Gordio Posted May 2, 2017 Posted May 2, 2017 Except they weren't there for 17 years, and to your point some are obviously better than others. The Bills received high draft grades all over so surely EVERYONE can't be bad at evaluating talent? I just feel for people that have to change their life because of it. They need the jobs a lot more than a fired coach or player. That's the point. Kirby just stop, when you miss on as many picks as the Bills have over the past 2 decades someone is going to pay. It wasn't just the scouts, Whaley loss his job, RR & his coaching staff loss their job. This is a high risk high turnover industry. It is also a result oriented industry. Based on the results of the team over the past 17 years, my only conclusion is these scouts were not very good at their job. I once read, that the scouts our the foundation of the franchise. Meaning there work is very important. If anyone of us performed as poorly at our job as these scouts that were let go have in theirs, we would of been let go 10 years ago. Is it something to celebrate, obviously not. I am never happy to hear that someone loss their job. But it was necessary.
Kirby Jackson Posted May 2, 2017 Posted May 2, 2017 And you weren't happy when Wade, Williams, Jauron, Gailey, and Ryan were fired? Come on. . .they are good people. They have to tell their spouses they no longer had jobs. How about players that get cut? I didn't see any weeping when Mario Williams, Mike Williams, JP Losman, Trent Edwards, Rob Johnson, etc. . .got cut from this team? People were celebrating those "firings." Come on. . .save the lamentations for the ignorant. Read the rest of the post. I feel for them too but I fell more for a guy making $60k losing his job than a guy with a $4m severance. Their life is infinitely worse off.
Bill_with_it Posted May 2, 2017 Posted May 2, 2017 Read the rest of the post. I feel for them too but I fell more for a guy making $60k losing his job than a guy with a $4m severance. Their life is infinitely worse off.Did anyoneask any of these scouts if the Pegulas are taking care of them fiscally? Or are we jus making assumptions. The Pegulas arent afraid of giving away free money.
Kirby Jackson Posted May 2, 2017 Posted May 2, 2017 Did anyoneask any of these scouts if the Pegulas are taking care of them fiscally? Or are we jus making assumptions. The Pegulas arent afraid of giving away free money.They probably are. I don't know that for sure. Kirby just stop, when you miss on as many picks as the Bills have over the past 2 decades someone is going to pay. It wasn't just the scouts, Whaley loss his job, RR & his coaching staff loss their job. This is a high risk high turnover industry. It is also a result oriented industry. Based on the results of the team over the past 17 years, my only conclusion is these scouts were not very good at their job. I once read, that the scouts our the foundation of the franchise. Meaning there work is very important. If anyone of us performed as poorly at our job as these scouts that were let go have in theirs, we would of been let go 10 years ago. Is it something to celebrate, obviously not. I am never happy to hear that someone loss their job. But it was necessary. Tell me where I said no one should be fired? My issue was never with people getting fired. My issue was when someone responded "good."
KellyToughII Posted May 2, 2017 Posted May 2, 2017 Read the rest of the post. I feel for them too but I fell more for a guy making $60k losing his job than a guy with a $4m severance. Their life is infinitely worse off. Here is the deal, no one here's boss is going to let them fail for 17 years and keep them on. They have failed at their job repeatedly, it was past time for an entire house cleaning. People lose jobs all the time and it sucks, but they did it to themselves. Now IF any of them were ignored and can prove it, that they were good, they will find another job. But this Organization needed a culture change and a complete blow out of the scouting staff for a long time.
JohnC Posted May 2, 2017 Posted May 2, 2017 Read the rest of the post. I feel for them too but I fell more for a guy making $60k losing his job than a guy with a $4m severance. Their life is infinitely worse off. I understand your empathetic sentiments toward the scouts who do the grunt work and aren't lavishly paid. That's a testimony to your good heart. But when you choose a vocation where moving is a probable aspect of the job then don't complain when the inevitable happens. If a person is a traveling salesman I don't want to hear complaints how flying is such a stressful chore and the toll it takes on family life. Where is the surprise? Position and assistant coaches in the pro and college ranks are often on one year tenders. It tends to be a vagabond lifestyle. There is no secret to what you are getting into prior to getting into the field. As for most jobs the perceived glamour of the job to outsiders is in reality what it is for most jobs a lot of hard work with unavoidable repercussions on the family.
