebooting this thread and this conversation is making me chuckle a bit...
transplantbillsfan Posted June 14, 2017 Author Posted June 14, 2017 Since this thread is about Fahey and his stats, I'm going to say again that I take all this stuff with a grain of salt. Fahey is too young and uncredentialed for me to take him seriously. I mean, why in the world should I trust a stat he created that predicts what Taylor's yards per attempt would be if adjusted for wide receiver mistakes? That's a highly subjective and speculative stat, and I'm not inclined to put much stock in it until Fahey is a recognized expert. Fahey is a guy creating content for sale. He's built himself a little niche by taking deep dives into stats, and he produces interesting stuff, interesting in that people like to read it and it helps Football Outsiders and others fill their pages with content. It doesn't mean it's right or insightful or anything. Look up Bill James. He self-published his football stats for years, in virtual anonymity. He was nearly 40 before Billy Bean and Theo Epstein actually started using that data, that is, it took 15 years before people began to see that James's work had validity. And I have no doubt that James was just one of dozens of people out there concocting theories about and manipulating data to try to give greater insight into the game. I don't see any coaches or GMs quoting Fahey data to justify decisions about their QBs. If they aren't quoting him and using his stats, that means they don't think those stats are meaningful or helpful in the pursuit of quarterbacking excellence. If coaches and GMs don't think what Fahey is doing is useful, why should I? Kinda interesting here that you're ultimately saying validity is more about perception than reality. I disagree with you there, but I get what you're saying. And why should you trust a stat he's created? You shouldn't 100%. Take it with your grain of salt. However, he put in the time I'm not about to put in by watching and breaking down every single NFL QB through his own subjective measures that he explains pretty thoughtfully and really makes an effort (albeit subjectively and therefore imprecisely) to quantify aspects of QB play while considering all the external factors. It's meaningful to a degree because with whatever "cherry-picking" he might be doing, he's doing it across the board for all QBs.
DirtDart Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 First, the caveat : I'm sure the majority of people skeptical about Mr. Taylor aren't bizarrely weird, just the most vocal ones here. That out the way, what a spectacle! Transplant says TT would be a fine QB if he could play consistently at the level of the Seattle and (2nd) Miami game. Now, the obviousness of this is so obvious it's obvious, but any formulation finding Taylor the slightest bit above a "running back who can throw" is a red flag to very bull-head people. So they respond with posts saying it's not enuff for Taylor to play with consistency, he has to play with consistency. Transplant is horribly wrong to bring up the issue of consistency, because the real problem is consistency. The thing that would make Taylor a real QB isn't consistency (that fool Transplant !!!), but consistency..... Me? I think the problem is consistency, so clearly I disagree with everyone - right? Of course that is the issue. There have been zillions of posts from people trying to define some a priori element of Taylor cooked into his genetics which disqualify him as a quarterback. He can't throw over the middle. He can't see the field. He can't process decisions. My favorite is the "throw with anticipation" bromide, which is a testament to the mass hypnotic effect of sports clichés. It would be a wonderful thing to chart the frequency of usage of this trait as defining QB skill, both before & after it became the go-to Tyrod insult. A thousand-fold increase maybe? But whatever weaknesses there are in Taylor's game, he has very frequently played at a high level. In fact, if you look at his Bill's career exclusively when he plays with a legitimate Number One & Two receiver, he's looked pretty solid. He can make the throws. He can be a playmaker. He can even improve. Even minus those final Ws, I thought he looked much more clutch the second half of last year. Red zone offense got significantly better. Third down conversions improved. It's all down to consistency. That will define his ceiling and we should see in '17. Now : Carry on with your argument whether it's consistency or consistency. Enquiring minds want to know! well, for consistency sake, I could make those throws with a stud #1/2. The problem is he can't put the team on his back and win when it counts. The very good QBs do. That is my argument, everyone can post the fancy stats to rebuke my take, but the eyes don't lie.
transplantbillsfan Posted June 14, 2017 Author Posted June 14, 2017 The OP wouldn't even mention this guy if he didn't have it hard for TT...FACT. You are a sad little man...
transplantbillsfan Posted June 14, 2017 Author Posted June 14, 2017 All indications say he doesn't have it...he's a physical talent, haven't seen much or heard much that speaks to his football IQ and feel for the position. I have no issues with those who still hold out hope, but that's all it is, and it's based on blind faith. There's a disturbing trend in these types of posts from you that might point to something more about you (and you wouldn't be alone) than Taylor. It's subtle, and not a road a football message board should go down... but it's still part of the dark underbelly of the most important position in today's NFL... well, for consistency sake, I could make those throws with a stud #1/2. The problem is he can't put the team on his back and win when it counts. The very good QBs do. That is my argument, everyone can post the fancy stats to rebuke my take, but the eyes don't lie. Do your eyes tell you Aaron Rodgers is a very good QB? He's 2-39 in his career in executing 4th quarter comebacks against winning NFL teams... but he sucks...?
DirtDart Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 There's a disturbing trend in these types of posts from you that might point to something more about you (and you wouldn't be alone) than Taylor. It's subtle, and not a road a football message board should go down... but it's still part of the dark underbelly of the most important position in today's NFL... Do your eyes tell you Aaron Rodgers is a very good QB? He's 2-39 in his career in executing 4th quarter comebacks against winning NFL teams... but he sucks...? Are you really comparing the two? Lol....
John from Riverside Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 Are you really comparing the two? Lol.... A point of order sir It is not the "very good" qbs that do this......it is the "elite" qbs that put teams on their back and win....very few actually do it
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