billsfan_34 Posted May 2, 2017 Posted May 2, 2017 I usually try not to be overly sensitive here but this is beyond appalling. I know many of these people and they have wives and kids. They are good people. It's part of the business but to celebrate them losing their jobs is disgusting. These are guys that have to go home and tell their spouses that they no longer have a job. They aren't rich by any means and did their best to improve the team. There were hits and there were misses. It is a part of the business but an awful part (not one to be celebrated). Stay classy I dont think many are celebrating- I always feel bad when people lose their jobs. I am sure many are good people but at the end of the day performanc/results is what trumps all just like in any other business. This team has been in the trash heap for too long and it was time to make huge changes. Hopefully the scouts land somewhere else.
YoloinOhio Posted May 2, 2017 Posted May 2, 2017 Grain of salt here as always with twitter but this guy seems to have inside info after following him for a while @vicious155 Once a new GM is in place the #Bills will either relieve Jim Overdorf of his Duties or phase him out much like Scott Berchtold
ndirish1978 Posted May 2, 2017 Posted May 2, 2017 (edited) I usually try not to be overly sensitive here but this is beyond appalling. I know many of these people and they have wives and kids. They are good people. It's part of the business but to celebrate them losing their jobs is disgusting. These are guys that have to go home and tell their spouses that they no longer have a job. They aren't rich by any means and did their best to improve the team. There were hits and there were misses. It is a part of the business but an awful part (not one to be celebrated). Stay classy Agreed. They did their jobs and there is no way to pin draft failures of the actual decision-makers on the scouts themselves. Kirby, 17 years more misses than hits. If they worked normal jobs, they would have been fired long ago This is a fairly ignorant statement. The scouts do not make picks, the GMs do. Though considering your posting history I shouldn't be surprised that you would be one of the first to celebrate during a somber moment for several people around here. Edited May 2, 2017 by ndirish1978
JM2009 Posted May 2, 2017 Author Posted May 2, 2017 Grain of salt here as always with twitter but this guy seems to have inside info after following him for a while @vicious155 Once a new GM is in place the #Bills will either relieve Jim Overdorf of his Duties or phase him out much like Scott Berchtold As it should be.
ddaryl Posted May 2, 2017 Posted May 2, 2017 Buddy Nix was still on staff? Weird He agreed to advise from his home but was never in regarding decision makings. Basically he was a paid armchair QB for the Scouting dept
Joe Miner Posted May 2, 2017 Posted May 2, 2017 He agreed to advise from his home but was never in regarding decision makings. Basically he was a paid armchair QB for the Scouting dept He had a problem with the 'pants must always be worn in the workplace' policy at OBD.
Saxum Posted May 2, 2017 Posted May 2, 2017 that's how it is. It really doesn't matter that the pro personnel side was good. They are Whaley's guys and worked according to his vision, and may have loyalty toward him. You have to clear out everyone. Keeping holdovers from a previous regime Can lead to those leaks you see from JLC if they are pissed DW got fired. They are going in a different direction when it comes to a team building vision. Also I highly doubt we see any more leaks to JLC. Leroi is still there emptying wastebaskets where is where LaConjecture got most of his inside info,
liverpoolkev Posted May 2, 2017 Posted May 2, 2017 Kirby: ...sadly I'd bet many of these folks were loyal RW era holdovers who felt firmly entrenched in the jobs.....at the same time, look at the vitriol here about organizational dysfunction in the media for how long?..think these folks were proud to say where they worked?....so they hung on as long as they could hoping the public perception would change whereby they could proudly say once again, "I work for the Buffalo Bills".....even after the major housecleaning, do those that remain know if and when they can say proudly, "I work for the Buffalo Bills".....uncertainty sucks but stay tuned............ yet the person who has been doing the Bills contracts since ralph is still there along with Littman ; Russ is so good now he is conducting the Sabres GM search.... I guess you might as well get practice at the kids table before you look at the adult table
Kirby Jackson Posted May 2, 2017 Posted May 2, 2017 (edited) Here is the deal, no one here's boss is going to let them fail for 17 years and keep them on. They have failed at their job repeatedly, it was past time for an entire house cleaning. People lose jobs all the time and it sucks, but they did it to themselves. Now IF any of them were ignored and can prove it, that they were good, they will find another job. But this Organization needed a culture change and a complete blow out of the scouting staff for a long time. Except they haven't been there for 17 years so we need to stop saying that. They have guys that were in high school 17 years ago. Let's not use 17 years, because I am not sure one of those guys goes back that far. I don't disagree with some turnover. It is certainly a results business and they've had some failures. Firing everyone doesn't make any sense. The Bills have had crushed it on inexpensive vets over the last few years. The guys doing that (think they were under Hanrahan) should have been retained. The people coming to do that job will almost certainly do a worse job. They sent scrap heap free agents to the Pro Bowl the last few years: Incognito, Tyrod, Zach Brown & Lorax. No one is getting that type of production from guys like that. They should have been evaluating the staff all along, like they do with coaches and cut the bad and kept the good. I'm not sure where they think they will find an entire scouting staff now? Those guys have jobs. Edited May 2, 2017 by Kirby Jackson
Overseas Bills Fan Posted May 3, 2017 Posted May 3, 2017 It's not the same thing dude. Coaches and players get paid millions in salary. They can work a few years and be set for life if they are smart with their money. Some of the other guys in the office earn blue collar wages. That is the main difference. Kirby has worked there. So I am guessing he knows examples of the guys who got canned. Don't be a dick about it. But they are still people with families. Come on. . .taking what was said at face value, we should feel bad when an UDFA gets cut and "fired." I didn't see weeping when Da'rick Rodgers was cut and "fired." Or any cuts for people who aren't "brand name" athletes. Where is the sympathy for the UDFA or the low level assistant coach? I mean they have families too. Let's set up a thread crying about their firing. Won't happen, because those people are expected to perform. Well, so are scouts. They fail at their job. . .there's the door. Welcome to the NFL. It's the same in my field. The record or movie doesn't sell, the artist and producer are out on their butts. I don't see people crying when that happens. Not every singer is Beyonce, not every producer is Robert Evans, and not ever actor is Brad Pitt. Most I know are "making blue collar wages" as character actors in bit parts. I don't believe people deep down the roster make "millions of dollar."
GunnerBill Posted May 3, 2017 Posted May 3, 2017 Mike RodakVerified account @mikerodak 15m15 minutes agoMore Bills have fired 17 members of their scouting department, including Buddy Nix. Now only 2 personnel assistants listed on official website. Buddy Nix left any official role with the Bills after the 2014 season. Rodak needs a fact check.
BillsFan4 Posted May 3, 2017 Posted May 3, 2017 (edited) yet the person who has been doing the Bills contracts since ralph is still there along with Littman ; Russ is so good now he is conducting the Sabres GM search.... I guess you might as well get practice at the kids table before you look at the adult tableJeffrey Littman when the Bills were sold to Pegula. Him and Mary Owen left to run the Ralph Silson Foundation. I read somewhere that he actually got like 1% of the Bills sale price (but I'm not sure if thats true or not). Overdorf and Brandon are still there, though. I'd be pretty surprised if Overdorf kept his job once a new GM is hired, but we will see. I believe this is his 31st year with the Bills (I think he was hired in 1986). Russ Brandon is never going anywhere, it appears. Edited May 3, 2017 by BillsFan4
Kirby Jackson Posted May 3, 2017 Posted May 3, 2017 I don't believe people deep down the roster make "millions of dollar."League minimum in the NFL is $465k. My buddy was a depth guy / special teamer and managed t lick around for 7 years. He averaged about $650k a year between the 3 teams. That's $4.5M ish. He was the very definition of a guy way down the roster. I think that he started 1 game on defense. A $60k a year scout would need to work for 76 years to make that. So yes, I feel for him when he gets cut but it's not the same. He still has the restaurant that he owns, some property and great investments. That doesn't even include the MBA that he didn't pay a dime for.
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